J-10 might not needed as they don't add anything to PAF's capability

[MastanKhan]

It's good to see that even living for long time in USA u are still ready to oppose US tech, on thje other hand the J10C acquisition logic of yours is quite sensible in current scenario however we should look for two points.
1) Engine and Systems reliability regarding J10 ( due to some negative recent past reviews)
2) Availability of J10c for exports to Pak.

Hi,

I do not oppose the U S tech---it is the best---but the problems is with the strings attached to it.

Until and unless---pakistan learns how to manipulate the strings---it will create problems for it---and then we go on american bashing----which is not justifiable.

A friend has claimed that we should expect to hear big news about SU-35 and also MIG-35 soon. Along with Air Force Shareef family is also involved in trying to make this deal possible. @Windjammer @MastanKhan

Hi,

Thank you---about time---.

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

sir you forget that PAF was using F-16 since 1983 and lots of our Pilots were flying M2k, F-16 C/D and F-15 in ME..so there is no point in saying that PAF has 60's technology..

You clearly missed my earlier post that is the reason you were not able to understand what was being stated..
Clarification
PAF operates Mirage III and V that were of the 60's where as new models came after words like the Mirage F-1 and Mirage 2000 finally Rafales came. PAF aircraft were not upgraded in the early 90's. ROSE upgrade started in 1998. So when France offered the Rafale in 2000 it was refused.

Now read my quote once again that you replied too to understand.

sir, PAF men still love and admire Mirages.. love to fly it for another decade....

Never said they dislike the Mirages...Pilots of PAF know that these aircraft are very good...

PAF is not a private entity who just lost to others.. 200mln lives depend of their decision, than how they would lag behind enemy and put the 200 mln lives in danger..

What are you trying to say?
Do you think only private entities make mistakes and government does not? You would have heard or read

To Err is Human...

The issue is about the procurement of the F16---the way the procurement has been approached---and lack of information on the part of the paf to what the temperature of the american public is after San Bernardino killings against pakistan.

Hi,
Pakistan has a problem of not saying what the others want to hear...This is the real issue The Western Countries would give every thing if it is requested in a proper way...For this one has to do proper homework and research which unfortunately is never done from Pakistan's side.

 

[ghazi768]

Lolz this guy ,I have heard it all in the last 12 years of pakdefence or defence.pk so you are not any different .

Kid, than what the hell have you been arguing all along..
You mentioned AESA for JF-17, you mentioned F-16 will only be relevant if with SABR, great super duper avionics of Rafale. What are you trying to argue... spit it out..

Classical F35 is it a dog fighter ?

F-35 is still not inducted and under trails, it is too early to say anything. They have given it a 3D IRST to help it avoid getting sneaked upon. But as they say, taste of pudding is in eating it..

Oh man you nailed it comparing with Mig 29 / Perhaps spend some time on simulation being done USAF ,Other than Rafale /EFT against F22/F35 no other aeroplane didnt even detected them . This is height of delusions and confidence nothing else .

I compared Mig 29 with Rafale on FUEL and RANGE without drop tanks.. read before you comment..

Although both have good nose authority. Both are good at slow speed agility.

And good luck with trying to detect F-22 with IRST in its frontal quarters.. and still calling it a day..

IRST/FLIR is good for visual IDing which even super duper AESAs have trouble with. And helpful in sneaking but are overrated the way they are hyped about.

Nothing to write about your mumbo jumbo about product life cycles and marketing mixes as they are irrelevant.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

Another vehicle hacked thru data link---enjoy the read

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-36444586

 

[Windjammer]

A friend has claimed that we should expect to hear big news about SU-35 and also MIG-35 soon. Along with Air Force Shareef family is also involved in trying to make this deal possible. @Windjammer @MastanKhan

I highly doubt that, two platforms from the same source.

 

[New World]

You clearly missed my earlier post that is the reason you were not able to understand what was being stated..
Clarification
PAF operates Mirage III and V that were of the 60's where as new models came after words like the Mirage F-1 and Mirage 2000 finally Rafales came. PAF aircraft were not upgraded in the early 90's. ROSE upgrade started in 1998. So when France offered the Rafale in 2000 it was refused.
Now read my quote once again that you replied too to understand.

sir, I read your previous post and i understand what you are trying to say but you didnt understand what i'm trying to say.. lets make it simple..
Rose program was started in Late 90's..(i'm not saying anything about mirage 3 or rose program)..
but
PAF has F-16s which have new technology and is digitized and i think there would not be any issue to consume rafale technology into paf as they already have technology of f-16..

and our pilots were already flying in Airforces of ME, where they were flying M2K, F-16, F-15, Tornado..

Never said they dislike the Mirages...Pilots of PAF know that these aircraft are very good...

i'm not saying that you said that... what i'm saying is that there are not fed up from mirages to jump to another new jet.. the very first mirage is also in PAF and they calls him "Abbo of mirages"..

What are you trying to say?
Do you think only private entities make mistakes and government does not? You would have heard or read

To Err is Human...

I have heard it, but mistakes upon mistakes is not To Err is Human,

 

[Zain Malik]

I highly doubt that, two platforms from the same source.

Actually we are not going to induct any one of them
The next fighter of Pakistan will be J-31
From September 19,2015 till the present day We are hearing that the Islamabad and Moscow are close to sum up the deal of a few units of Su-35 but nothing happened and for sure it will not...

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

sir, I read your previous post and i understand what you are trying to say but you didnt understand what i'm trying to say.. lets make it simple..
Rose program was started in Late 90's..(i'm not saying anything about mirage 3 or rose program)..
but
PAF has F-16s which have new technology and is digitized and i think there would not be any issue to consume rafale technology into paf as they already have technology of f-16..

and our pilots were already flying in Airforces of ME, where they were flying M2K, F-16, F-15, Tornado..


i'm not saying that you said that... what i'm saying is that there are not fed up from mirages to jump to another new jet.. the very first mirage is also in PAF and they calls him "Abbo of mirages"..



I have heard it, but mistakes upon mistakes is not To Err is Human,

The F-16's that PAF inducted i the 80's did not have similar systems the Rafales or the M2K. They were and are being upgraded now after the bock 52's came.

More over it is not a good idea to fly the top most fighter aircraft you have and then go down to a lower one or equivalent. It is lost easier to transition from Mirage III/V to M2K then to Rafales but not directly from Mirage III/ V to Rafales.

Even if the pilots of PAF flew M2K the numbers were very few where as if these were inducted it would have taken lot of time and money with high failure rate which is not good for any one.

 

[Windjammer]

Actually we are not going to induct any one of them
The next fighter of Pakistan will be J-31
From September 19,2015 till the present day We are hearing that the Islamabad and Moscow are close to sum up the deal of a few units of Su-35 but nothing happened and for sure it will not...

But keep one thing in mind, the news about SU-35 came from Russian MOD and not from any Pakistani source.

 

[Zain Malik]

But keep one thing in mind, the news about SU-35 came from Russian MOD and not from any Pakistani source.

That was something on early stages brother but now there is not a single news about it....
AnyHow continue thread with J-10...

 

[volatile]

Kid, than what the hell have you been arguing all along..
You mentioned AESA for JF-17, you mentioned F-16 will only be relevant if with SABR, great super duper avionics of Rafale. What are you trying to argue... spit it out..

For me spiting out means disrespecting which iam quite aware you or any other member doesnt deserves so mind what you say this is not PMA , RISALPUR .What i means to say F17 AESA or current avionic suite would have been more quicker then what we are seeing having go with French Industries ,F16 SABR is not available till we have our own decent AESA . So Relevancy of F16 are not there after few years

F-35 is still not inducted and under trails, it is too early to say anything. They have given it a 3D IRST to help it avoid getting sneaked upon. But as they say, taste of pudding is in eating it..

F35 is a 1.5 Trillion US$ project and replacement of all front line and legacy fighters so this argument was that future aeroplanes are made to dog fight but this is not F35 ,With Lockheed Marting already looking for 2500 Copies for these so please stick to one opinion.

I compared Mig 29 with Rafale on FUEL and RANGE without drop tanks.. read before you comment..

Although both have good nose authority. Both are good at slow speed agility.

And good luck with trying to detect F-22 with IRST in its frontal quarters.. and still calling it a day..

Have you ever heard name SPECTRA System couples with AESA planned for Rafale ? you really dont have any idea what systems are these and how relevant Spectra system is ? IRST is quite standard for these birds with detection range of closed to 100 KM nowadays F22 is losing its advantage .

Live drill F22 VS Rafale fight

Nothing to write about your mumbo jumbo about product life cycles and marketing mixes as they are irrelevant.

Yes i totally agree it doesn't make sense for you since its way our your head .Lets make some thing straight stop calling me kid and start acting like professionals .I probably have more work experience and education you might not think of .

 

[weqi]

For me spiting out means disrespecting which iam quite aware you or any other member doesnt deserves so mind what you say this is not PMA , RISALPUR .What i means to say F17 AESA or current avionic suite would have been more quicker then what we are seeing having go with French Industries ,F16 SABR is not available till we have our own decent AESA . So Relevancy of F16 are not there after few years

F35 is a 1.5 Trillion US$ project and replacement of all front line and legacy fighters so this argument was that future aeroplanes are made to dog fight but this is not F35 ,With Lockheed Marting already looking for 2500 Copies for these so please stick to one opinion.

Have you ever heard name SPECTRA System couples with AESA planned for Rafale ? you really dont have any idea what systems are these and how relevant Spectra system is ? IRST is quite standard for these birds with detection range of closed to 100 KM nowadays F22 is losing its advantage .

Live drill F22 VS Rafale fight

Yes i totally agree it doesn't make sense for you since its way our your head .Lets make some thing straight stop calling me kid and start acting like professionals .I probably have more work experience and education you might not think of .

nice

 

[araz]

@ Volatile and @ghazi768
Kindly stop calling each other names and keep the qrguments civil. You can have different opinions andearn to live with them but please dont indulge in this petty argument. If you continue I will ask the mods to give you both a cooling off period.
A

 

[ziaulislam]

i think the question is can we get customized and reliable supply of weapons and spares for f-16s. if yes than j-10 is not needed if no, then we just need to stop procuring more f-16s and procure 4 squadrons of j-10/or 2 squadrons of j-16

i like the su 35 but we cannot grantee what will happen if india squeezes russia

 

[volatile]

@ Volatile and @ghazi768
Kindly stop calling each other names and keep the qrguments civil. You can have different opinions andearn to live with them but please dont indulge in this petty argument. If you continue I will ask the mods to give you both a cooling off period.
A

If i offended anyone please do check all my posts .I mentioned my point based on answers i got ,Any way Im cool but please advise other members to do so the same