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India's New Submarines Have No Real Weapon - Courtesy Agusta Scam

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The Indian Navy's new Made-In-India submarine, which went to sea trials on Sunday, is effectively a gun without bullets.

That's because the primary weapon of the Scorpene class submarine, the Black Shark torpedo, is designed and manufactured by a subsidiary of Finmeccanica, the Italian defence manufacturer that has been blacklisted after it paid bribes to sell a dozen helicopters to India.

On Sunday, Kalvari, the first of six diesel-electric submarines built at Mumbai in a 3 billion dollar deal with a French firm, sailed out of the Mazgaon docks to have systems tested ahead of being commissioned in a few months into the navy.

Without her torpedoes, the Kalvari will have no weapons to target enemy submarines. The only other weapons onboard are French-designed Exocet missiles which are designed to strike enemy ships, not submarines.

All six Scorpene class submarines are meant to be delivered to the Navy by 2020, which is in desperate need of modernization especially given China's aggressively upgraded navy. India currently has only 15 elderly Russian and German designed submarines.

The deal for 100 Black Shark Torpedos, worth 1,500 crores, was was on the verge of being signed in 2013 with Finmecannica's subsidiary Whitehead Sistemi Subacquei (WASS). In 2013, it was suspended, just months before the government cancelled the helicopter deal with AgustaWestland, also owned by the Italian giant. The Finmecannica corporate family was then banned from any business with the Indian government.
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Senior navy sources tell NDTV that identifying, shortlisting and testing new torpedoes as part of a new tender is likely to take at least another five years.

The Black Shark torpedo was selected from among different contenders based on its performance in technical trials, its competitive price and the opinion of officers who said it was best suited for the submarines that were to be built in Mumbai.

With a top speed of 50 knots, the Black Shark is designed to intercept and destroy enemy ships and submarines even 50 kilometres away. With state-of-the-art fibre-optic wires which are a link between the submarine and the torpedo once it is fired, the Black Shark is meant to offer an improvement of more than 200 per cent over older generation torpedos in acquiring a target.

In the meanwhile, the Kalvari will dive for the first time and test its brand new sonar at its maximum range, but the young crew on board will know, that if there is a conflict, all they can do listen to enemy submarines out there. They don't have a single torpedo to attack.

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/indi...e-no-real-weapon-courtesy-agusta-scam-1402632
 
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That's because the primary weapon of the Scorpene class submarine, the Black Shark torpedo, is designed and manufactured by a subsidiary of Finmeccanica, the Italian defence manufacturer that has been blacklisted after it paid bribes to sell a dozen helicopters to India.

Some journalists are always high on drugs. So what if the Finmeccanica is no more an option. U will find 101 alternatives even if U start now (which i doubt IN wud not have). Media is always in pursuit of creating unnecessary hype for even minor issues.
 
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Some journalists are always high on drugs. So what if the Finmeccanica is no more an option. U will find 101 alternatives even if U start now (which i doubt IN wud not have). Media is always in pursuit of creating unnecessary hype for even minor issues.

There might be... but IN wants BS.. they've asked to loft the ban on the Italian company ... it's under discussion... even if they lift. .. Italy could use the mirine issue over the deal... I don't see BS coming to IN anytime soon
 
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There might be... but IN wants BS.. they've asked to loft the ban on the Italian company ... it's under discussion... even if they lift. .. Italy could use the mirine issue over the deal... I don't see BS coming to IN anytime soon

Exactly. There are too many twists with regards to doing business with Italy right now and even if IN gets things as they want, it wud be after quite a time and they wud have already wasted lots of precious time.
 
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Can any expert elaborate why Varunastra ,Takshak or Sheyna cant be an alternative to the Black Shark?
 
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Can any expert elaborate why Varunastra ,Takshak or Sheyna cant be an alternative to the Black Shark?

Same question , Varunastra is ready and recommended for acceptance by Navy after the final tests according to S Jha. And if it is a heavy water dual purpose submarine launched torpedo, it should be a nice fix. It may not be the best, but its better to have something than having nothing. Its still better if that something is made in ones own country.

Further the topic of heavy water torpedoes was discussed with Germany last year ,and now that we are getting towed arrays from Atlas Electroniks , getting torpedoes from them should not be bad as well if we really want a foreign one.
 
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Same question , Varunastra is ready and recommended for acceptance by Navy after the final tests according to S Jha. And if it is a heavy water dual purpose submarine launched torpedo, it should be a nice fix. It may not be the best, but its better to have something than having nothing. Its still better if that something is made in ones own country.

Further the topic of heavy water torpedoes was discussed with Germany last year ,and now that we are getting towed arrays from Atlas Electroniks , getting torpedoes from them should not be bad as well if we really want a foreign one.

Well my entire point of debate is why go foreign when you've got indigenous alternatives?
 
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What happened to our home made geavy weight torpedo?
 
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Can any expert elaborate why Varunastra ,Takshak or Sheyna cant be an alternative to the Black Shark?
Because subtics fire combat management system doesn't support any other torpedo. Blackshark is a must for our scorpene. No other torpedo can't be fired from indian scorpene.
 
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Because subtics fire combat management system doesn't support any other torpedo. Blackshark is a must for our scorpene. No other torpedo can't be fired from indian scorpene.
Thats pure BS...I read many such posts on pdf recently which is wrong. Similar in configuration, SeaHake torpedoes can be configured with SUBTICS...other torpedoes too.
 
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Thanks to Congress. We are always to believe its corruption based on these Defense companies bribing us but the reality is in order for these companies to operate and grab contracts they have to follow the rules set forth by our corrupt politicans.





DONE FORGET THE ADARSH SCAM! LOOK AT ALL THE POLITICIANS AND GENERALS WHO BOUGHT A FLAT BEFORE SALES TO THE PUBLIC WERE IN MOTION.



YOU FUKKKERS WHO VOTE CONGRESS TO POWER ARE THE PROBLEM IN INDIA.....YOU BELIEVE THESE BS NEWSPAPERS WHICH ARE CREATED AND TIED TO POLITICAL CONNECTIONS. YOU BELIEVE THE FAKE INTELLIGENTSIA WHO DO EVERYTHING TO RIP APART BJP WITHOUT GIVING IT A CHANCE. GO FUK YOURSELF.
 
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Because subtics fire combat management system doesn't support any other torpedo. Blackshark is a must for our scorpene. No other torpedo can't be fired from indian scorpene.

Agosta 90B of Pakistan Navy also have SUBTICS, they don't use BS. Same is the case of upgraded Type209s of Chile, they were upgraded with SUBTICS.
 
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Agosta 90B of Pakistan Navy also have SUBTICS, they don't use BS. Same is the case of upgraded Type209s of Chile, they were upgraded with SUBTICS.
Forget all that... even the heavyweight torpedo competition for scorpene subs were held between BS and SeaHake.....BS won controversially though. Ofcourse SeaHake is compatible with scorpene else why would it have participated in competition.
 
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Forget all that... even the heavyweight torpedo competition for scorpene subs were held between BS and SeaHake.....BS won controversially though. Ofcourse SeaHake is compatible with scorpene else why would it have participated in competition.
http://www.business-standard.com/ar...o-build-domestic-industry-115040900032_1.html
Business standard argues, BS subcomponents are outsourced to the company that makes SeaHake, so they can't offer ToT. Even the Italians chose SeaHake over BS. This acquisition smells of scandal.

Interestingly enough, Pakistan has been operating SeaHakes with their Agostas. Somehow, I feel, Pakistan armed forces are cleaner than the Indian ones when it comes to aquisitions. They are fine screwing their own people, but when it comes to enmity with India they won't compromise.
 
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No weapons on submarines, No worries. We will after face Chinese submarines :lol: in any war, people in China and Pakistan are more scared with weaponized Chinese submarines :rofl::rofl:.

Lets install horns in front of Kalvari and give Pichkari(holi wali) to the navy personnels :D:D ..
 
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