Indonesia Defence Forum

[Fl0gger]

The odds is just impropable, we did send a delegation there however with CAATSA in effective just forget about any transaction with Russia outside spare parts & logistic supports for what already exist in our inventory. Btw i must say we live in grieve era of Asia, i mean look at bigger scope outside SCS, India & China are at hostile toward another, though not directly involving us. I must say we live in Asia at its grieve hour.

well it was offered back then, it follow with sprut sd nona s and the legendary kilo class subs and some other stuff as marine and navy as the operator and we reply it as alternatife and i think it is nice option if there are no CAATSA efective if it compare to land base exocet offer. or there are west product is equivalent with bastion and ball E as reference..?

 

[Cromwell]

To be fair you and I both know a lot of the reasons why things don't go as planned within the context of our military more often than not can be summed up to "bureaucratic issues".

I understand your point, things have never been ideal in Indonesia

 

[Cromwell]

well it was offered back then, it follow with sprut sd nona s and the legendary kilo class subs and some other stuff as marine and navy as the operator and we reply it as alternatife and i think it is nice option if there are no CAATSA efective if it compare to land base exocet offer. or there are west product is equivalent with bastion and ball E as reference..?

Kongsberg NSM & Saab RBS-15 land based versions are superior to Exocet but should i asked to choose Exocet succesor, NSM should be decent option.

 

[Chestnut]

Not going to happen to us, whoever writes this has no idea about our foreign politics. Even i'm surprised at Singapore inclusion AFAIK Singapore more or less can be considered Non NATO major ally.

It's just an assessment done on every potential "what ifs?". When your organization is the US Department of Defense you are pretty much stuck conducting research and analysis for every notional scenario regardless of actual probability.

 

[Azull]

Kongsberg NSM & Saab RBS-15 land based versions are superior to Exocet but should i asked to choose Exocet succesor, NSM should be decent option.

NSM is a more better option indeed.

 

[Gundala]

Imho western side is lacking in coastal def missile systems. Russia doctrine made them pushed the R&D on missiles base system including coastal. This is also true in terms of Submarine technology, tho they are now getting left behind abit in this area. But to underestimate overall Russian Submarine technology and missiles defense system is surely a foolish move, as those two are they pasopati kinda weapon. US build carrier-Russia build Submarine, US made great jet fighter-Russia made great missiles, for themits all about balancing the power.

On the other hand US doctrine which bring war as far from homeland as possible making them lacking in missiles air def system (not being prioritize). Perhaps one of the reason why they bought one from Israel. But dont get me wrong, lacking in this case doesnt mean its bad.

I personally like Bastion/yakhont coastal def system, and I did read some open source materials on S-400 complete system due to my curiosity. On paper S-400 really something that the west need to be reckon with, its going to be a pain in the butt to jam it thats one thing.

But as good as the Yakhont/S-400 can be, at the end of the day its how it can integrate with other systems for force multiplier. Looking at the current choice of our preference to link the western alutsista those S-400 cant do much as stand alone system (tho it can do it). As much as I like them, I would prefer missiles def systems that might be less powerful on paper but can be integrated to other assets that we have

 

[Gundala]

It just shows that China is planning/more likely considering basing their aircraft or naval vessel in one of those countries.

I think they just "fishing", it just show that they have screwed themselves by "toying"" with us and others as well. Perhaps they now realize and think "dang we prolly need some friends in south east asia as a military hub. But wait, didnt we try to bully them all already?"

 

[umigami]

Imho western side is lacking in coastal def missile systems. Russia doctrine made them pushed the R&D on missiles base system including coastal. This is also true in terms of Submarine technology, tho they are now getting left behind abit in this area. But to underestimate overall Russian Submarine technology and missiles defense system is surely a foolish move, as those two are they pasopati kinda weapon. US build carrier-Russia build Submarine, US made great jet fighter-Russia made great missiles, for themits all about balancing the power.

On the other hand US doctrine which bring war as far from homeland as possible making them lacking in missiles air def system (not being prioritize). Perhaps one of the reason why they bought one from Israel. But dont get me wrong, lacking in this case doesnt mean its bad.

I personally like Bastion/yakhont coastal def system, and I did read some open source materials on S-400 complete system due to my curiosity. On paper S-400 really something that the west need to be reckon with, its going to be a pain in the butt to jam it thats one thing.

But as good as the Yakhont/S-400 can be, at the end of the day its how it can integrate with other systems for force multiplier. Looking at the current choice of our preference to link the western alutsista those S-400 cant do much as stand alone system (tho it can do it). As much as I like them, I would prefer missiles def systems that might be less powerful on paper but can be integrated to other assets that we have

We have to say goodbye to F35 if we choose s400, so NO!!

And yakhont isn't an ace card anymore. Aegis-like-system like type 052D can neutralized it.

 

[Fl0gger]

Kongsberg NSM & Saab RBS-15 land based versions are superior to Exocet but should i asked to choose Exocet succesor, NSM should be decent option.

well i love to see NSM as to be on our future frigate

 

[Kansel]

I think i've heard a rumour on MBDA proposal about land based Exocet bastion years ago but that's just a rumour

There's two proposal actually MBDA ones and Saab ones, but Saab sales seems not pushing it anymore for us

 

[Kansel]

I heard the viper procurements number got reduced again, can you confirm this @Cromwell ?

 

[Chestnut]

I personally like Bastion/yakhont coastal def system, and I did read some open source materials on S-400 complete system due to my curiosity. On paper S-400 really something that the west need to be reckon with, its going to be a pain in the butt to jam it thats one thing.

I agree that they are something to not underestimate, but when it comes to us operating them that will only be true if they don't sell us downgraded export versions instead.

 

[Cromwell]

I heard the viper procurements number got reduced again, can you confirm this @Cromwell ?

I know, latest rumour even suggested 1 squadron of brand new F-16 V & 1 squadron or more on F-16 EDA but that's just rumour. I still hope we pursue LOA on 24 brand new units instead

 

[san.geuk]

at first we plan to acquire 48 brandnew then reduce to 32 +EDA, last week I heard 24 +EDA/ex Norway now another rumour we reduce it again, the defence budget seems increase but the aquisition number falling, even if we use PLN the number still falling, why the number decreasing?

 

[Raduga]

good morning .