Is Saudi Arabia interested in the F-35?

[TheThreePashas]

I don't think the United States will sell F-35s to Saudi Arabia within the next two decades. They're too advanced and the Saudi military is already strong enough to serve its purpose for the Americans (equipment wise. Training and doctrine must be improved probably)


Guys. Stop comparing IAF with the Saudi Airforce. With the training and EW, etc.. Israeli f-16s would take out KSA f-15s.

Edit: Discrediting the Israeli F-16s is like implying that Saudi Arabia's Airforce is superior to Turkey's. I think it's quite the opposite, regardless of the expensive planes Saudi Arabia has

 

[Doritos11]

Ofc you think your air force is superior, your a nationalist

 

[Yabgu]

I don't think the United States will sell F-35s to Saudi Arabia within the next two decades. They're too advanced and the Saudi military is already strong enough to serve its purpose for the Americans (equipment wise. Training and doctrine must be improved probably)


Guys. Stop comparing IAF with the Saudi Airforce. With the training and EW, etc.. Israeli f-16s would take out KSA f-15s.

Edit: Discrediting the Israeli F-16s is like implying that Saudi Arabia's Airforce is superior to Turkey's. I think it's quite the opposite, regardless of the expensive planes Saudi Arabia has

Why do you bring Turkey into it? And stop talking like your a military expert this will win against that you don't know how will win. The Saudi F15 are the newest variant and is superior to F16 in air to air.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

I don't think the United States will sell F-35s to Saudi Arabia within the next two decades. They're too advanced and the Saudi military is already strong enough to serve its purpose for the Americans (equipment wise. Training and doctrine must be improved probably)


Guys. Stop comparing IAF with the Saudi Airforce. With the training and EW, etc.. Israeli f-16s would take out KSA f-15s.

Edit: Discrediting the Israeli F-16s is like implying that Saudi Arabia's Airforce is superior to Turkey's. I think it's quite the opposite, regardless of the expensive planes Saudi Arabia has

And how would you know that Saudis training is inferior to Israelis and Turks? Their records speak for themselves with Iraq and Iran, as well as Huthies war. Neither TAF nor IAF conduct as many drills as RSAF with several countries. I think the three countries have the highest level of training. Well, IAF has much more experience no doubt though. And yes RSAF is superior to TAF, easily.

Ofc you think your air force is superior, your a nationalist

When it's based on facts, it's not nationalism.

 

[T-123456]

KSA should join a 5th gen fighter program and forget about the overcostly,poor performing,worthless peace of crap(F-35).
Maybe someone knows of a 5th gen fighter program,cause i cant remember one now(im sure there are some).
ps,forgot the wink.

 

[-SINAN-]

I think the US kinda forced Israel in the f-35 program like they did turkey to grab their money

The Turkish companies supporting the development production of F-35 the future operational capability include:

Alp Aviation has been supporting the program since 2004 and currently manufactures F-35 production airframe structure and assemblies, production landing gear components and production F135 engine titanium integrated blade rotors for the engine.
Aselsan is developing manufacturing approaches for advanced optical components, which are part of the F-35 Electro Optical Targeting System. They are also working with Northrup Grumman on the F-35 CNI Avionic Interface Controller and will initiate full scale production activities in the near term.
Ayesas currently is the sole source supplier for two major F-35 components – missile remote interface unit and the panoramic cockpit display.
Fokker Elmo manufactures 40 percent of the F-35 Electrical Wiring & Interconnection System (EWIS) and will also deliver and support TAI with all center section wiring systems. Fokker Elmo will also develop the EWIS for the engine, for which a major share is produced in Fokker Elmo Turkey in Izmir.
Havelsan has been supporting the F-35 training systems since 2005. Additionally, Havelsan has been instrumental as the Turkish lead for developing the construct of the future Turkish F-35 Integrated Pilot and Maintenance Training Center (ITC) and associated training systems in Turkey.
Kale Aerospace has been supporting the F-35 since 2005. In conjunction with Turkish Aerospace Industries, they manufacture and produce F-35 airframe structures and assemblies. Kale Aero also supports Heroux Devtek as the sole source supplier for all three variants landing gear lock assemblies. Additionally, Kale Aerospace has also established a joint venture in Izmir with Pratt & Whitney to manufacture production hardware for the engine.
MiKES has been supporting the F-35 Program since 2004 and MiKES has delivered F-35 aircraft components and assemblies for British Aerospace Engineering (BAE) and Northrop Grumman.
ROKETSAN and Tubitak-SAGE are the Turkish joint leadership team who strategically manage the development, integration, and production of the advanced precision-guided Stand-off Missle (SOM) which will be carried internally on the 5th Generation F-35 aircraft.
Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI) has been strategically supporting the F-35 Program since 2008. Currently supplying production hardware that goes into every F-35 production aircraft. In conjuction of Northrup Grumman, TAI manufactures and assembles the center fuselages, produces composite skins and weapon bay doors, and manufactures fiber placement composite air inlet ducts. Additionally, TAI is strategically manufacturing almost 50 percent of F-35’ Alternate Mission Equipment (AME) including Air-to-Ground Pylons and adapters. In 2011, TAI and Pratt & Whitney signed a strategic agreement to pursue options for future F135 FACO and MRO capabilities for Turkey. TAI has also been assigned to represent the organic depots of the Turkish Armed Forces within the Autonomic Logistic Global Sustainment (ALGS) system.

Source: Lockheed Martin · Turkish Industry Takes Off In Support Of F-35

The capabilities which we will acquire by joining the JSF project, also gonna play significant role for our TF-X Indigenous Fighter Aircraft Project.

KSA should join a 5th gen fighter program and forget about the overcostly,poor performing,worthless peace of crap(F-35).
Maybe someone knows of a 5th gen fighter program,cause i cant remember one now(im sure there are some).
ps,forgot the wink.

Can it be called TF/X by the way ?

 

[Doritos11]

When it's based on facts, it's not nationalism.

There are no straight facts on comparing Tuaf and Saudi air force, except that Saudi Arabia currently has better equipment, Turkey NATO training, maybe Mosamania is right about the underrated thing, since none of us underrate the F15.

About Iran and Iraq, what records are you talking about, there were barely any clashes, the video of the F15-mirage F1 proves nothing, not a dogfight to determine experience.

 

[al-Hasani]

All that equipment is all good and nice but the task for my generation (young, educated and skilled Saudis) is to develop our own knowhow so we can produce high quality military equipment ourselves somewhere in the foreseeable future. It is not something that is done overnight but a task that takes decades but I like the new steps in that direction. It came late but better now than never.

Other than that then I agree with Mosab in this debate.

Also Israel will never dare to attack KSA nor does KSA even need to compare itself with Turkey since we are not even neighbors.

 

[-SINAN-]

@BLACKEAGLE

- We used to train Israeli Pilots in the Konya Airbase.
- There were lot's of ground attacks day/night executed against PKK terrorists.
- Dog fights with Greeks over Eagean sea.

TuAF regarded highly even in most of the NATO member countries. But I doubt ThreePashas have enough knowledge about KSA's airforce to compare it with TAF.

 

[BLACKEAGLE]

There are no straight facts on comparing Tuaf and Saudi air force, except that Saudi Arabia currently has better equipment, Turkey NATO training, maybe Mosamania is right about the underrated thing, since none of us underrate the F15.

About Iran and Iraq, what records are you talking about, there were barely any clashes, the video of the F15-mirage F1 proves nothing, not a dogfight to determine experience.

And Saudis are American training, and yet NATO training. and why are you talking like having better equipment is the least to put into inconsideration?

@BLACKEAGLE

- We used to train Israeli Pilots in the Konya Airbase.
- There were lot's of ground attacks day/night executed against PKK terrorists.
- Dog fights with Greeks over Eagean sea.

TuAF regarded highly even in most of the NATO member countries. But I doubt ThreePashas have enough knowledge about KSA's airforce to compare it with TAF.

Training is such a lose term, however, as I said, TUAF is highly trained.

 

[Sam1980]

What makes you think the U.S. will sell them to Saudis? Never forget this, balance of power in region must always be in Israel's favor, even the F-15s they sold to Saudi were heavily downgraded. You have better chance actually building a fighter plane from scratch than being able to get the congress's approval to sell these babies to Saudi!

EDIT:

F-35s are only sold to close, trusted allies and so far I don't see any Arab country qualify that criteria!

 

[Doritos11]

And Saudis are American training, and yet NATO training. and why are you talking like having better equipment is the least to put into inconsideration?



Training is such a lose term, however, as I said, TUAF is highly trained.

If you admit it yourself then theres no need for me to say it again.

Talking about warfare the 2 air forces have been through, Houthis & PKK is only bombing raids, Operation allied force was aswell mainly bombing for Turkey.
The first gulf war Saudi airforce did not engage in real air-air battles with Iraq, the 2 mirages were bombers attacked by F15s led by AWACS possibly blinded by electronic pods aswell, so we cannot talk about battles, we know little about their training except that its both American.

That leaves equipment to compare..

 

[TheThreePashas]

Guys. I'm not bringing Turkey into it to make a KSA vs Turkey thread. I'm just saying, there are things other than raw fighter jets that go into the equation.

Turkey was brought up because obviously I'm Turkish but also because we mainly operate F-16s


-Logistics : I'm not really familiar with the Saudi Airforce to this level but Israel (and yes, Turkey) probably being more time tested and established forces are probably ahead in this department
-Training : There's no way to specify that, oh look, we train better. But it's well known IAF pilots are some of, if not, the best trained pilots in the world. (Also. @BLACKEAGLE just because you train with USA/NATO doesn't mean that you are NATO. TurAF is obviously allowed more secrets, higher level training, etc..)
-History : Israel has probably had the most conventional combat since WW2. Turkey is a historic (yes, historic not so much anymore) military power. Saudi Arabia has yet to really participate in a real war. These things do matter
-Force Multipliers : Intelligence, AWACS, etc..



I'm not trying to put down the Saudi Airforce. If anything I want it to improve, but buying expensive weaponry isn't even half the battle. Remember when the IAF destroyed all of Egypt airforce on the ground? I'm pretty sure those were nice and shiny birds too!


I keep nationalism out of posts concerning friendly nations but do not tell me for one second that our Paşas sit there and watch the KSA Air Force destroy ours in exercises and do nothing about it. Obviously we're fairing pretty well considering Saudi AF is usually the side who seems to be initiating joint exercises.

 

[Mosamania]

Are u sure about the bolded part? Because as i have read on this forum that in may or june this year PAF F16A & B's consistantly won against saudi F15 and Typoons at a exercise held between the 2 airforces. IF you search abit you will find the thread it was may or june when exercise was held, i don't eactly remember it now. So how u can claim the Isreali older F16 A/B are sitting duck against Saudi Typoons or Eagles.?

"As I have read on this forum" end if discussion there buddy

 

[Mosamania]

What makes you think the U.S. will sell them to Saudis? Never forget this, balance of power in region must always be in Israel's favor, even the F-15s they sold to Saudi were heavily downgraded. You have better chance actually building a fighter plane from scratch than being able to get the congress's approval to sell these babies to Saudi!

EDIT:

F-35s are only sold to close, trusted allies and so far I don't see any Arab country qualify that criteria!

The F-15SA is downgraded nice joke buddy, don't do t again.