India’s bid for ‘second strike capability’ to put pressure on Pakistan, says SPD official

[MimophantSlayer]

india has 1.2 billion plus people we have under 200 million, the ratios have remained constant

Oh please, don't give me that shtick.
If population meant world power status then countries like US and Japan would be nothing in the annals of history.

1 pakistani has had to face down atleast 5/6 indians and we have stood firm

Which is why you lost. No one is superhuman no matter how much you tell yourself otherwise. That is something that Pak generals use to say to sate their soldiers, and which was carried on by the misguided public.

our nation was largely better then india on most indictators well into the 1990s and even now we have better sanitation access to clean water etc

Do educate me.
Please name one of those indicators lest everything you claim is plain rhetoric.
Human Development Index or (HDI) of both Pakistan and India should tell you which of our countries fares better.
Do check it out.

our country is much more managable and as our economy improves we will beat india on a range of indicators

How?
Only if you beat our growth rate by 3 times maybe then.
And ours is 7% touted to be over 8-10% by 2020 and to continue so in the next decade or 2.
Good luck competing against that.

As our economy grows so does our ability to hurt india

And we'll just sit on our asses waiting for you lot to firebomb us............

The position you hope pakistan to be in, is already being enjoyed by us.
Our economy is on the fast track NOW, and our defence forces are being modernized faster every year with only a fraction of our GDP going into it much lesser than Pakistan's.

Errrh that's well and good. But I'd rather be a nobody then have to endure the fact and reality the 40% of the world's most severely unfortunate, malnourished and dirt poor are part of my race and nation. I don't care about standings, status or titles especially in light of that fact. As long as I'm confident and happy in my race and nation that's what ultimately matters. As Floyd Mayweather said "titles only collect dust, I'm here for the happiness of myself and family".

I get it you love numbers.
Maybe you'll love these too.
http://data.worldbank.org/country/pakistan
http://data.worldbank.org/country/india

Its simple math, since our population is large the number of poor people also seem large.
Its the rate of poor people as compared to the population that actually matters, by that standard Pakistan has more poor people than India. THAT IS A FACT.
See China has around 80 million poor people as compared to Pakistan's 59 million. That does not make you richer.
In 2015 our poverty fell by 12.4% and will continue to fall every year and so will you lots' ability to scorn us, for something you people are clearly horrible at.

Technically we don't care what naysayers think of us, we know its nothing good, regardless of what they think of us we'll still be a BRIC nation with the fastest growth rate.
As Floyd Mayweather also said, “People have said things about me, and wrote and criticized me about things in the past, but it goes in one ear and out the other."

 

[باپ]

Moreover my points also related to thread in one way. I am proving that pakistan wrong policies are the real reasons what they are suffering since their policy always about nukes and military.

The thread and forum is about military and weapons....... I guess

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Except it is not.

Except it is not.

So you have a missile which you have not tested even once, which need specialized VLS submarines for firing or extreme miniaturization with corresponding reduction in range to be accommodated in Torpedo tubes, is pretty much a reality!

There is no tax on daydreaming.



Billi ke Khwab mein chichde.

The SPD official, who was speaking at the CISS, recalled that Pakistan set up its Naval Strategic Force Command (NSFC) in 2012.

At the time of the commissioning of NSFC Headquarters, the Inter-Services Public Relations said that it “will perform a pivotal role in development and employment of the Naval Strategic Force. The Force, which is the custodian of the nation’s 2nd strike capability, will strengthen Pakistan’s policy of Credible Minimum Deterrence and ensure regional stability”.

Former defence secretary retired Lt Gen Naeem Khalid Lodhi had claimed last year that Pakistan possessed second strike capability against India.


----


Cry me a river.

http://en.dailypakistan.com.pk/paki...ise-missiles-nuclear-submarine-us-think-tank/


http://thediplomat.com/2015/03/does-pakistan-have-a-sea-based-second-strike-capability/

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/pakistan/ss-new.htm

 

[risingsinga]

So even attaining the nuclear power is not sufficient and loop goes on 1st, 2nd, 3rd,...... or does it end somewhere? Why both India and Pakistan can't live peacefully? I guess this has something to do with Hindu obsession of Pakistan....the motherland division.....though wrongly preached to them by their pundits but they are stuck with it.....this insanity will continue until one of the two ceases to exist.....very unfortunate conclusion...

 

[kshaib]

Pakistan doesnot Bark like India, Wait for Time, Pakistan will surprised them

 

[باپ]

Sea based second strike capabilities maintains roughly 20% of USA NUCLEAR arsenal. 24 Trident on 18 Ohio class with roughly 5 megatons on each Trident is 2200 megatons. That is a fraction of total firepower.
Likewise if Pakistan can preserve a fraction of nuclear firepower in underground tunnels, that's enough credible second strike capability.

 

[Alpha Fighter]

Subs are difficult to track but not impossible. During cold war era both USA and USSR succesfully detected and tracked each other's Nuclear subs. The only place they could hide was under Polar ice cap in the arctic , because the sound of crashing smashing ice masked their sound and rendered them undetectable. Neither India nor Pakistan has such facility and cant go hide under polar ice caps.

lol.... buddy any non moving sub or very slow moving sub is also not detectable.... you have capability to go 5000 or 10,000 km in Indian ocean ?

Sea based second strike capabilities maintains roughly 20% of USA NUCLEAR arsenal. 24 Trident on 18 Ohio class with roughly 5 megatons on each Trident is 2200 megatons. That is a fraction of total firepower.
Likewise if Pakistan can preserve a fraction of nuclear firepower in underground tunnels, that's enough credible second strike capability.

any radiated environment also make to lunch missile impossible.

 

[Photon]

This post is meant to block such debate which is adding false claims in the debate.




On every Thread based upon Nuclear weapons of Pakistan you are making such childish and naive claims,
some times you destroy nuclear weapons by anti radiation missile, sometimes you detect Pakistan nuclear weapons through their ''radiation signature'' via satellites and consider TEL as piece of cake...................
If you have any person in sight who is associated with nuclear weapons then discuss him how irrlevant and out dated your claims and logics are..................

If you continued to spread false claims, I will bring mods and ban you for good.................
.

As I am breaking no forum rules, such juvenile threats, hold no sway over me .

Secondly I have never claimed anywhere of targeting nuclear weapons with anti radiation missiles, either you are mistaken or you are a Liar.

However , I do maintain exposed nuclear weapons can be detected by monitoring radiation fluxes in the atmosphere.

Nuclear weapons give off Alpha , Beta , Gamma and X radiations. A crude and primitive device such geiger counter can pick these radiations. In late 80s, US deployed a fleet of such satellites, launched for DOD under Nuclear MASINT.

For more information, how radiation from Nuclear weapons can be detected, read this.


http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2011/ph241/keller1/docs/phillips.pdf

The SPD official, who was speaking at the CISS, recalled that Pakistan set up its Naval Strategic Force Command (NSFC) in 2012.

At the time of the commissioning of NSFC Headquarters, the Inter-Services Public Relations said that it “will perform a pivotal role in development and employment of the Naval Strategic Force. The Force, which is the custodian of the nation’s 2nd strike capability, will strengthen Pakistan’s policy of Credible Minimum Deterrence and ensure regional stability”.

Former defence secretary retired Lt Gen Naeem Khalid Lodhi had claimed last year that Pakistan possessed second strike capability against India.


----


Cry me a river.

Look at the difference between, what you are claiming and what NSFC is claiming.

NSFC is claiming, some time in the future, Navy will burden the second strike capability.

Where as you are claiming SLCM Babur is already reality.

When there exist no proof if such a missile exists was ever tested or even development.

SO you are right, there is definitely, no tax on day dreaming.

 

[shah1398]

Bro there is no MAD because India will not attack Pakistan. We don't want occupied Kashmir its you guys who want it.

Sir i pointed out that it wud be MAD only in case of imminent war. And no one wants a war, may it be India or Pakistan in general.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

As I am breaking no forum rules, such juvenile threats, hold no sway over me .

Secondly I have never claimed anywhere of targeting nuclear weapons with anti radiation missiles, either you are mistaken or you are a Liar.

However , I do maintain exposed nuclear weapons can be detected by monitoring radiation fluxes in the atmosphere.

Nuclear weapons give off Alpha , Beta , Gamma and X radiations. A crude and primitive device such geiger counter can pick these radiations. In late 80s, US deployed a fleet of such satellites, launched for DOD under Nuclear MASINT.

For more information, how radiation from Nuclear weapons can be detected, read this.

http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2011/ph241/keller1/docs/phillips.pdf



Look at the difference between, what you are claiming and what NSFC is claiming.

NSFC is claiming, some time in the future, Navy will burden the second strike capability.

Where as you are claiming SLCM Babur is already reality.

When there exist no proof if such a missile exists was ever tested or even development.

SO you are right, there is definitely, no tax on day dreaming.

Former defence secretary retired Lt Gen Naeem Khalid Lodhi had claimed last year that Pakistan possessed second strike capability against India.

A SLCM has been in the works since years.. The new AIP subs will be quipped with it..

Canister launched Babur CMs have been tests since long.

 

[Tipu7]

As I am breaking no forum rules, such juvenile threats, hold no sway over me .

Secondly I have never claimed anywhere of targeting nuclear weapons with anti radiation missiles, either you are mistaken or you are a Liar.

However , I do maintain exposed nuclear weapons can be detected by monitoring radiation fluxes in the atmosphere.

Nuclear weapons give off Alpha , Beta , Gamma and X radiations. A crude and primitive device such geiger counter can pick these radiations. In late 80s, US deployed a fleet of such satellites, launched for DOD under Nuclear MASINT.

For more information, how radiation from Nuclear weapons can be detected, read this.


http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2011/ph241/keller1/docs/phillips.pdf

You are spamming wrong information.
Spread childish claims and out dated information.
You carry NO information about Nuclear program of Pakistan and pattern of its strategic command, so your ''knowledge'' is not needed here.

And None of Us is ''leaking'' any relevant info about which you might be looking for.

Former defence secretary retired Lt Gen Naeem Khalid Lodhi had claimed last year that Pakistan possessed second strike capability against India.

A SLCM has been in the works since years.. The new AIP subs will be quipped with it..

View attachment 305401

Canister launched Babur CMs have been tests since long.

don't take him seriously.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Oh please, don't give me that shtick.
If population meant world power status then countries like US and Japan would be nothing in the annals of history.



Which is why you lost. No one is superhuman no matter how much you tell yourself otherwise. That is something that Pak generals use to say to sate their soldiers, and which was carried on by the misguided public.



Do educate me.
Please name one of those indicators lest everything you claim is plain rhetoric.
Human Development Index or (HDI) of both Pakistan and India should tell you which of our countries fares better.
Do check it out.




How?
Only if you beat our growth rate by 3 times maybe then.
And ours is 7% touted to be over 8-10% by 2020 and to continue so in the next decade or 2.
Good luck competing against that.



And we'll just sit on our asses waiting for you lot to firebomb us............

The position you hope pakistan to be in, is already being enjoyed by us.
Our economy is on the fast track NOW, and our defence forces are being modernized faster every year with only a fraction of our GDP going into it much lesser than Pakistan's.




I get it you love numbers.
Maybe you'll love these too.
http://data.worldbank.org/country/pakistan
http://data.worldbank.org/country/india

Its simple math, since our population is large the number of poor people also seem large.
Its the rate of poor people as compared to the population that actually matters, by that standard Pakistan has more poor people than India. THAT IS A FACT.
See China has around 80 million poor people as compared to Pakistan's 59 million. That does not make you richer.
In 2015 our poverty fell by 12.4% and will continue to fall every year and so will you lots' ability to scorn us, for something you people are clearly horrible at.

Technically we don't care what naysayers think of us, we know its nothing good, regardless of what they think of us we'll still be a BRIC nation with the fastest growth rate.
As Floyd Mayweather also said, “People have said things about me, and wrote and criticized me about things in the past, but it goes in one ear and out the other."

Exactly! Couldn't agree anymore. Just as you people don't, us Pakistanis don't care what our enemies think of us neither.

 

[Photon]

Former defence secretary retired Lt Gen Naeem Khalid Lodhi had claimed last year that Pakistan possessed second strike capability against India.

A SLCM has been in the works since years.. The new AIP subs will be quipped with it..

View attachment 305401

Canister launched Babur CMs have been tests since long.

I have already answered, what your retired general hinted at above.

To add to that

Firstly, He said Pakistan has second strike capability, he never said anything about an assured second strike capability.

Second strike capability can land based or air based or sea based . Where as an assured second strike capability has to be sea based.

If India fires one nuclear weapon on Pakistan and majority of Pakistani land based nukes are intact, then Pakistan technically has second strike capability.

On the other hand, if India fires 20 nuclear into Pakistan, destroying all land based and airbased nuclear weapons of Pakistan and Pakistan still has the mean to nuke India, then thats an assured second strike capability.

Besides Babur SLCM, equipping S-20 subs, it is all speculation, not single concrete proof, of such a missile or even such plan in existence.

Besides a canister launched Babur can not fit 533 mm standard torpedo tube . And at 22 feet on length, Babur does not even fit in standard 20 feet torpedo tube.

 

[باپ]

lol.... buddy any non moving sub or very slow moving sub is also not detectable.... you have capability to go 5000 or 10,000 km in Indian ocean ?


any radiated environment also make to lunch missile impossible.

Yes,but in a nuclear sub even if the main engine is shut off, the air purification system, the generators and many other machinary are still running and making detectable sound.
Plus Indian sea based second strike capability is for now limited to 700 km as that's the maximum range of K-15. so to have any chance of hitting deep inside Pakistan, Arihant will have to come closer than 700 km, which is within Pakistani detection and strike range.
Pakistan has home made towed array sonars made by GIDS which are very good for long range submarine detection.

 

[PaklovesTurkiye]

is it really necessary to vomit in every thread? When you have nothing good to share why post crap?

He said nothing wrong. This is not Modi's or RSS territory. What a foreigner felt, he wrote.

By the way, he is more senior on this forum than you, behave yourself before you get banned.