Is Israel really Pakistan’s enemy?

[Developereo]

Thats complete rubbish.

Its Palestinians who failed in war turned first the conflict into Arabs against Israel. And when it did not work either turned into Muslims against Israel.

Just because you do not accept the facts won't change them. The whole concept of Zionism is a force for Jewish interests, and the establishment of Israel was promoted as a Jewish cause. This was long before the first Jewish settler set foot in Palestine.

It was the Israeli side which framed the conflict in religious terms.

If someone comes to your house, kills half your family and kicks out the rest claiming that he has greater rights because he is a member of "X" community, what would be your reaction? Most people would develop hatred for anyone claiming to be an "X".

That is why many Jews oppose Israel and Zionists, because the fanatics carry out their carnage in the name of all Jewry.

Muslims in Israel live better than in Pakistan.

And black slaves in America used to live better than blacks in Africa. What does that have anything to do with anything?

Please let us know of those specific events where pro-Israel Zionists were at the forefront of spreading hatred against Pakistan?

Leaving aside the foiled attack on Kahuta, the Kargil episode, and Israel's military support to India, if you look at Western media, there is an almost perfect correlation between people who are hardcode Zionists, and those who demonize Pakistan.

 

[BeyondHeretic]

It is when Pakistan moves to the 21st century that there can be any relationship between the two nations..

haha , sounds like black ops

 

[500]

Just because you do not accept the facts won't change them. The whole concept of Zionism is a force for Jewish interests, and the establishment of Israel was promoted as a Jewish cause. This was long before the first Jewish settler set foot in Palestine.

It was the Israeli side which framed the conflict in religious terms.

1) This is an Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
2) Israelis defeated Palestinians with ease.

So who is interested to turn this conflict into religious? - Obviously the losers. If you dont believe me just believe to simple logic and sense.

If someone comes to your house, kills half your family and kicks out the rest claiming that he has greater rights because he is a member of "X" community, what would be your reaction? Most people would develop hatred for anyone claiming to be an "X".

Jews did not start the war. Dont change the facts. Also today in Palestine live 14 times more Arabs than before the beginning of Zionism.

And black slaves in America used to live better than blacks in Africa. What does that have anything to do with anything?

Slaves did not live better, but blacks in America today indeed live better than blacks in Africa.

Leaving aside the foiled attack on Kahuta

Which is one of the silliest myths in history.

 

[BeyondHeretic]

1) This is an Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
2) Israelis defeated Palestinians with ease.

Americans too first defeated the Aztecs , then the mayans and then other group , so you see Israel must be stopped.

So who is interested to turn this conflict into religious? - Obviously the losers. If you dont believe me just believe to simple logic and sense.

Arabs are all staunch muslims , so this was religious from the very start

Jews did not start the war. Dont change the facts. Also today in Palestine live 14 times more Arabs than before the beginning of Zionism.

Jews didn't start the war , hitler did , and the Palestinians are there for jobs

Slaves did not live better, but blacks in America today indeed live better than blacks in Africa.

Which is one of the silliest myths in history.

you being a girl?

 

[rubyjackass]

Leaving aside the foiled attack on Kahuta, the Kargil episode, and Israel's military support to India, if you look at Western media, there is an almost perfect correlation between people who are hardcode Zionists, and those who demonize Pakistan.

No evidence of the Kahuta attack plan so far. Turkey gave help to Pakistan in almost all wars against India. Where does that leave Indo-Turkey relations? Besides Kahuta attack plan theory got publicized only in the last few years among common Pakistanis. They did not change opinion about Israel overnight.

True. Western media does have Pakistani bashers among hardcore Zionists but also even beyond. Most of them are from the US. When has an Israeli publicly bashed Pakistan? If they really want to hit you, they would have created an image which Iran has now.

 

[Developereo]

1) This is an Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
2) Israelis defeated Palestinians with ease.

So who is interested to turn this conflict into religious? - Obviously the losers. If you dont believe me just believe to simple logic and sense.

The phrase "Jewish State" was not invented by the Palestinians. I already explained why Zionists framed it as a religious issue from the very beginning:
-- to (ab)use the anti-Semitism defence.
-- (later) to milk the Holocaust sympathy card.
-- to promote it as a religious duty of every Jew on earth.

None of these things were invented by the Palestinians and they were in play long before Arabs came into the picture.

Jews did not start the war. Dont change the facts. Also today in Palestine live 14 times more Arabs than before the beginning of Zionism.

When you go to a foreign land, kick out the locals, and claim that you deserve the land because Gawd Almighty has so ordained, then you are starting a war, whether you admit it or not.

Slaves did not live better, but blacks in America today indeed live better than blacks in Africa.

In terms of the standard of living, the average slave did, indeed, live better than the average African at the time. The slaveowners wanted their "property" to be reasonably healthy and productive. The fact that they didn't have freedom -- gilded cage -- was the whole point of the analogy.

 

[Developereo]

Most of them are from the US. When has an Israeli publicly bashed Pakistan?

The hardcore pro-Israeli crowd outside Israel operates in sync with Israeli politics. Notice how Turkey started to get demonized in the West when its relationship with Israel dipped to a low point.

If they really want to hit you, they would have created an image which Iran has now.

That just means we are not at the top of their hate/hit list.

 

[500]

The phrase "Jewish State" was not invented by the Palestinians. I already explained why Zionists framed it as a religious issue from the very beginning:
-- to (ab)use the anti-Semitism defence.
-- (later) to milk the Holocaust sympathy card.
-- to promote it as a religious duty of every Jew on earth.

Jewish state has nothing to do with religion. Zionism is secular nationalistic movement. In fact in the beginning religious Jews strongly opposed the Zionism. Until today there was not a single Israeli PM who covered his head, which is an obligation for every religious Jew. So dont talk about things you have no clue about.

As I said, its Palestinians who lost the war. So they decided to turn this conflict into religious to make 1.5 billion Muslims fight for them. Israelis as victors have not any interest in this.

When you go to a foreign land, kick out the locals, and claim that you deserve the land because Gawd Almighty has so ordained, then you are starting a war, whether you admit it or not.

I repeat. Jews were not kicking anyone. Its Arabs who started to use violence. Jews only retaliated.

And once again, the overwhelming majority of Zionists were completely secular. That includes me. I am an atheist Zionist. I live in Israel not because God Almighty ordered me, but because I believe that this is a country of my nation.

In terms of the standard of living, the average slave did, indeed, live better than the average African at the time. The slaveowners wanted their "property" to be reasonably healthy and productive. The fact that they didn't have freedom -- gilded cage -- was the whole point of the analogy.

You really think that plantation slave lived better than African?

Anyhow Arabs in Israel are not slaves. In fact average Arab in Israel works less than average Jew. And Arabs in Israel have more rights than Muslims in Muslim countries.

Arabs are all staunch muslims , so this was religious from the very start

Azeris are also Muslims. Yet your Iran is helping actually Christian Armenia.

So religion is nothing but a card for you and your regime.

 

[Developereo]

Jewish state has nothing to do with religion. Zionism is secular nationalistic movement.

You can try to spin it six ways to Sunday, it won't change the FACT that Israel is claimed to be a Jewish home, for a majority Jewish population. That is why the Balfour Declaration called for a "Jewish State" in Palestine. That is why non-Jewish Arabs are denied their right of return. That is why any Jewish person anywhere in the world is automatically an Israeli citizen.

I already explained why many Jews oppose Zionism and Israel -- that does not change the fact that Zionists use religion as their rallying call.

 

[BeyondHeretic]

Azeris are also Muslims. Yet your Iran is helping actually Christian Armenia.

So religion is nothing but a card for you and your regime.

I used to post under "RaptorAlpha" in this forum , which I lost due to I losing the connected email too , but if you read my posts there you see why iran helped Armenia and her regime , my Zionist friend , iran helped Armenia to please the west... and of course it's been trouble for iran to date , you can see in this forum how it is

 

[500]

You can try to spin it six ways to Sunday, it won't change the FACT that Israel is claimed to be a Jewish home, for a majority Jewish population. That is why the Balfour Declaration called for a "Jewish State" in Palestine. That is why non-Jewish Arabs are denied their right of return.

I already explained you that term "Jewish state" has nothing to do with religion. I am a Jew and atheist in same time.

The overwhelming majority of Zionists were secular.

That is why any Jewish person anywhere in the world is automatically an Israeli citizen.

Similarly any Russian German can get German citizenship but you cant.

 

[BeyondHeretic]

The overwhelming majority of Zionists were secular.

They must have been something for a kickstart

 

[Jango]

Here is whats going to ask you and all other intelligent posters here

Israel allows all Palestinians Muslims or Christians born with in state of Israel a complete rights as a natural born Jew and are given citizen ship which Arab states deny to any and all Palestinian.

So you see its kind of confusing since the same Arabs who are fighting for Palestinians dont give the same rights Israel has given to Palestinians but are fighting for Palestinians.?

You should see my posts in different threads which give my stance on Arabs. Make no mistake, I am not too cuddly with them either.

As for Israel, it is clear you and I have different ways to see Israel, so we'll just agree to disagree. Israel doesn't offer us anything that we need so badly and are desperate for.

 

[Developereo]

I already explained you that term "Jewish state" has nothing to do with religion. I am a Jew and atheist in same time.

It doesn't matter what you, personally, believe, but how the laws of the State of Israel are formulated and how your Declaration of Independence is worded.

Similarly any Russian German can get German citizenship but you cant.

The Law of Return stipulates Judaism as the person's religion or in direct ancestry. The German law is not based on religion. See the difference?

 

[BeyondHeretic]

You should see my posts in different threads which give my stance on Arabs. Make no mistake, I am not too cuddly with them either.

As for Israel, it is clear you and I have different ways to see Israel, so we'll just agree to disagree. Israel doesn't offer us anything that we need so badly and are desperate for.

true , they're rude too (Israelis)

It doesn't matter what you, personally, believe, but how the laws of the State of Israel are formulated and how your Declaration of Independence is worded.

Israel's independence is a joke , it is independence from Europeans and hitler's concentration camps

The Law of Return stipulates Judaism as the person's religion or in direct ancestry. The German law is not based on religion. See the difference?

true , though I 've personally always wondered if germans copied the idea and it's flaws , from jews.