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Iranian army stages war-game on western border [PIC]

Our ground forces and air forces, are in serious decay and no one is doing anything about it frankly. Russia was in decay as well, now they destroyed a Ukrainian battalions about half a bridage in a few minutes in donbass just a few years ago with artillery after implementing modernization programs and allocating serious funds. We need the same, we need to modernize our armored vehicles before boasting about how scared western armies are agaisnt our BMP1's....... We need to implement future soldier programs for our regular and special forces, and standardize our military like a normal country. Our f***ing NOHED 65th brigade are using ak-47's. I've seen police in Canada better armed, better equipped than our special forces, what the hell. Look what has happened to syria, this is an example when you have a poorly trained, and poorly equipped military. If Syrian army were of any quality, they would've annihilated any armed uprising with ease and quickly. Do you think our soldiers are any better than theirs? They also had more modern equipment than us as well and they've lost 1000's of armored vehicles.



T-72's are not going to stop british tanks my friend and without robust air defence, we will not be able to effectively f*** them as they will find our brothers on the ground with thier airforce which his faaaaaaar superior than ours. I bet they can sweep through our whole eastern side with one division consisting of 200+ tanks, and armored vehicles followed with airsupport. I'm glad our country is so focused on air defence becasue airforce wins wars these days despite what idoits say. Just look at Russia in Syria. By halting their airforce we can slow down advances on the ground, but without effective and modern armored divisions and mechinized divisions, without long term training like NATO countries do, we will not be able to actually to initiate counter attacks that totally annihilate them. we train for like 8 weeks and then call our brothers soldiers, compare to i think 52 weeks of the brits. Additionally we don't have any capacity of invading other countries, lets be honest here. We simply can't with our armored forces. Our mentality is all about how to fight and die in our own country in some holy war, when it should be how to fight and win in other peoples countries. That is true deterrence.

Think from afghanistan if they send 4 armored division, one to sweep north to mashadd, one down south to zahedan, and 2 through semnan desert, where the mashad division links up them the other towards tehran, and zahedan makes way along the khalej fars. Can we be expected to defeat one of their divisions decievely with our armored forces, say in zahedan, and sweep up along the border quikcly and encircle their divisions in semnan and khorasan?. The vastness of Iran is of great value to us in strategic operations, where speed is killer, and can annilahate any invasion as they stretch their lines. Can we be expect to do this, and counter into afghanistan?
Huh....... why will Britain invade Iran? Makes no sense to be honest. I don't think even the U.S or any country for that matter will ever invade Iran. The time for such large scale invasions/wars is long gone. Had it been pre 2003((i.e pre Iraq war) then I would say yes it's possible, but after the Iraq and Afghanistan debacle no western power will be engaging in any large scale war/ invasion of a middle Eastern country. That's just not realistic and it will be a political suicide.
So I don't think Iran has anything to worry about in this aspect. However, I agree it's surprising to see Iran's army isn't as modern and well equipped as I thought. I suppose there's a reason for this though. Maybe the army is more focus on asymmetric warfare (instead of a more conventional type of warfare against a modern army) which is how future wars in the region will be(are being) fought. So not a bad idea I suppose
 
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Huh....... why will Britain invade Iran? Makes no sense to be honest. I don't think even the U.S or any country for that matter will ever invade Iran. The time for such large scale invasions/wars is long gone. Had it been pre 2003((i.e pre Iraq war) then I would say yes it's possible, but after the Iraq and Afghanistan debacle no western power will be engaging in any large scale war/ invasion of a middle Eastern country. That's just not realistic and it will be a political suicide.
So I don't think Iran has anything to worry about in this aspect. However, I agree it's surprising to see Iran's army isn't as modern and well equipped as I thought. I suppose there's a reason for this though. Maybe the army is more focus on asymmetric warfare (instead of a more conventional type of warfare against a modern army) which is how future wars in the region will be(are being) fought. So not a bad idea I suppose
I was speaking on more hypothetical terms of British invasion of Iran. I think you can agree with me that Iran cannot confront British tanks and vehicles head on, and they will have air support as well as Iran's airforce is depleted and probably bored as hell.

Ok so now 1 armoured division becomes 4 with air support. So you're looking at a major British :-)lol:) invasion now... From Afghanistan.

We have to talk about realistic scenarios here.
Fair enough, we have to be realistic here. Any say large american invasion which I think is highly unlikely, wouldn't simply not be stopped by m60s or t72S . Like their is no chance.And they will obviously be backed by air supports and any asymmetric approach and hunter killer teams of AtGMs is not a solution but a band aid. It will not led to victory, eventually they will find them with air recon. Our best bet is to bomb the f*** out of them with missiles during their build up. Imao but that'll start a war. Though I will admit that the reason they don't invade is likely due to our missiles. But I'm still disappointed about the state of the ground forces and how poorly equipped they are and lack modernization in both equipment and training/dicipline
 
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iran is a heavily mountainous country, with 80 million fiercely patriotic citizens with a strong sense of national identity. Any American or western invasion force would absolutely be shredded. they might not be stopped dead in their tracks immidiatly, but marching on iran will equal nothing but death and destruction for them.

and they know it as well.

and unfortunately the Iranian government knows it as well. that's why they do not care about soldiers equipment. for them spending a couple hundred bucks on body armor for a soldier is an unneccesarry luxury. even though the decision makers probably don't have their sons manning the fronts, or have to tell some poor kid why his fathers preventable death wasn't worth a couple hundred dollars, how he should be ok with not growing up with a father the rest of his life because the cheap state saved a couple bucks................

this is the mentality that drives me crazy. the Iranian public and state have no respect whatsoever for their armed forces personnel unfortunately. in the US for example, they worship their armed forces. its not uncommon for a soldier in uniform to get offered a 1st class seat by a passenger there.... their sacrifices are absolutely immortalized. this mentality does not exist in iran unfortunately....

and its not a matter of diverting funds to missiles. The Iranian government spends under 3%~ of its GDP on defense. That number is ridiculous. it is absolutely inexcusable in todays day and age to put a soldier on a frontline without at least proper body armor. anything less is betrayel and disrespect.
 
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Trump would be planning to blind side punch Iran, by fooling the world about his rambles against North Korea
 
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tanks in the pictures looks too old.iran needs to upgrade them or buy anti tank missiles.
 
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iran is a heavily mountainous country, with 80 million fiercely patriotic citizens with a strong sense of national identity. Any American or western invasion force would absolutely be shredded. they might not be stopped dead in their tracks immidiatly, but marching on iran will equal nothing but death and destruction for them.

and they know it as well.

and unfortunately the Iranian government knows it as well. that's why they do not care about soldiers equipment. for them spending a couple hundred bucks on body armor for a soldier is an unneccesarry luxury. even though the decision makers probably don't have their sons manning the fronts, or have to tell some poor kid why his fathers preventable death wasn't worth a couple hundred dollars, how he should be ok with not growing up with a father the rest of his life because the cheap state saved a couple bucks................

this is the mentality that drives me crazy. the Iranian public and state have no respect whatsoever for their armed forces personnel unfortunately. in the US for example, they worship their armed forces. its not uncommon for a soldier in uniform to get offered a 1st class seat by a passenger there.... their sacrifices are absolutely immortalized. this mentality does not exist in iran unfortunately....

and its not a matter of diverting funds to missiles. The Iranian government spends under 3%~ of its GDP on defense. That number is ridiculous. it is absolutely inexcusable in todays day and age to put a soldier on a frontline without at least proper body armor. anything less is betrayel and disrespect.

I couldn't agree more. It tell you alot about a government when they don't care to spend the money to keep its sons and daughters alive. Disgusting. It makes me furious when our brothers are not equipped with modern equipment and body armor. It tells me alot how our peoples lives mean nothing to them and then telling them to go up against men with thousands of dollars worth of equipment on them each while our brothers are in 30 year old camo, leather boots and a G3.
 
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ALCON,

At some level, it does my heart good to see some old M60A1s still roaming (not many un-upgraded A1s left).

As some have pointed out, there are plenty of M60s out in the world today but most are either A3s (visually similar to the A1 but a bit younger) and are often upgraded to some level.

Israel- All M60s today are upgraded to the Magach-6/7 levels (new engines, tracks, optics, armor, etc) and are in reserve status (only "active" tanks today are Merkavas).
Egypt- Received ~1700 M60A1/A3s in the late 80s/early 90s from the US for almost no charge. Some have been observed with new armor kits.
Turkey- A few hundred upgraded by Israel (Sabra II aka M60T), while the remainder of their fleet received the "RISE" upgrade, which gave the M60 very modern optics (including at the time, state of the art thermal sights).

There are just a few examples.

While Iran has shown off a small number of upgraded M60s (the "Samsam" for example), no widespread upgrade like the Safir-74/86 has yet been seen.

IMHO, the evidence that no Zulfiqar ever made it into service are proposed upgrades like the Samsam and Tiam. The Zulfiqar, having descended from the Patton tanks, was clearly meant as their replacement and yet, Iranian engineers seem to be continuously tinkering with M47 upgrades as well as the M60 Samsam.

As such, the most modern tanks in widespread inventory today are the T-72S and Safir-74/86 (even more capable than Iran's older T-72M1s), probably numbering ~700 total (based on the # of V-46 engines imported for the Safir project). However the Kontakt-1 ERA tiles used on the T-72S is now considered obsolete against most modern armor-piercing rounds and newer tandem warhead ATGMs.
 
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ALCON,

At some level, it does my heart good to see some old M60A1s still roaming (not many un-upgraded A1s left).

As some have pointed out, there are plenty of M60s out in the world today but most are either A3s (visually similar to the A1 but a bit younger) and are often upgraded to some level.

Israel- All M60s today are upgraded to the Magach-6/7 levels (new engines, tracks, optics, armor, etc) and are in reserve status (only "active" tanks today are Merkavas).
Egypt- Received ~1700 M60A1/A3s in the late 80s/early 90s from the US for almost no charge. Some have been observed with new armor kits.
Turkey- A few hundred upgraded by Israel (Sabra II aka M60T), while the remainder of their fleet received the "RISE" upgrade, which gave the M60 very modern optics (including at the time, state of the art thermal sights).

There are just a few examples.

While Iran has shown off a small number of upgraded M60s (the "Samsam" for example), no widespread upgrade like the Safir-74/86 has yet been seen.

IMHO, the evidence that no Zulfiqar ever made it into service are proposed upgrades like the Samsam and Tiam. The Zulfiqar, having descended from the Patton tanks, was clearly meant as their replacement and yet, Iranian engineers seem to be continuously tinkering with M47 upgrades as well as the M60 Samsam.

As such, the most modern tanks in widespread inventory today are the T-72S and Safir-74/86 (even more capable than Iran's older T-72M1s), probably numbering ~700 total (based on the # of V-46 engines imported for the Safir project). However the Kontakt-1 ERA tiles used on the T-72S is now considered obsolete against most modern armor-piercing rounds and newer tandem warhead ATGMs.

Artesh ground forces are nothing short of a catastrophe, including sepah.:hitwall:. Wholly under funded and lack of modernization. Not even enough to give body armor for our soldiers lives for gods sakes. Thats how little their lives are valued by our incompetent army leaders.
 
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The Army needs drastic modernization similar to what Russia did, At least at minimum the IRGC/Sepah needs to be modernized and standardized
 
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Rapid Reaction brigades are quite a new thing in Iran i believe. I don't think such a force existed in the past, and I think i remember reading last year or 2 years ago about the establishment of a RRF. So I can see why M-60's are used for agility, and light weight unit, but they should really be upgraded at least


"The formation of Artesh quick-reaction units earlier in 2016 and their subsequent deployment to the Mohammad Rasoul Allah Drills in southeastern Iran, for example, reflect the Artesh’s commitment to developing its rapid force projection capabilities."[46]

http://www.understandingwar.org/sites/default/files/Iran New Way of War in Syria_FEB 2017.pdf


If we wanna show great credebility and prestige in our land forces we should have brigades like the 65th brigade armed to the teeth and most effective equipement. At the very least, Sepah should be the tip of the spear for Irans military power. While the Artesh would move in behind them. Just like the US Marine Corps which in any war would be on the very front lines of the war, the tip of the spear, followed by the US regulars.

Sepah should be the best of the best equipped and at the very front, while a less equipped and larger artesh can come in from behind and sweep up after them.
 
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