Iranian Air Defense Systems

[Ich]

Will Russia provide missiles to 'close the entire sky' over Iran? Read more: https://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2020/01/russia-iran-us-military-deals.html

I cant see why Iran should switch back to foreign ad-systems. Not their own ad-systems were involved in the accident, the foreign systems were. And beside that there was no nofly (what me still think it was the main reason), there still is the question of the possibility of compromiseing the Tor1 system. Or all other foreign systems which were not upgraded with iranian technic. So me think it would be not the best idea to invest lot of money in more foreign systems like S-400 (slimmed version) what is already "inspected" and "tested" by lots of countries, even the US. Better invest the money in homegrown systems to reach the same level but with the advantage to not can be easy compromised cause of the big questionmark for enemys of how is the system working.

 

[Messerschmitt]

I cant see why Iran should switch back to foreign ad-systems. Not their own ad-systems were involved in the accident, the foreign systems were. And beside that there was no nofly (what me still think it was the main reason), there still is the question of the possibility of compromiseing the Tor1 system. Or all other foreign systems which were not upgraded with iranian technic. So me think it would be not the best idea to invest lot of money in more foreign systems like S-400 (slimmed version) what is already "inspected" and "tested" by lots of countries, even the US. Better invest the money in homegrown systems to reach the same level but with the advantage to not can be easy compromised cause of the big questionmark for enemys of how is the system working.

I agree. If Iran can effectively produce the Bavar-373, the yet-to-be-revealed Oghab and IRGC SHORAD systems in sufficient quantities, then the chances of Iran opting to purchase foreign SAM systems are likely slim.

 

[Blue In Green]

I agree. If Iran can effectively produce the Bavar-373, the yet-to-be-revealed Oghab and IRGC SHORAD systems in sufficient quantities, then the chances of Iran opting to purchase foreign SAM systems are likely slim.

https://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2020/01/russia-iran-us-military-deals.html

 

[IAm]

https://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2020/01/russia-iran-us-military-deals.html

I am sure the US fear Iranian defenses more than Russian. I am saying this because there is a Chinese military saying that if you know the weapon of your enemy you've won half of the battle. The US know Russian weapons very well. Iranian weapons confuses them. Iran should not give $billions to Russia to buy ad that may be inferior to their own systems. These so called supper powers will always sell you inferior versions of their weapons or leave a door way that they can always compromise the system. Iran should only buy if they want to study, copy and improve upon it.

 

[TheImmortal]

I am sure the US fear Iranian defenses more than Russian. I am saying this because there is a Chinese military saying that if you know the weapon of your enemy you've won half of the battle. The US know Russian weapons very well. Iranian weapons confuses them. Iran should not give $billions to Russia to buy ad that may be inferior to their own systems. These so called supper powers will always sell you inferior versions of their weapons or leave a door way that they can always compromise the system. Iran should only buy if they want to study, copy and improve upon it.

There is also a famous Chinese saying “copy copy copy”.

What an absurd comment. China’s entire military was built on reverse engineering Soviet and Russian weapons systems. And China was one of the first countries to buy S-400 when it was available and will probably buy S-500 too because Russia is #1 in the world in air defense technology far ahead Of China.

China once again buys a Russian weapon system then attempts to reverse engineer it when it can’t do itself. This got to the point of making Russia mad and resulted in concessions by China in Russian purchases.

Only recently have we seen indigenous Chinese weapons, backbone of the military is still reverse engineered designs.

 

[IAm]

There is also a famous Chinese saying “copy copy copy”.

What an absurd comment. China’s entire military was built on reverse engineering Soviet and Russian weapons systems. And China was one of the first countries to buy S-400 when it was available and will probably buy S-500 too because Russia is #1 in the world in air defense technology far ahead Of China.

China once again buys a Russian weapon system then attempts to reverse engineer it when it can’t do itself. This got to the point of making Russia mad and resulted in concessions by China in Russian purchases.

Only recently have we seen indigenous Chinese weapons, backbone of the military is still reverse engineered designs.

I am sure my comment is not absurd at all, it is better for Iran to rely on it technology more than to buy. The neocon hawks and zionist regimes would have destroyed Iran by now had it not been their self reliance.

 

[mangekyo]

How can they know who it was that filmed the video? He doesn't show his face, or make any noice.

 

[TheImmortal]

I am sure my comment is not absurd at all, it is better for Iran to rely on it technology more than to buy. The neocon hawks and zionist regimes would have destroyed Iran by now had it not been their self reliance.

You completely missed my point. Don’t call Russian or Soviet tech “compromised” when Chinese military is built entirely on Russian/Soviet technology. That is what is absurd.

Bavar 373 is a completely domestic platform with no direct similarity to any western or eastern platform. Now if Iran had literally copied a S-300 system and slapped a new name on it like Bavar-300 then it would be China.

Also I agree an unknown tech (like Bavar) has its advantages as the enemy does not directly known all capabilities (but likely has intelligence on it). However, Bavar is only going to be as good as its EW/ECW rating. If it is not better than export S-300 version than West EW/ECW methods will work on it.

So again don’t think because you develop. A weapons system in Iranian or Chinese domestic code it is suddenly impenetrable to EW/ECW. US is #1 in military power in cyber warfare, it’s best to not underestimate your enemy.

There is a fallacy on this board of getting to comfortable against your enemies capabilities.

Iran is far away from being able to “relax” as the murder of General Solemani and attempted murder of Quds Force General of Yemen operations demonstrated. Iran has been poking the US thinking that It would never reset the rules of warfare and it got a shocking wake up call.

Some will blame this on Trump, but’s let be real. The deep state apparatus of biggest empire to exist on this planet does not make its security decisions based on one man. Regardless of what the MSM want people to believe.

So yes domestic development is great way forward, but advanced weapons purchases and ToT is needed to boost domestic development. If China didn’t have ToT of Soviet Union tech in 70’s and 80’s or reverse engineer the latest in Russian tech then It wouldn’t be the military power it is today.

Case in point, Iran’s Air Force is still stuck in 1970’s. With no technological purchases/reverse engineering or ToT transfer it has not been able to advance the Air Force one iota.

 

[IAm]

Case in point, Iran’s Air Force is still stuck in 1970’s. With no technological purchases/reverse engineering or ToT transfer it has not been able to advance the Air Force one iota.

Yes Iran air force cannot carry out effective combat but this is compensated by it missiles program. I think powerful SAMs and long range precision BMs and CMs are equally effective. Using SAMs against enemy jets and pounding enemy airbases with BMs & CMs will neutralize the attack. I think it is easier to take the enemy airbase out of service and neutralize the attack than trying to match jet for jet. Once you put your enemy airbase within your strike envelope, saturation attack on the base will be more effective. In this case US stealth jets may attack Iran but may not return to meet the tarmac from which they came.

 

[PeeD]

Construction of Irans surface wave OTH radar has started a few months ago. Ships are one detection goal but low flying CM or aircraft are added to that.

Also a key capability for Irans future AshBM's for targets in the Indian Ocean.

 

[Cthulhu]

How can they know who it was that filmed the video? He doesn't show his face, or make any noice.

What video you're talking about?

 

[IAm]

G

Construction of Irans surface wave OTH radar has started a few months ago. Ships are one detection goal but low flying CM or aircraft are added to that.

Great to hear.

 

[Sina-1]

Construction of Irans surface wave OTH radar has started a few months ago. Ships are one detection goal but low flying CM or aircraft are added to that.

Also a key capability for Irans future AshBM's for targets in the Indian Ocean.

@PeeD would you please explain the main technical difference between this OTH radar and the current ones Iran posses. What makes this one more appropriate for surface vehicles and CM.
Also, why is this one built near the coast, basically at the beach? Is it a requirement for it to function properly and how can they protect in the first strike wave since it is such a high value target.

 

[Ich]

Maybe costal othr can detect submarines too cause the waves are not reflected hard but soft on water and so some waves maybe can penetrate some meters below waterline.

Edit:

Ah, i see, in seawaters it works in the MHz range of an OTHR, but only for some hundred meters away from the sender . Better using around 1 GHz, but then the wave would not follow the surface over the horizon.

 

[PeeD]

@Sina-1

All static and large strategic radar assets face the problem to be destroyed in the first wave, but whats important is that they allow you to be aware of the first wave and counter it in the best way possible.

Iran has never shown any OTH radar up until now. Very long wavelenght VHF radars yes, HF band radars yes, but no OTH radar.

The function is not new and there are several main Russian and Chinese OTH-SW systems in operation. Mastering a state of the art OTH-B radar like the Russian Container is a more difficult task.
Basically it needs to be at the coast and is good to detect low and surface targets because its waves traval along the rather plain sea surface.