Japan inches closer to major power status

[Asian.Century]

What Japan needs to do now is built strong, long lasting and strategic partnerships with Nuclear powers as especially Pakistan.

 

[IsaacNewton]

List is outdated.

China has 1 and India 2 Aircraft carriers.

List of countries with warships - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Probably most accurate list available.

 

[Aepsilons]

I know F-1 and i did not mention it at all, Japan did no serious research to develop comparative Aircraft to replace or develop similar type like F-4s and other US Aircrafts in 60's, 70's and frankly don't mind US restricted Japan and insisted upon buying their products almost most products are all under license with NOD to produce Number and not going beyond that but requiting US permissions. i know some products are joint research but most are purely licensed products. Does share costs keep the product cheap F-2 can't be produced above 80 because Japan considers it liability and expensive at $100m+ they even scrapped plans to replace and produce the aircrafts that were destroyed in typhoon due to costs.



Projecting power with 6-8 F-35s on Helicopter Carrier lol.

Yes, you are absolutely right about our failure to do joint research to develop comparative aircraft. The reason for this was because of our previous clause that limited R&D partnerships. This has been effectively removed this year (a wee bit overdue), but at least, we can expect a more qualitative product with our joint research with key partners. The cost of the F2 is rather high, and thus your point is understood. We have also about 100+ F15Js, in addition to the F2 fighter and other assets. Considering the fact that JSDF is based on defense , it is not necessary to produce or acquire an excessive amount. As it would be considered threatening to neighbors. Can we expect to increase our air assets post-2014? Yes, i believe so. Responsibly, i must add.

Projecting power with 6-8 F-35s on Helicopter Carrier lol.

The size of the Izumo Class is similar to the WASP class ship, which can hold up to 20 AV-8B Sea Harriers during maritime duties. There is no reason why JMSDF's 2 Izumo Class Light Carriers cannot hold a healthy milieu of 15-20 F-35s, in addition to Osprey V22s. As you probably know, we have purchased 17 V22s, part of the first batch.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I sense too much trolling on this thread.

Anyway, Japan is already a major power - It has the 3rd largest economy in the world. It doesn't need a carrier battle group (1 USN CBG cost more than all of Japan's destroyer combined) to be a major power.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Nimitz has catapult system so it can launch fighter jets. Izumo can only carry helicopters because it doesn't have the same sophisticated system. It will need a major redesign if it wants to be an aircarft carrier rather than a helicopter carrier.

Nonetheless, japan does not need an aircraft carrier because she does not need to project power all the way around the world. Her local air bases are enough.

A helicopter carrier has many advantages over a nuclear powered aircraft carrier.

Izumo cost 1.2 billion, while Ford class carrier cost 13 billion with an additional cost of a few hundred million each year to maintain the nuclear reactors. You can probably build 20 izumo for 1 ford.

A helicopter carrier is also good for disaster relief missions as it can carry a lot of troops and can takeoff helicopters for search and rescue missions.

But their right-wing fanboys are dreaming for their own nuclear supercarriers.

Abe is simply one of them.

 

[Aepsilons]

I sense too much trolling on this thread.

Anyway, Japan is already a major power - It has the 3rd largest economy in the world. It doesn't need a carrier battle group (1 USN CBG cost more than all of Japan's destroyer combined) to be a major power.

Japan wishes to develop our own CBG. In fact, the JS Izumo is part of the Esuko Kantai 1 (1st Escort Fleet), which is protected by 2 Atago Class destroyers, 2 Kongo class, 1 Shirane Class, and 2 Akizuki class and 4 Soryu class submarines. The Japanese CBG is centered on a light carrier, protected by a fast, powerful DDG force that has the capability to address surface and sub threats.

I know very well the size and capacities of USN's CBG , which is based and centered on a nuclear powered super carrier. Japan has no interest, currently, to have a super carrier. Supercarriers are for nations wishing to regularly intervene globally. That is the domain of the United States of America.

Abe is simply one of them.

You're now presuming too much. Abe has no wish for this. Japan Maritime Self Defense Force's fleet does not need a super carrier. We can do much with a CBG centered on light carriers.

 

[IsaacNewton]

But their right-wing fanboys are dreaming for their own nuclear supercarriers.

Abe is simply one of them.

I highly doubt Japan is planing a supercarrier. A 13 billion dollar carrier is useless without an airwing, so if you add in all the air crafts an equipment, it will cost a conservative estimate of 30 billion dollars. Also it will be too vulnerable to air and missile targets without at least 1 tico cruiser and 4 aegis destroyers (an extra 11 billion dollars) and 2 Virginia class submarines (5 billion) (total 46 billion).

This is not including the salary that you have to pay to the 10s of thousands of troops.

No navy in the world can afford a CBG except USA.

 

[Aepsilons]

I highly doubt Japan is planing a supercarrier. A 13 billion dollar carrier is useless without an airwing, so if you add in all the air crafts an equipment, it will cost a conservative estimate of 30 billion dollars. Also it will be too vulnerable to air and missile targets without at least 1 tico cruiser and 4 aegis destroyers (an extra 11 billion dollars) and 2 Virginia class submarines (5 billion) (total 46 billion).

This is not including the salary that you have to pay to the 10s of thousands of troops.

No navy in the world can afford a CBG except USA.

Well said.

 

[Kolaps]

A very misleading article.

Japan is not a world power, it's just a US slave country.

I don't understand why Japanese are so proud with it.


It's just for ASSISTING USA, not for the interest of Japan.

Prove me wrong!

 

[xunzi]

I like to categorize countries into class tier rather than superpower and world power status.

Tier 1: US, China, Russia
Tier 2: Britain, France, Germany, Japan, India
Tier 3: Turkey, South Korea, Indonesia, Brazil

US is an aggressive superpower that actively seek bases and sign military defense treaty. China is a passive superpower because we are non-interventionist and do not seek alliance. However we wield a lot of cloud in developing world. Remember the Philippines try to win a UN Committee seat and in behind door, we gather our political strength abroad to block it? Russia is a moderate superpower that can easily caused severe damage to the world if she wants to.. Both of these three have complete independent foreign policy and will not take anyone order but go after their self-interest without fearing repercussion. Japan cannot achieved this independence because of the fear for US's abandonment and repercussion. Japan is just a fake superpower. The article cite the Banana Republic and a plagiarist editor as proof is not the way to go. LOL

 

[Aepsilons]

@xunzi my very good friend and his usual antics. My friend, not once did we consider ourselves a super power.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I like to categorize countries into class tier rather than superpower and world power status.

Tier 1: US, China, Russia
Tier 2: Britain, France, Germany, Japan, India
Tier 3: Turkey, South Korea, Indonesia, Brazil

US is an aggressive superpower that actively seek bases and sign military defense treaty. China is a passive superpower because we are non-interventionist and do not seek alliance. However we wield a lot of cloud in developing world. Remember the Philippines try to win a UN Committee seat and in behind door, we gather our political strength abroad to block it? Russia is a moderate superpower that can easily caused severe damage to the world if she wants to.. Both of these three have complete independent foreign policy and will not take anyone order but go after their self-interest without fearing repercussion. Japan cannot achieved this independence because of the fear for US's abandonment and repercussion. Japan is just a fake superpower. The article cite the Banana Republic and a plagiarist editor as proof is not the way to go. LOL

Grade A (Superpower): USA

Grade A- (2nd Superpower): USSR

Grade B+ (Major power+): Russia China

Grade B (Major Powers): Germany, France, UK, Japan, India

Grade B- (Middle Powers+): Canada, Australia, Turkey, S. Korea, Brazil, Italy, Mexico, Spain

Grade C+ (Middle Powers): Iran, Indonesia, Netherlands, Saudi Arabia, Poland, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, South Africa, Nigeria, Malaysia

Grade C (Middle Powers -) Pakistan, Vietnam, Phillipines, Thailand, Ukraine,

My own personal list that is not based on any academic studies, so feel free to critique. China and Russia are simply not superpowers, but they are on a different category of major powers due to large military, unsc, economy, resource, political influence over neighboring states, and most importantly an independent foreign policy, (the other major powers are in USA camp).

We can agree that Italy is not a major power, but it is far more influential than Vietnam, hence my use of + and -.

 

[Kolaps]

I like to categorize countries into class tier rather than superpower and world power status.

Tier 1: US, China, Russia
Tier 2: Britain, France, Germany, Japan, India
Tier 3: Turkey, South Korea, Indonesia, Brazil

US is an aggressive superpower that actively seek bases and sign military defense treaty. China is a passive superpower because we are non-interventionist and do not seek alliance. However we wield a lot of cloud in developing world. Remember the Philippines try to win a UN Committee seat and in behind door, we gather our political strength abroad to block it? Russia is a moderate superpower that can easily caused severe damage to the world if she wants to.. Both of these three have complete independent foreign policy and will not take anyone order but go after their self-interest without fearing repercussion. Japan cannot achieved this independence because of the fear for US's abandonment and repercussion. Japan is just a fake superpower. The article cite the Banana Republic and a plagiarist editor as proof is not the way to go. LOL

I don't think Russia, China and India are that strong.

Russia looks powerful because of their anti-US media, brave enough to oppose US and the legacy of USSR. The true, Russia is pretty empty. Several decades later, you will see the real face of Russia.

India is just pretending to look "big". Everyone know that India is not capable and reliable on almost everything to their own basic problems. Let alone world affairs.

China is not yet a tier 1 country. China just look big and powerful because of economy size, but beside of it, China have nothing. China itself is not a good example, that everyone can admire.


US and Western Europe still rule the world.

 

[IsaacNewton]

I don't think Russia, China and India are that strong.

Russia looks powerful because of their anti-US media, brave enough to oppose US and the legacy of USSR. The true, Russia is pretty empty. Several decades later, you will see the real face of Russia.

India is just pretending to look "big". Everyone know that India is not capable and reliable on almost everything to their own basic problems. Let alone world affairs.

China is not yet a tier 1 country. China just look big and powerful because of economy size, but beside of it, China have nothing. China itself is not a good example, that everyone can admire.


US and Western Europe still rule the world.

Power is not about living standard but ability to influence international events. Sure Norway's standard of living is best in the world, but can it pull off a Crimea invasion? Or can it prevent Taiwan from being internationally recognized?

 

[xunzi]

@xunzi my very good friend and his usual antics. My friend, not once did we consider ourselves a super power.

My best friend, I hope my words will not discourage you from boasting about Japan. LOL I just want to "humble" you a bit and hope you don't take it serious. Good luck, Nihon friend!

I don't think Russia, China and India are that strong.

Russia looks powerful because of their anti-US media, brave enough to oppose US and the legacy of USSR. The true, Russia is pretty empty. Several decades later, you will see the real face of Russia.

India is just pretending to look "big". Everyone know that India is not capable and reliable on almost everything to their own basic problems. Let alone world affairs.

China is not yet a tier 1 country. China just look big and powerful because of economy size, but beside of it, China have nothing. China itself is not a good example, that everyone can admire.


US and Western Europe still rule the world.

Russia if gone into an insane state can go and destroy this earth if they want to. LOL Russia has influence in Central America, especially Cuba, Western Europe, and Central Asia. Look at Syria for example. It still can't topple Assad.

India is a 3rd tier that in the next decade will move to 2nd tier so I project them as 2nd tier now. It is potential.

China is a Tier 1. No doubt about it. Like my American friend gave some example above, we yield behind door cloud for our interest. We can always do more but we don't want to. You have to understand our passive-aggressive foreign policy strategy here to really understand us.