Iranian Air Defense Systems

[mohsen]

Taer missile warhead payload

According to one of reporters, name of the missile is "3rd khordad", it's the one which shot down the MQ4-C.

 

[Hack-Hook]

According to one of reporters, name of the missile is "3rd khordad", it's the one which shot down the MQ4-C.

If it's Taer are you sure it has the range to do the shooting of rq-4?

 

[mohsen]

If it's Taer are you sure it has the range to do the shooting of rq-4?

It's not Taer, yes, 105km

 

[WudangMaster]

It was a 3rd of Khordad system guiding a Sayyad 2, not taer, to the rq4 and the 3rd Khordad itself was not actively engaging with its own radar but getting data from more powerful radars farther out through the national air defense grid. I think the system might have had eo tracking too maybe.
The systems typically carry a combination of taers and sayyads depending on how formidable the target might be.

 

[WudangMaster]

 

[Hack-Hook]

If it's Taer are you sure it has the range to do the shooting of rq-4?

Well the original post said taer otherwise if it's sayyad then yes it has far more than enough range. The question remain why we still produce Taer instead producing the same sized sayyad and for shorter range smaller missiles like the ones in 9th of day.

 

[TheImmortal]

Well the original post said taer otherwise if it's sayyad then yes it has far more than enough range. The question remain why we still produce Taer instead producing the same sized sayyad and for shorter range smaller missiles like the ones in 9th of day.

Taer is cheaper to produce than Sayyad. So a mixture of cheap and expensive on same platform is the right path. Why waste a sayyad Missile on a target that can be brought down by a taer?

9th of Dey missiles cannot be put on 3rd Khordad without modification. Thus you would need two batteries (one 3rd Khordad and one 9th of Dev) to do the job of one 3rd Khordad equipped with Taer + Sayyad

 

[Hack-Hook]

Taer is cheaper to produce than Sayyad. So a mixture of cheap and expensive on same platform is the right path. Why waste a sayyad Missile on a target that can be brought down by a taer?

9th of Dey missiles cannot be put on 3rd Khordad without modification. Thus you would need two batteries (one 3rd Khordad and one 9th of Dev) to do the job of one 3rd Khordad equipped with Taer + Sayyad

taer still more expensive than missile used in 9th of dey and have the same range while is a lot larger and heavier, and wrong it can be put there as Sayyad 2 can be put on both 3rd of Khordad and 15th of khordad .
those missiles can be used both with canister and without canister

 

[TheImmortal]

wrong it can be put there as Sayyad 2 can be put on both 3rd of Khordad and 15th of khordad .

Sayyad and Taer together

9 Dey missile

Completely different sizes.

Have yet to see a layout where a 9th Dey missile is sitting alongside a Sayyad or Sayyad-2

 

[Hack-Hook]

Sayyad and Taer together

View attachment 844288

9 Dey missile

View attachment 844289

Completely different sizes.

Have yet to see a layout where a 9th Dey missile is sitting alongside a Sayyad or Sayyad-2

You see it's roughly the same shape only shorter . The posterior proration are nearly identical
And the missile can be easily put on the launcher of 3rd of Khordad instead of Taer for low altitude and lower range target. It really lower the operational costs and also if they opt to go for boxed launch system like BUK-M3 in future versions it allow to carry two missile instead of one .

 

[TheImmortal]

You see it's roughly the same shape only shorter . The posterior proration are nearly identical
And the missile can be easily put on the launcher of 3rd of Khordad instead of Taer for low altitude and lower range target. It really lower the operational costs and also if they opt to go for boxed launch system like BUK-M3 in future versions it allow to carry two missile instead of one .

Possibly in boxed launched format. I don’t think so right now personally in rail launched format.

3rd Khordad is medium range AD, doesn’t make sense to take one of its slots for short range.

Remember typically they launch two Sayyads at one target. Not sure why they didn’t in Global Hawk case, but with Bavar and most Russian based missile air defense two missiles are sent for higher kill probability.

Now If you have two Sayyads and one Dey missile. If you launch both Sayyads you now have no long range defense if those missiles miss or a new target appears coming at you for flaring up on radar. So during critical time of war you are now vulnerable and have to wait for a loader to come up alongside you and reload via crane assist. That could take 60+ mins.

To me cost benefit makes sense keeping a Taer over a Dey. Or 3 Sayyads. Or 2 Taer and 1 Sayyad.

 

[Hack-Hook]

3rd Khordad is medium range AD, doesn’t make sense to take one of its slots for short range.

The problem is with Taer. It don't have that much of range compared to 9th of dey . Both around 40km give or take some km from it. Taer don't have the capabilities of our newer system and is a remnant of the time we were building Ra'ad project based on BUK systems. Keeping it there in light of our newer missile want make sense ,well at least to me.

Remember typically they launch two Sayyads at one target. Not sure why they didn’t in Global Hawk case, but with Bavar and most Russian based missile air defense two missiles are sent for higher kill probability.

To be honest while it make sense and it's not exclusive to Russian system I didn't see such necessity about sayyad missile in wargame and actual combat. And there is no documented use of bavar in actual combat scenario so I can't be sure about that but as bavar use sayyad missile I doubt it actually need two missile . Maybe it's the case of older Taer missile which is actually based on Russian design .

Now If you have two Sayyads and one Dey missile. If you launch both Sayyads you now have no long range defense if those missiles miss or a new target appears coming at you for flaring up on radar. So during critical time of war you are now vulnerable and have to wait for a loader to come up alongside you and reload via crane assist. That could take 60+ mins.

As I said taer is not long range

 

[Messerschmitt]

The problem is with Taer. It don't have that much of range compared to 9th of dey . Both around 40km give or take some km from it. Taer don't have the capabilities of our newer system and is a remnant of the time we were building Ra'ad project based on BUK systems. Keeping it there in light of our newer missile want make sense ,well at least to me.


To be honest while it make sense and it's not exclusive to Russian system I didn't see such necessity about sayyad missile in wargame and actual combat. And there is no documented use of bavar in actual combat scenario so I can't be sure about that but as bavar use sayyad missile I doubt it actually need two missile . Maybe it's the case of older Taer missile which is actually based on Russian design .


As I said taer is not long range

Taer-2C: ~ 90 km range (Tabas)
Taer-2B: ~ 105 km range (3rd Khordad)
9th Dey is short-to-medium-range

Taer and 9th Dey are clearly not in the same range class.

 

[Hack-Hook]

Taer-2C: ~ 90 km range (Tabas)
Taer-2B: ~ 105 km range (3rd Khordad)
9th Dey is short-to-medium-range

Taer and 9th Dey are clearly not in the same range class.

From where you get that nonsense data105 km on 3rd of Khordad is debatable and achieved by Sayyad 2c missiles not Taer missiles
Tabas air defense also use both sayyad and Taer missiles and can achieve 75km with the help of sayyad and not to mention it evolved into 3rd of Khordad

Taer 2 at most can achieve 40 to 45km depended on the model

 

[Messerschmitt]

From where you get that nonsense data105 km on 3rd of Khordad is debatable and achieved by Sayyad 2c missiles not Taer missiles
Tabas air defense also use both sayyad and Taer missiles and can achieve 75km with the help of sayyad and not to mention it evolved into 3rd of Khordad

Taer 2 at most can achieve 40 to 45km depended on the model