Indian Special Forces

[trident2010]

What is the status for F-INSAS?

 

[Koovie]

What is the status for F-INSAS?

Has nothing to do with SOFs.

But the Army is testing new assault rifles like the Beretta ARX 160

 

[Abingdonboy]

Nice find. Duck drop is new to me. Never heard of it before

BTW "rumour mill" is speculating some interesting turn of events in MOD for our SOFs. Specially the transport. C-17 or Chinook or both do you have any idea about it ???

How do you mean mate?

 

[Sergi]

Has nothing to do with SOFs.

But the Army is testing new assault rifles like the Beretta ARX 160

How do you know ???

There is no info in public domain on who filled in the tender of New assault rifle. And I think the testing of weapons will only commence later this year after the scrutiny of the tenders. Correct me if I am wrong

 

[Sergi]

How do you mean mate?

The unification of Special forces under one command and giving the command some serious tooth.

It might me a rumour so not going in details as of now but a good number of transport platforms are being under consideration for the unified command.

 

[Koovie]

How do you know ???

There is no info in public domain on who filled in the tender of New assault rifle. And I think the testing of weapons will only commence later this year after the scrutiny of the tenders. Correct me if I am wrong

NEW DELHI, Nov. 19 (UPI) - The Indian army is implementing its Future Infantry Soldier Program 2020.
~
A key component of the program is to upgrade Indian army infantry weapons. The upgraded weapons to be acquired include foreign-made assault rifles, carbines, light machine guns and sniper rifles over the next two years..

To fill an initial order for 60,000 assault rifles, in the past two weeks the army has completed initial user trials of five guns contending for the contract, including

1.Beretta
2.Colt,
3.Israel's IWI,
4.Switzerland's Sig-Sauer
5.Czech Republic's Ceska.

Technical evaluations are to commence shortly, The Pioneer newspaper reported.
~
The winning assault rifle will come equipped with 5.56mm and 7.62mm (M43) caliber with interchangeable barrels conversion kits, with the 5.56mm option being used in a conventional war fighting role as the barrel will provide longer range, while 7.62mm configuration will be used in counter-terrorism and the counter-insurgency environment, as it will provide troops the capability to fire like AK-56 rifles.

Indian army to upgrade infantry weapons - UPI.com

 

[MilSpec]

The unification of Special forces under one command and giving the command some serious tooth.

It might me a rumour so not going in details as of now but a good number of transport platforms are being under consideration for the unified command.

I think it will have the opposite effect, SOF under different command will actually serve the purpose better. I relate unified command to bigger chain of command and slower responses.

 

[Sergi]

I think it will have the opposite effect, SOF under different command will actually serve the purpose better. I relate unified command to bigger chain of command and slower responses.

Unified command is almost certain.
But don't you think Special OPs are generally planned at top level ??? It will more easy in planning and execution if the command is directly involved.

But as of today we don't know what they mean by unification

 

[Koovie]

Unified command is almost certain.
But don't you think Special OPs are generally planned at top level ??? It will more easy in planning and execution if the command is directly involved.

But as of today we don't know what they mean by unification

They will bring the Marcos, Para SF, Garuds and NSG under one command.?

 

[Sergi]

They will bring the Marcos, Para SF, Garuds and NSG under one command.?

I don't think NSG will be there.

 

[Koovie]

I don't think NSG will be there.

Soon, commandos to come under single command

"A plan is afoot to integrate commandoes of the army, navy, air force and the National Security Guard (NSG) under a single command."


Soon, commandos to come under single command - Hindustan Times

 

[Sergi]

Soon, commandos to come under single command

"A plan is afoot to integrate commandoes of the army, navy, air force and the National Security Guard (NSG) under a single command."


Soon, commandos to come under single command - Hindustan Times

I still think NSG won't be there
Lets wait and see

 

[Abingdonboy]

I still think NSG won't be there
Lets wait and see

I don't think NSG will be there.

It is said that 51 SAG will be part of the Indian SOCOM. I am not sure what utility this will serve as the NSG is under the MHA and is meant for internal CT ops whilst SOCOM and the SOFs under the MoD are meant primarily as offensive tools.


The only advantage of this would be joint training between the MoD SOFs and the SAG elements of the NSG.

Unified command is almost certain.
But don't you think Special OPs are generally planned at top level ??? It will more easy in planning and execution if the command is directly involved.

But as of today we don't know what they mean by unification

I think it will have the opposite effect, SOF under different command will actually serve the purpose better. I relate unified command to bigger chain of command and slower responses.

Sirs all the evidence on this subject clearly points to an increase in efficiency when SOFs of different wings come under one command. With the Indian SOCOM having its own separate budget, it own autonomy and its own integral logistics and support infrastructure the Indian SOFs will really flourish IMHO. All the individual strengths of the individual SOFs will be combined into one mean command that has the tools and ability to carry out any Spec Op mission demanded by the civilian govt.

The unification of Special forces under one command and giving the command some serious tooth.

It might me a rumor so not going in details as of now but a good number of transport platforms are being under consideration for the unified command.

I don't know about C-17s, this is seriously unlikely and overkill IMHO. Yes C-17s can be used to support certain SOFs ops there is no need for the SOCOM to have C-17s under its command. But when needed the SOCOM will be able to call upon the C-17s for sure for specific tasks.


The C-130J-30s the IAF has procured specifically for Spec Op missions are the ideal platform IMHO- they are large enough to carry serious numbers of cargo or personal and has serious range (complemented by IFR) to go wherever they need to. Not to mention the on-board avionics that are customised to allow for low-level, night time missions.


Having said that I do feel there is a need for a smaller fixed-wing platform under SOCOM's command like the C-27J. When the mainstream fleet gets its replacement to the Avro don't be surprised if the SOCOM gets a few of its own.


On the rotary-wing front- I feel this is the weakest area of the SOCOM as there are 0 platforms ear-marked for the SOCOM right now. Yes we are only in early stages of the plans so let's wait and see. The IA has plans for a dedicated helo SOAR to fly the ALH- this will now certainly pass to the SOCOM's shopping list. I think that India has an excellent Spec Ops support platform in the ALH MK.4 and I hope the SOCOM gets plenty of these birds.

As far as heavy-lift rotary-wing assets go I have heard murmurs around the MH-47G (the Spec Ops version of the CH-47 Chinook) and also the CV-22. But let's wait and see. I would love either one of these in Indian service specifically to support SOFs.

How do you know ???

There is no info in public domain on who filled in the tender of New assault rifle. And I think the testing of weapons will only commence later this year after the scrutiny of the tenders. Correct me if I am wrong

Sir, AFAIK the decision on the rifle is set for this year (2013) and deliveries are set for early 2014 to the IA. The process is in advanced stages.


I hope the ARX-160 is the winner. Although I don't think this will have much affect on the Indian SOFs.


@Sergi I would be VERY interested to hear what rumors you've heard.






+ I wish the money being spent on raising additional Mountain corps was spent on the raising of the SOCOM. Raising SOCOM is going to be a VERY expensive job and that $10BN would go a long way in setting up this SOCOM. And IMHO the money would be better spent on the SOCOM that is a strategic asset and has a much higher chance of being used on a day-day basis. The Mountain Corps is just going to sit there and train- Indian SOFs are in combat on a daily basis.

 

[Sergi]

@Abingdonboy :
there certainly are opinion differences at TOP between some MOD babus and high ranking uniform men.
AFAIK Unified command was/is a need felt by our services while planning some OPS ( DON'T know which or when) where mixing SFs was handy but coordination task usually took time. Thats what i could dig. But therr is definatly something more which we don't know: D

Babus at MOD think unification of NSG and other SFs will reduce time and costs of trainning, command and infra.
services dont agree to this as of now as they will have be bear HOME ministry in this. One more civilian body for no reason. And NSG already had regional hubs and good reputation.

On c130 or c17 i agree with your point but i am pretty sure i heard 17 and chinook. But i dont think they will get both at the same time

( posting from mobile and it su@k)

 

[COLDHEARTED AVIATOR]

@Abingdonboy

Mate,NSG can be used for offense roles too and there were a few operations in mid 90s in the Kashmir valley where they were called in and I think they would be a good addition to the SOCOM with their upgrades,experience and skill moreover their role will be to look for Special Operation inside the internal territory while the other units can concentrate on external threats.