INFORMAL DISCUSSION WITH IAF PERSONNEL ABOUT LCA AND AMCA

[danger007]

super mki is a huge huge plane, it will never get obsolete, it will perform all the rolls mentioned in the books, it will fight 100 other planes at a time, simply because iaf corrupt officials will get their cut in import, as for as our nation and its indigenous capability is concerned, to hell with it, who has time to think ??

I don't get your point my friend.... any thing will become obsolete... let alone MKI even Raptor will become obsolete after some decades ( ofcourse for US not for all)....

 

[Anony]

Always a pleasure reading your posts, madam - Hows the little one doing ?

A question, if I may : Using stand-off missiles like the Anti-Radiation Missiles or even Cruise Missile, both with extended ranges in today's arsenal - Will that not diminish the possibility of fighter-to-fighter engagement in a penetration attack significantly enough that its payload & perhaps RCS more than agility or any of the other much vaunted attributes of a light agile platform, that would be the deciding factor ?

Which is to say, in the context of Pakistan & India, most of our Forward Operating Basis are in close proximity to the border areas & a stand-off missile or a volley of such fired at predestined targets even from within our own airspace be enough to significantly compromise the offensive or defensive capabilities of whatever the adversary have ! Wouldn't that relegate the LCA & by extension the JF-17 as little more than workhorses with their prime utility being little more than Continued Air Patrols whilst its the Rafaels, the Block 52s & surely the MKIs being the definitive element in any prospected engagement ?

I do apologize if it comes across as absolute nonsense for I'm an Finance & Accounting student, but this is a question about the relevancy of such light-multi role platform that has often perturbed me !

Much obliged, as always !

Not a very pleasant question Miss. Yet being a gentleman I will clear your doubts.

Firstly IAF threat perception is more from PLAAF than PAF. So I would like to tell you don't consider just one stand.The strategies are designed for both end.

Coming to your point,yes forward airbases lies very close to the border. That's why even when PAF fighters takes off our radar situated all along the LOC gives a clear signal of that and thus we need to get our interceptor ready. And whcih cruise missile does PAF has which can be fired from an aircraft. Fighter to fighter engagement is a realty and will remain forever. Adding to it these interceptors can also be used to intercept cruise missile (Babur in Pakistan's case).

Now I am talking India specific, early detection of fighter with the help of ground radar will also stand for Pakistan. So I am not trying to be BS, just trying to draw a situation.

Owns a 'Hyundai City'? Is that a 5th generation hybrid stealth vehicle produced jointly by Honda and Hyundai?

Ok, you mean Honda City! (My sarcasm has crossed all bounds! Jeeeez! )

Sorry Honda City. Was so excited to share the discussion, that I developed a complete new car from scratch.

 

[Anony]

@ Sancho. I stay at kolkata and he is posted at Pune. Comes to Kolkata once a year. Very hard to have a chat again in near future. But I will remember your points to throw infront of him next time.

 

[JohnSeb]

Sorry Honda City. Was so excited to share the discussion, that I developed a complete new car from scratch.

You should edit & remove the name Vikash also if you posted it by mistake.

Nice info...thanks for sharing

 

[Anony]

You should edit & remove the name Vikash also if you posted it by mistake.

Nice info...thanks for sharing

Thanks edited.

 

[janon]

Not a very pleasant question Miss. Yet being a gentleman I will clear your doubts.

Firstly IAF threat perception is more from PLAAF than PAF. So I would like to tell you don't consider just one stand.The strategies are designed for both end.

Coming to your point,yes forward airbases lies very close to the border. That's why even when PAF fighters takes off our radar situated all along the LOC gives a clear signal of that and thus we need to get our interceptor ready. And whcih cruise missile does PAF has which can be fired from an aircraft. Fighter to fighter engagement is a realty and will remain forever. Adding to it these interceptors can also be used to intercept cruise missile (Babur in Pakistan's case).

Now I am talking India specific, early detection of fighter with the help of ground radar will also stand for Pakistan. So I am not trying to be BS, just trying to draw a situation.

Hatf-VIII (Ra'ad) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Kloitra]

Not a very pleasant question Miss. Yet being a gentleman I will clear your doubts.

That question was not directed to you. No need to get offended.

 

[Speeder 2]

...

So you believe LCA mk2 will match the quality standards and requirement of IAF?

I think so. Tejas is quite a mature platform other than the shortcomings I just mention. I believe those will get solve in the subsequent development. But it will again depend, if it arrives on time,because delay may change the threat perception and thus requirement of IAF.

...

"quite a mature platform"? for a decade j-10 has been in serive and for how many year jf-17 has been in serice in mass, yet none is boasting "quite a mature platform" yet, given the fact both are under constant scrutiny for continuous betterment... but then for a paper plane like LCA Tejas which is still on the drawingboard, it's a "mature platform" , or no, "quite a mature platform" indeed... I guess when an indian is on bs mode, everything goes eh?

 

[Kloitra]

"mature platform"? for a decade j-10 has been in serive and for how many year jf-17 has been in serice in mass, yet none is boasting "a mature platform" yet, given the fact both are under constant scrutiny for continuous betterment... but then for a paper plane like LCA Tejas which is still on the drawingboard, it's a
"mature platform" of course... I guess when an indian is on bs mode, everything goes eh?

I wonder how high the Chinese standards are, as you think a plane with thousands of flight hours to be still on the drawing board.

How conveniently did you missed the part where it said LCA is being updated again and again as the IAF changes its requirement.

 

[Speeder 2]

I wonder how high the Chinese standards are, as you think a plane with thousands of flight hours to be still on the drawing board.

How conveniently did you missed the part where it said LCA is being updated again and again as the IAF changes its requirement.

yeah right, with thousands of flight hours Israel's LAVI must be "quite a mature platform", too, huh?

you can give 10,000 "reasons" and excuses, a fact is fact, which is lca platform is so so green that is not even in th efirst day of service yet... and you talk about how mature it is as of it were a f-16. don't you people feel a bit irony, i mean ever?

 

[Thorough Pro]

A balanced and realistic analysis (if I may call that) without the usual hyperbole of fan boys.

Tejas is quite a mature platform other than the shortcomings I just mention.

How can a plane become a mature without ever being deployed in service?

And you need to understand there is no joy in inducting a fighter which we know will become obsolete within a decade.

hmmmm this should put to rest the hype created by Indians about "latest star war technologies" used in Tejas, and this I think is the key reason for Tejas not being inducted in the service, and the chances are it never will be. In my opinion it would become a sort of test bed for indian aviation tech research and maybe some limited training, and not to forget fly past on republic day parades.

So initially it will be used for training only. Whether it will be used in combat in future or not will be a diplomatic call based on the confidence of pilots about the platform.

Totally failed to understand, why would it be a diplomatic call and not a "Technical call" based on merit?

1 vs 1 close combat is one of the most important ability and it will never become obsolete. Specially for the country whose adversaries are their neighbours

Again for the fan boys to understand that dog fight 1v1 or 1v2, or 2v2 or whatever is a still very valid concept.

 

[Kloitra]

yeah right, with thousands of flight hours Israel's LAVI must be "quite a mature platform", too, huh?

you can give 10,000 "reasons" and excuses, a fact is fact, which is lca platform is so so green that is not even in th efirst day of service yet... and you talk about how mature it is as of it were a f-16. don't you people feel a bit irony, i mean ever?

I did not commented on it being a mature platform. I am just wondering what are Chinese standards, that you can make the claim that a plane with so much flight hours is still on drawing board. You just tried to put words in my mouth, to justify your hyperbole, and dodged my question altogether.

 

[帅的一匹]

India will step up to 5th gen fighters without totally grasping 4th gen fighter technology. Why design a fighter the airforce don't want to induct? It's DRDO's responsibility to avoid the design being obsolete before induction and having promising room for updation. Organization like DRDO is only forgivable in India. Wish Rafale tech will help in the future.

 

[sms]

If the above info is publicly available and you just doing copy-paste then alright.

If this is something that yo are privy too but not openly available, I suggest you exercise caution while giving it out.

Nothing sensitive disclosed by by him but mere production/ tool capabilities!

 

[Anony]

"quite a mature platform"? for a decade j-10 has been in serive and for how many year jf-17 has been in serice in mass, yet none is boasting "quite a mature platform" yet, given the fact both are under constant scrutiny for continuous betterment... but then for a paper plane like LCA Tejas which is still on the drawingboard, it's a "mature platform" , or no, "quite a mature platform" indeed... I guess when an indian is on bs mode, everything goes eh?

In your case Plaaf start inducting plane even when it is still a prototype. But IAF only inducts mature platform. If you leave out the shortcomings due to underpowered engine on LCA, tell me one other point where LCA is behind J-10A. Ofcourse some weapon test is still left but that will only be done after IOC-2 and before FOC.

And don't talk about JF-17. I don't want to stretch and make this a trolling thread.