Indonesia Plans 180 Flankers Plus F-16s..

[siegecrossbow]

Which Flankers are they planning to buy, Su30s or Su35s ?

Probably Su-30mks like the ones they've gotten so far.

 

[Luftwaffe]

seigecrossbow..Realistically I think Indonesia should go for the JF-17s if they want 180 4th gens. 180 Flankers is a big purchase even for China or India.

Like I said indonesian defese minister is just all about talk and talking no reality to it, it would be a miracle if indonesia buys 50 or 3 squadrons of F-16s block 52 at the cost of $3 billion dollars. 2024 180 flankers (su-30mk)= Approx $9 billion dollars with all weapons and other equiptments excluding training cost etc not even 20 years will indonesia acquire this much, it would be wise to invest $1 billion in the developement of project KFX.

The only reality is more F-16s block 52+ over the period of next decade between 2011-2020

 

[Dzul]

I dont know our minister of defence is serious or not...


but our military spending not even touch 0.8% of our GDP..... and we have a sure plan to increase that to 2% of GDP in few years ahead to meet minimum essential forces...


We used to the stronges in Sout East Asia in 1960 era under Soekarno president with hundreds of fighter, more than 10 diesel submarine and we even have a destroyer....

we are now the weakest with largest population in south east asia, the increasement plan to 2% of GDP is realistic goal in years ahead..

 

[Luftwaffe]

Even with 2 percent in say next 4 year Indonesia won't be able to spend and buy and maintain 150+ airframes.

The only logical decision and for the long term is go into contract with us for the upgrades of F-16s and replace F-5s/bae hawks with 3 Squadron of F-16 block 52+. As stated long term over the next decade replacement program so that the economy can sustain and money is injected slowly into military hardware purchases. What us offers russians won't offer in ages.

 

[Dzul]

sorry not in few years.. but decade....

Military spending program up to 2% of GDP is until 2024...

 

[Luftwaffe]

That is why I said statement of 180 flankers purchase is a bluff just a talk with no reality.

 

[ViXuyen]

180 Flankers is nothing for Indonesia if they want to buy them. If we count the cost of purchasing and operating these Flankers for their life time that include a2a missiles, anti-ship missiles, spare engines and other parts, fuel for training, mechanics to maintain them, these Flankers will probably cost $100 million each for a total of $18 billion usd

Indonesia has an economy at the end of 2009 of $539 billion dollars. Counting only the proven oil reserves, Indonesia already has 4 billion barrels that are worth at least $300 billion dollars that they can trade with Russia for weapons at any time.

This is not about Indonesia having the funds/means to purchase and operate the Flankers or not, it's about whether Indonesia want to use them (they have plenty) to spend on such weapon; it's matter of priority over affordablity.

 

[Luftwaffe]

I am sorry it would cost Indonesia more than $100 million over life time maintenance of su-30.

$18 billion is a big sum its not bounty chocolate you buy from dollarstore. russian aircraft carrier for india remember where the cost went? Do some research.

What if you get wrong and Indonesia trades that with south korea for KFX.
What if Indonesia trades that with americans.

I am amazed at your post, priority so Indonesia didn't get time to think about replacing 1970's bae till 2010 because their priority was something else not even standard upgrades were given to them for 35 years.

 

[ViXuyen]

I am sorry it would cost Indonesia more than $100 million over life time maintenance of su-30.

$18 billion is a big sum its not bounty chocolate you buy from dollarstore. russian aircraft carrier for india remember where the cost went? Do some research.

What if you get wrong and Indonesia trades that with south korea for KFX.
What if Indonesia trades that with americans.

You used the term affordability and you just shattered you own post.

Who said that Indonesia have to use its cash reserves to pay for the Flankers? Do some research about the proven oil reserves of Indonesia and see if they can trade those for weapons or not. I'm only talking the proven oil reserves, not including other natural resources.

I don't shatter anything about my post. I just prove that Indonesia has the means to buy those Flankers if they want to. Cash, natural resources, Indonesia has more than enough to buy these 180 Flankers.

 

[softtec]

For now dreams....
Indonesia operates 10 F-16s, 16 F-5s, 5 SU-27, 5 SU-30 ordered 6 more, 32 BAE Hawks
A total force of 74 with 16 F-5s/bae at terminal stages of their life.

I'm not sure what is Indonesia planning on with dead on economy where they cannot afford to spend on Armed Forces enough the plans to buy 180 Flankers alone is questionable and creation of extra squadrons is pretty foolish.
Yes it would be wise to upgrade the remaining F-16s and replace those 16 F-5s/32 bae hawks with some 40 more F-16s block 50/52.

The Question of 180 Flanker it would be better as previously reported they want to join KFX project perhaps it would be too wise to go for that project in small numbers yet highly efficient and potential then old flankers.

ps: defense minister purnomo yusgiantoro said many things in the past with no results.

Can u tell me how PAF maintain/acquiring 400+ fighters with 1/3 of the economy.They have quite big GDP..If they spend near about the percent PAF spend they can acquire 400+ fighters easily

 

[Luftwaffe]

why do you bring PAF into this? PAF operated numbers and types for a long time unlike Indonesia look back at the history of PAF.

The crew that maintains those fighter in PAF please don't compare them to Indonesia, its unfair the number of hours spent learning and maintaining different types its huge. You post is illogical.

Indonesia may at some stage after 2025+ increase the numbers but the number of ground maintenance crew would also have to be raised with a complete set up for learning and applying knowledge and training the burden will eventually increase so would the crew, alot has to be done.

ps: don't indianise this thread.

 

[Luftwaffe]

5Star...illogical if that way countries could buy stuff off the shelf, Pakistan would have invited major companies to drill out explore $100 billion dollars worth of gold reserves in Baluchistan and exchange for few $billions worth weapons. Things don't work this way. you want example take Saudi Arab 72 Euro Fighters ordered they could have easily ordered 200 of them. Economy and the deal goes a different way not like hey i got oil come get it and give me a pair of pants.

 

[softtec]

why do you bring PAF into this? PAF operated numbers and types for a long time unlike Indonesia look back at the history of PAF.

The crew that maintains those fighter in PAF please don't compare them to Indonesia, its unfair the number of hours spent learning and maintaining different types its huge. You post is illogical.

Indonesia may at some stage after 2025+ increase the numbers but the number of ground maintenance crew would also have to be raised with a complete set up for learning and applying knowledge and training the burden will eventually increase so would the crew, alot has to be done.

ps: don't indianise this thread.

I just suggested for a self-introspect.I didn't say anything technical yet. If u look more(what I highlighted in ur post), I pointed out out ur reference of economy.If PAF will acquire/modernize 400 new fighter by 2025,Indonesians,having more than 3 times big economy, also can acquire more that that surely..right?So u shouldn't talk anything about their economy to create and maintain that.

 

[AVIAN]

Realistically I think Indonesia should go for the JF-17s if they want 180 4th gens. 180 Flankers is a big purchase even for China or India.

JF-17 is hardly a 4th generation jet that would make it even considered for the expansion of Indonesian Fleet. They can always prefer to go towards all new flankers if they would like to maintain a deterrance against F-35 being shortly delivered to RAAF.

 

[Luftwaffe]

No they will not, international politics kickback will play major role this time around if the figure is truly of 180+ airframes regardless of flankers of vipers, in perspective of Australia, US will enforce laws and perhaps embargo Indonesia again crippling their Air Force once they go ahead and procure and induct more F-16s and that will be a massive blow for Indonesia. The way US has achieved successful contracts and deal I am skeptical with this 180 flankers news. 3 times bigger or not politics comes first again what us offers russians won't offer them in ages.
ps. its easy for us to pick parties and people in power.