Indonesia Defence Forum

[Nike]

Expensive / cheap is subjective term.
Something to keep in mind, the typical operating theater for TNI is tropical jungle where visibility is typically limited to under 60m, although there are always some situation where there is clear line of sight for over 600m where having an optic is paramount. For example I once being stalked by a tiger and based from all the signs the tiger is somewhere in 20m - 30m distance and yet none of us see him until night time when the tiger grace us with his presence.

Police work on the other hand require far more precision shot, thus it is understandable they use more optic.

Mountain jungle in Papua tengah dictates the Army units operating there to have more rifleman /DM in one squad compared to squad in other units not operating in Papua Tengah , even among ZENI construction units.

Meanwhile in border patrol near Malaysia in Kalimantan, soldiers keep using usual rifle there

While operasi Maleo in thick jungle in central Sulawesi, Police and Army is not shy to using carbines, bulp up and SMG likes weapon

 

[toke115]

Indonesian Marine Recon

Brimob

 

[Kansel]

Bold one

I dont get what you mean?

What is the user requirement? What is the user really want? And how can a producent dictate what the buyer really need and Force them to bought their products?

Green bold

How can firearms and optic related to support weapons like RPG 7? Then talking about SS3, what the urgency right now to promoting a new rifle meanwhile, the current user still ordering combination of SS1 and SS2?

Red bold

Its all depend on the user order, not the decision of the arm marker. And as you should know, most of PT Pindad benefit come from small arms division and munition in Turen

Dark blue

You mean squad level arms?

Lol, its depend on situation and threat assessment on which arms need to be carried during engagement or patrol duty. Just for intermezzo, during operation against GAM, even Marines got RPG 7 to support squad level unit and some of the KOSTRAD unit using armburst, and Yugoslavia made M 72 equivalent to support their squad level units. Its not TNI is averse with the use of support weapon like RPG as thet are keep procuring them every year in number, but to current threat for the infantry soldier on the fields most of their current equipment is enough.



I had put news and photos about PT PINDAD optical labs and assembly facility here, in coorperation with Greeks companies. Dont be lazy!!!



Dont make blind accusation

PT PINDAD partner in optical and sensor is THEON, they won tender in Germany and supplying USMC.

https://defence-point.com/2019/10/1...oculars-for-usmc-in-collaboration-with-elbit/

Margin profit from support weapon is not as large as from small arms, munition and armored vehicles, they related it from the order from TNI toward mortar units.

Next time using sources lah if you want to made rants

Thank you now i get it obviously,but till now not all optics equipped on TNI rifle,why is that? Budget problem? Or quality wise?

For SS3 i mean, there's no reason not to buy new products with good quality wise,modular style ones to replace the old ones. i just need to know how far is the progress of the SS3?

As for my ranting about AT rocket its because till now i haven't see pindad released their AT products just a mockup, don't focus to build something without creating its doctrine too. For example US is the one that creating drone warfare, yet they didn't have air defence capable enough to stop drones and they're late for it unlike China or Russia or even Iran they're ready on drone warfare

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.sc...-malaysia-indonesia-fear-return-home-fighters
This what makes me upset about turkey invansion to kurdish,now my fear came true

 

[Ruhnama]

Thank you now i get it obviously,but till now not all optics equipped on TNI rifle,why is that? Budget problem? Or quality wise?

For SS3 i mean, there's no reason not to buy new products with good quality wise,modular style ones to replace the old ones. i just need to know how far is the progress of the SS3?

As for my ranting about AT rocket its because till now i haven't see pindad released their AT products just a mockup, don't focus to build something without creating its doctrine too. For example US is the one that creating drone warfare, yet they didn't have air defence capable enough to stop drones and they're late for it unlike China or Russia or even Iran they're ready on drone warfare

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.sc...-malaysia-indonesia-fear-return-home-fighters
This what makes me upset about turkey invansion to kurdish,now my fear came true

Turkish operation thread now is totally mess so much troll wkkwkwk
You can put your rant to troll more people in there if you want

 

[Kansel]

Really want to talk about our future LorAD system cause it will held a really vital role for our airspace defense

Are we leaning toward this?
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/pac3-mse.html

Or maybe this?
https://www.mbda-systems.com/product/aster-30-sampt/

Or maybe even this one?
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/meads.html

Hoping the acquisition going well just like what we do when we acquire nasams 2 for now I'm sure there will be nasams batch 2

 

[Nike]

Pangkostrad visit Singapore armored division school

 

[Ruhnama]

Or maybe this?
https://www.mbda-systems.com/product/aster-30-sampt/

I like this system, we already used MICA and other mbda product but recently we have palm oil problem.

Are we leaning toward this?
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/pac3-mse.html

Can congress give green light? Can they give tot etc. Even turks cant get .....

 

[Raduga]

Pangkostrad visit Singapore armored division school

View attachment 583803 View attachment 583804 View attachment 583805 View attachment 583806

is that commander sight domestic made by ST.Kinetics ?? its different than ours Leopard 2ri which use Hensoldt Peri R17 sight

 

[mengkom]

We do have many ambitious project tempo lalu unfortunately many of em got canceled

Also,what makes our navy chose millenium gun over phalanx,goalkeeper or seaRAM?

I still dont understand if pindad really want to fullfill their user requirements why don't focused with firearms first then armored vehicle?

We're still lacks on firearms+optics especially in AT rockets getting rpg 7 or AT-4 license is great and please complete the SS3 project already.

Thats why i prefer pindad to focus on armored vehicle&ammunition and let other producer like komodo armament to do the firearms job.

It looked so bad with only 2 optics and 1 grenadier on 1 divisionView attachment 583735

pindad SS-3 is not meant to replace SS-2, but rather to supplement it
SS-3 is in a different class of Assault rifle, it will fit to DMR and IAR role

your question is analogue to "why the US is keep on buying M-4, instead of procuring newer rifles like ACR or SCAR?"
simple, the answer is because the increase of performance is not that significant compared to the cost of procuring new standard rifle

i agree it is better to equip our soldier with optic first rather than procuring new rifle
introducing red dot sight to our troops will boost their shooting performance
making optic is easy, but making it the right way is not that easy nor cheap
the guarantee the optics could keep functioning in rough condition is the reason why they are expensive

 

[umigami]

is that commander sight domestic made by ST.Kinetics ?? its different than ours Leopard 2ri which use Hensoldt Peri R17 sight

Nope. it's israeli one

 

[Nike]

 

[Chestnut]

pindad SS-3 is not meant to replace SS-2, but rather to supplement it
SS-3 is in a different class of Assault rifle, it will fit to DMR and IAR role

your question is analogue to "why the US is keep on buying M-4, instead of procuring newer rifles like ACR or SCAR?"
simple, the answer is because the increase of performance is not that significant compared to the cost of procuring new standard rifle

i agree it is better to equip our soldier with optic first rather than procuring new rifle
introducing red dot sight to our troops will boost their shooting performance
making optic is easy, but making it the right way is not that easy nor cheap
the guarantee the optics could keep functioning in rough condition is the reason why they are expensive

Lowkey it's better to spend the money updating the SS2's with more ergonomic and lighter upgrades than buying an entirely new rifle.

Heavier barrels, better piston, lighter stock and handguard, optics should be procured first before a new rifle.

 

[Nike]

Lowkey it's better to spend the money updating the SS2's with more ergonomic and lighter upgrades than buying an entirely new rifle.

Heavier barrels, better piston, lighter stock and handguard, optics should be procured first before a new rifle.

SS3 with 7.62 NATO cal mostly will be used as rifleman / DM (designated marksman) rifle, using modified SP 1 pindad bore not good results.

 

[mandala]

KF-X fighter jet mockup at ADEX 2019.

http://m.hankookilbo.com/News/Read/201910141354366273

https://www.aereo.jor.br/2019/10/14/coreia-do-sul-comeca-a-produzir-prototipo-do-caca-kf-x/

 

[NEKONEKO]

Really want to talk about our future LorAD system cause it will held a really vital role for our airspace defense

Are we leaning toward this?
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/pac3-mse.html

Or maybe this?
https://www.mbda-systems.com/product/aster-30-sampt/

Or maybe even this one?
https://www.lockheedmartin.com/en-us/products/meads.html

Hoping the acquisition going well just like what we do when we acquire nasams 2 for now I'm sure there will be nasams batch 2

Didn't you already talk about this?

KF-X fighter jet mockup at ADEX 2019.

http://m.hankookilbo.com/News/Read/201910141354366273

https://www.aereo.jor.br/2019/10/14/coreia-do-sul-comeca-a-produzir-prototipo-do-caca-kf-x/

I wish the targeting pod is embedded to the aircraft body just like f35.