Is patriotism in India and Pakistan defined by hate for each other??

[313ghazi]

Agreed.

But same should be from your side. For example, extradite to Indian people like Hafiz Saeed.

Why? India has not handed over LK Advani for an attempted murder plot against the life of Muhammad Ali Jinnah.

You see it's things like this that are the obstacle to peace. Who is right, who is wrong? Who is more wrong? Who is continuing to be wrong. EU model only works because they don't occupy each others territory anymore.

Ah, but what is "Sharia" rule?? Is there a global consensus??

Yes pretty much.

 

[Hamza913]

Ah, but what is "Sharia" rule?? Is there a global consensus??

Obviously not, there have been too many off shoot religions that came from Islam.

Therefore, we will have to rule by Sharia that the majority of Pakistan believes in, so that would be a type of Sharia close to Ahl Al Hadees/Deobandi Islam (while maintaining a framework neutral enough to not alienate the large number of Shia's or Barelvi's in our country).

 

[Krishnan]

Pakistanis are completely different to Indians.

We have nothing in common with you Indians.

And yet we can understand each other's language?

You are a false flagger. Remove your Pakistani flags.

No I'm not. My mother is Pakistani (Awan from Pindi).

 

[YeBeWarned]

India and Indians does thrive on hate against Pakistan and Muslims ..

 

[jamahir]

Exactly, which is why your nation is an artificial one with no reason to exist if you focus on ethnic/racial justifications alone.

That is my very point.

All nations and their boundaries are artificial.

Agreed, ideology is the main issue and ours is far too different to yours.

Which is why I stress on Direct Democracy socialism being the common political system in both countries. The countries will remain individuals but at the same time be similar like how Iraq and Syria were governed commonly by the Ba'ath movement.

Why? India has not handed over LK Advani for an attempted murder plot against the life of Muhammad Ali Jinnah.

Hain??

When did that happen??

Yes pretty much.

So what is the consensus??

---

I am now going for dinner and will return in half an hour.

 

[Krishnan]

He claims to be half awan from pindi lolllllllllll who visits his mamu all the time in Pindi lol
@Sher Shah Awan

Mmm, why is that hard to believe? You make it sound like Indians and Pakistanis don't get married

Here's another famous Indian-Pakistani/Hindu-Muslim marriage

 

[313ghazi]

Obviously not, there have been too many off shoot religions that came from Islam.

Therefore, we will have to rule by Sharia that the majority of Pakistan believes in, so that would be a type of Sharia close to Ahl Al Hadees/Deobandi Islam (while maintaining a framework neutral enough to not alienate the large number of Shia's or Barelvi's in our country).

Bhai, Barelvis are 50% of Pakistan.

But the important thing we should ask each other is this, what is different in halal and haram between deobandi or barelvi? We follow the same school of fiqh, we are all hanafi. Deobandi/Barelvi is a non issue almost. Without meaning disrespect, it's between the religious equivalent of a rap battle in our part of the world. The differences are more misinformation and slander than truth.

The Usmani caliph and many before them would have ruled over Muslims who were sunni and shia, who followed different schools of fiqh, do you think they forced everyone to follow the same understanding?

There is no compulsion in the deen.

 

[Hamza913]

We're actually not as different as some Pakistanis are making it out to be. We speak the same language and watch hindi/Urdu movies and tv shows. We have the same skin color and culture and traditions. Also we marry one another alot,a like Noor Jahan's daughter who married a Indian Hindu millionaire.

Urdu and Hindi are not the same:

The Journal of Pakistan Vision places Urdu vocabulary as being composed of 29.9% of Arabic loanwords and 21.7% Persian loanwords:

http://pu.edu.pk/images/journal/studies/PDF-FILES/Artical-4_v16_1.pdf

As for skin colour, again, no. It varies greatly, but Pakistanis tend to be lighter than most Hindustanis.

When it comes to traditions, yet again, no. We don't worship idols, you don't pray namaz, we don't wear bindi, you don't grow your beards, we don't celebrate divali, you don't celebrate Eid, etc. Even if you remove religion as a factor, most Pakistanis are still Punjabi, Pashtun, Sindhi, Kashmiri, Baloch, or from Gilgit-Baltistan, where as all together these groups don't even make up 5% of Hindustan.

I'm sorry but no, Pakistani and Hindustani intermarriage is a rarity. It's not a freak occurrence, but it's not at all common (especially among Muslims and Hindus).

 

[Krishnan]

If that ever happens, I'm denouncing my citizenship, getting a non-Pakistani wife and will permanently live in said wife's country and adopt her culture wholesale, so my children will never have the embarrassment of being associated with a culture that normalised such idiocy.

It is happening.

Noor Jehan' s daughter married to Indian Hindu millionaire Vivek Narain:

@Zibago @jamahir​

 

[Hamza913]

Bhai, Barelvis are 50% of Pakistan.

But the important thing we should ask each other is this, what is different in halal and haram between deobandi or barelvi? We follow the same school of fiqh, we are all hanafi. Deobandi/Barelvi is a non issue almost. Without meaning disrespect, it's between the religious equivalent of a rap battle in our part of the world. The differences are more misinformation and slander than truth.

The Usmani caliph and many before them would have ruled over Muslims who were sunni and shia, who followed different schools of fiqh, do you think they forced everyone to follow the same understanding?

There is no compulsion in the deen.

Asalamu Alaikum

There's never been a census, but I guarantee most Pakistanis would be Deobandi (given how most Madrassa's are run by Deobandi's, and Deobandi's have the most power among all religious groups in Pakistan), however, I do firmly believe that there would be a large number of Barelvi's and Shia's.

The only major difference is the issue of shrines and intercession, which is why I said that if Sharia is formed in Pakistan we need to be sensitive to these sorts of issues (I'd propose banning the creation of more shrines, but leaving the current ones as they are while educating people to not pray towards them).

That is my very point.

All nations and their boundaries are artificial.



Which is why I stress on Direct Democracy socialism being the common political system in both countries. The countries will remain individuals but at the same time be similar like how Iraq and Syria were governed commonly by the Ba'ath movement.
.

I agree with you when it comes to your point about modern day countries, they are all artificial (well, most of them anyway).

Again, no, that won't work. We're too different and our people have different desires when it comes to how they want the government to work.

It is happening.

Noor Jehan' s daughter married to Indian Hindu millionaire Vivek Narain:

View attachment 492302

@Zibago @jamahir​

I never said it doesn't happen, I said it's a rarity, and it is.

Agreed.

But same should be from your side. For example, extradite to Indian people like Hafiz Saeed.

After you cease all acts of aggression, we can discuss things such as this.

 

[El Sidd]

Asalamu Alaikum

There's never been a census, but I guarantee most Pakistanis would be Deobandi (given how most Madrassa's are run by Deobandi's, and Deobandi's have the most power among all religious groups in Pakistan), however, I do firmly believe that there would be a large number of Barelvi's and Shia's.

The only major difference is the issue of shrines and intercession, which is why I said that if Sharia is formed in Pakistan we need to be sensitive to these sorts of issues (I'd propose banning the creation of more shrines, but leaving the current ones as they are while educating people to not pray towards them).



I agree with you when it comes to your point about modern day countries, they are all artificial (well, most of them anyway).

Again, no, that won't work. We're too different and our people have different desires when it comes to how they want the government to work.



I never said it doesn't happen, I said it's a rarity, and it is.



After you cease all acts of aggression, we can discuss things such as this.

You are on the juice.

I recommend more Vitamin D

 

[Krishnan]

Urdu and Hindi are not the same:

The Journal of Pakistan Vision places Urdu vocabulary as being composed of 29.9% of Arabic loanwords and 21.7% Persian loanwords:

http://pu.edu.pk/images/journal/studies/PDF-FILES/Artical-4_v16_1.pdf

As for skin colour, again, no. It varies greatly, but Pakistanis tend to be lighter than most Hindustanis.

When it comes to traditions, yet again, no. We don't worship idols, you don't pray namaz, we don't wear bindi, you don't grow your beards, we don't celebrate divali, you don't celebrate Eid, etc. Even if you remove religion as a factor, most Pakistanis are still Punjabi, Pashtun, Sindhi, Kashmiri, Baloch, or from Gilgit-Baltistan, where as all together these groups don't even make up 5% of Hindustan.

I'm sorry but no, Pakistani and Hindustani intermarriage is a rarity. It's not a freak occurrence, but it's not at all common (especially among Muslims and Hindus).

So you are telling me that a Pakistani cannot understand a Indian who speaks Hindi/Urdu and vice versa?

There are millions of Indians who celebrate Ramzan and Diwali, basant, Eid, etc...

Are you forgetting that prior to 1947 when some White men drew a line in the sand and called it a border between India and Pakistan we were one single country for thousands of years?

Are you going to allow the past 70 odd years to define a thousands of years old United india?

I never said it doesn't happen, I said it's a rarity, and it is

A rarity? Not in the least. Pakistanis marry Indians more than they do other nationalities and again it's because of similar history, culture, traditions and ethnicities.

 

[El Sidd]

So you are telling me that a Pakistani cannot understand a Indian who speaks Hindi/Urdu and vice versa?

There are millions of Indians who celebrate Ramzan and Diwali, basant, Eid, etc...

Are you forgetting that prior to 1947 when some White men drew a line in the sand and called it a border between India and Pakistan we were one single country for thousands of years?

Are you going to allow the past 70 odd years to define a thousands of years old United india?

Before the white man Drew that line.

The region was small princely state constantly at war with each other.

It was never a singular country.

 

[hussain0216]

It is happening.

Noor Jehan' s daughter married to Indian Hindu millionaire Vivek Narain:

View attachment 492302

@Zibago @jamahir​

Hindus are pagans, muslims do not snd cannot marry idol worshippers

Anyone partaking in these marriages is not really a muslim

 

[Hamza913]

So you are telling me that a Pakistani cannot understand a Indian who speaks Hindi/Urdu and vice versa?

There are millions of Indians who celebrate Ramzan and Diwali, basant, Eid, etc...

Are you forgetting that prior to 1947 when some White men drew a line in the sand and called it a border between India and Pakistan we were one single country for thousands of years?

Are you going to allow the past 70 odd years to define a thousands of years old United india?


A rarity? Not in the least. Pakistanis marry Indians more than they do other nationalities and again it's because of similar history, culture, traditions and ethnicities.

Just because we can understand each other doesn't make our languages the same. We can understand each other because the sentence structure is the same. There are plenty of Hindi words that Urdu speakers simply don't use, and vice versa.

Right, but they're a minority. Also, plenty of Pakistanis (even Punjabis) don't celebrate basant.

Please just shut up with that nonsense that's been refuted so many times. Get this through your thick head, Pakistan and Hindustan were separate entities for most of history. Half our country (Baluchistan, KPK and FATA) isn't even from the Indian sub-continent. Have you learnt nothing from @Indus Pakistan @Indus Priest King @Talwar e Pakistan ?

It is a rarity, Muslim-Hindu intermarriage is highly, HIGHLY frowned upon in Pakistan and among Pakistanis.

I know more Pakistanis who have married Persians than Pakistanis who have married Hindustanis.

I know you want to reconcile the two vastly different cultures that you've inherited, but lying isn't the way to do it.

@Desert Fox

Asalamu Alaikum

Maybe you were right about mixed race marriages.