What's new

Indian Navy delays sailing into new era of ‘invisible’ warships

lol chinese navy u have 24 destroyers out of which 16 r obsolete which is also called as defence less ships(no sam's and no ani submarine warfare)65% needs immediate replacement out of 47 frigates 30 r on life support cant even hit the sees and r sitting in the docks 53 diesel subs...lets do a quick analysis
16 of dem soviet class 1950's obsolete version(somebody was bragging abt purcasing weapons:sniper::sniper:)
14 of them ming class remember 2003 incident..d boat submerged under water n deisel engine failed all d oxygen was inhaled and 70 crew men died)
kilo class 12 bought from russia(we r chinese n we dont purchase anything)lol what a joke
and yeah ever heard of aircraft carrier before??? i think there is only one in asia which in NOT OPERATED BY CHINA
THINK BEFORE U POST NEXT TIME...

lol do i need to bring up the greatest air force in the world (at crashing jets) destroying the reputation of the combat proven MiG-21?

Our GOOD destroyers outnumber ALL your destroyers. Our BAD destroyers outnumber ALL your frigates (and our BAD destroyers can take out your frigates as well :rofl:). Just our destroyers is worth more than your whole surface fleet excluding your 1950's era carriers. Put in your carriers... maybe we'll need 5 more patrol boats to take care of them :rofl:

There's a reason the US Navy does not even think about considering india as a threat, india's just too weak. The US coast guard could probably beat the Indian navy.
 
There's a reason the US Navy does not even think about considering india as a threat, india's just too weak. The US coast guard could probably beat the Indian navy.

I do not think US navy think Chinese Navy as a threat as well. Except maybe for the conventional subs. In any case, why is there a big debate on which of Navy is more powerful? Chinese and Indian navy are build differently. Indian navy is relying on latest Russian technology, which is superior to anything China can produce. But China can produce more advance weaponry than India domestically. So in terms of naval ships in service, once India have the Akula, it would be the most advance nuclear attack subs among Chinese and Indian navy. But China has more nuclear subs. China already has many "invisible" ships as described by the topic of the thread. But India has more options to purchase more advance destroyer and frigates, especially if it purchase even a strip down version of Arleigh Burke class with Aegis air defence. If it keep on relying on Russian suppliers, than its "quality superiority" would be in question very soon.
 
I do not think US navy think Chinese Navy as a threat as well. Except maybe for the conventional subs. In any case, why is there a big debate on which of Navy is more powerful? Chinese and Indian navy are build differently. Indian navy is relying on latest Russian technology, which is superior to anything China can produce. But China can produce more advance weaponry than India domestically. So in terms of naval ships in service, once India have the Akula, it would be the most advance nuclear attack subs among Chinese and Indian navy. But China has more nuclear subs. China already has many "invisible" ships as described by the topic of the thread. But India has more options to purchase more advance destroyer and frigates, especially if it purchase even a strip down version of Arleigh Burke class with Aegis air defence. If it keep on relying on Russian suppliers, than its "quality superiority" would be in question very soon.

depends on the exact field; russian electronics for the Su-27s purchased in 1994 were terrible and had to be completely overhauled, since the radar lost tracking of all other targets when it selected one for attack. that's not a minor problem.

also i'm pretty sure that a cold launch individual cell VLS is superior to both a cold launch revolver VLS which can easily jam and adds weight, and a hot launch individual cell VLS which needs complex exhaust systems, but this is a minor issue.

even the Russian Navy is no match for the USN... by now I'm not sure if Russia's low tonnage even lets it control its coastal waters. USN doesn't consider any other navy as a threat.
 
I'm interested in looking at what the new "invisible ship" look like. However, I think India should still go for the Arleigh Burke class with Aegis air defence. Otherwise, I do not see any substantial quality in the Indian navy over the Chinese navy. The domestic "invisible ship" certainly won't do.
 
lol do i need to bring up the greatest air force in the world (at crashing jets) destroying the reputation of the combat proven MiG-21?

Our GOOD destroyers outnumber ALL your destroyers. Our BAD destroyers outnumber ALL your frigates (and our BAD destroyers can take out your frigates as well :rofl:). Just our destroyers is worth more than your whole surface fleet excluding your 1950's era carriers. Put in your carriers... maybe we'll need 5 more patrol boats to take care of them :rofl:

There's a reason the US Navy does not even think about considering india as a threat, india's just too weak. The US coast guard could probably beat the Indian navy.


:rofl::rofl::rofl: first ur destroyers have to sail though they dont have anything against air to air defence and submariine defence warfare..make dem as museums and u may earn some money..hahaha and rest about mig 21 they crash coz they fly unlike chinese **** which cannot even fly i wonder why???
 
lol do i need to bring up the greatest air force in the world (at crashing jets) destroying the reputation of the combat proven MiG-21?

Our GOOD destroyers outnumber ALL your destroyers. Our BAD destroyers outnumber ALL your frigates (and our BAD destroyers can take out your frigates as well :rofl:). Just our destroyers is worth more than your whole surface fleet excluding your 1950's era carriers. Put in your carriers... maybe we'll need 5 more patrol boats to take care of them :rofl:

There's a reason the US Navy does not even think about considering india as a threat, india's just too weak. The US coast guard could probably beat the Indian navy.

Is it only number which plays important role in defence or attack? No Technology or the generation of the vessal matters?

Could you please let me know the NO of good and bad destroyers and which generation the belong to.
And about US, you know too much abt their coast guard capbilities, are you afraid of their technology? Be practical while posting something. Check the history of ur navy and IN too and its war experiences.
 
I'm interested in looking at what the new "invisible ship" look like. However, I think India should still go for the Arleigh Burke class with Aegis air defence. Otherwise, I do not see any substantial quality in the Indian navy over the Chinese navy. The domestic "invisible ship" certainly won't do.

The situation is opposite what you have said.

India Navy has complete technological edge over PLAN. From submarines to missiles to torpedoes to electronic warfare systems to space capabilities.

1) There is no equivalent of P-8I in any other Asian navy forget PLAN.
2) There is no equivalent of Brahmos in any other Navy except RuN forget PLAN.
3) There is no equivalent of MF-STAR+Barak-NG combination in PLAN.Indian Navy choose it over Aegis as it is better in certain expect and suite IN's req better.
4) There is no equivalent of Vikramaditya and IAC in any other Asian Navy.
5) Indian Navy have complete net centric warfare programme as well as space based reconn and tracking systems.
6) There is no equivalent of Akula-II and Scorpene in PLAN.

So tell us about something in PLAN that is better than IN, except longer range SLBM which cannot be used for naval warfare. lol
 
The situation is opposite what you have said.

India Navy has complete technological edge over PLAN. From submarines to missiles to torpedoes to electronic warfare systems to space capabilities.

1) There is no equivalent of P-8I in any other Asian navy forget PLAN.
2) There is no equivalent of Brahmos in any other Navy except RuN forget PLAN.
3) There is no equivalent of MF-STAR+Barak-NG combination in PLAN.Indian Navy choose it over Aegis as it is better in certain expect and suite IN's req better.
4) There is no equivalent of Vikramaditya and IAC in any other Asian Navy.
5) Indian Navy have complete net centric warfare programme as well as space based reconn and tracking systems.
6) There is no equivalent of Akula-II and Scorpene in PLAN.

So tell us about something in PLAN that is better than IN, except longer range SLBM which cannot be used for naval warfare. lol

How does India has P8I if US doesn't even produce them yet. For some reason, I feel most Indian members regard purchased or yet to be developed weaponry as "already operational" in this forum.

But I have to applaud that India is purchasing from boeing though as US weaponry has astronomical edge over any other.

As for Brahmos, its a short range version of an existing Russian anti-ship missle. US has the ability to shoot it down with evolve sparrows. As a defensive weapon, it will be export soon.

AS for Anti-air defence, I seriously doubt that anything produce by India can have any parameter that surpasses Aegis ABM. I believe China has some integrated anti-air defence but I'm not sure its ability as compare to what India can produce. But the point I was trying to make is that with China's technological advancement, in 20 years, China should surpass Russia and maybe Europe in technology advancement. So if India want any edge over China in the future, it will need US and only US technology.

Finally, Russian tech sucks and Europeans are not that far behind.
 
How does India has P8I if US doesn't even produce them yet. For some reason, I feel most Indian members regard purchased or yet to be developed weaponry as "already operational" in this forum.

LOL your were talking about Aegis that Indian Navy not even bought! But India already bought P-8I and US started producing P-8A. Three being built and under going flight tests. Indian Navy will get first P-8I within two years.

But I have to applaud that India is purchasing from boeing though as US weaponry has astronomical edge over any other.

Before selecting Boeing India verified aircrafts from France, Israel ad Russia.

As for Brahmos, its a short range version of an existing Russian anti-ship missle. US has the ability to shoot it down with evolve sparrows. As a defensive weapon, it will be export soon.

We were talking about PLAN.

AS for Anti-air defence, I seriously doubt that anything produce by India can have any parameter that surpasses Aegis ABM. I believe China has some integrated anti-air defence but I'm not sure its ability as compare to what India can produce. But the point I was trying to make is that with China's technological advancement, in 20 years, China should surpass Russia and maybe Europe in technology advancement. So if India want any edge over China in the future, it will need US and only US technology.


As far as technology is concerned China will not be in position to surpass Russia/Europe in decades to come. They needs help from Russia for everything in every way. It will take many decades for China to produce equivalent of PAK FA, Akula or Type-45 and many other things.

India have access to US, Israeli, Russian and European technologies. India buys the weapons that she felt better. US weapons is not always better wrt money. For example China may reverse engineer S-300 and Su-27 but that doesn't mean they are better than the original products. Innovation and reverse engineering is two completely different things.

Technology wise MF-STAR+Barak-NG is better than what China can get before 2020.

Finally, Russian tech sucks and Europeans are not that far behind.

100% wrong. Recent exercises with Europe and US proved that Russia have edged in some area. Russia produces some of the best missiles, fighters, ships, submarines in the world.
 
LOL your were talking about Aegis that Indian Navy not even bought! But India already bought P-8I and US started producing P-8A. Three being built and under going flight tests. Indian Navy will get first P-8I within two years.

Before selecting Boeing India verified aircrafts from France, Israel ad Russia.



We were talking about PLAN.




As far as technology is concerned China will not be in position to surpass Russia/Europe in decades to come. They needs help from Russia for everything in every way. It will take many decades for China to produce equivalent of PAK FA, Akula or Type-45 and many other things.

India have access to US, Israeli, Russian and European technologies. India buys the weapons that she felt better. US weapons is not always better wrt money. For example China may reverse engineer S-300 and Su-27 but that doesn't mean they are better than the original products. Innovation and reverse engineering is two completely different things.

Technology wise MF-STAR+Barak-NG is better than what China can get before 2020.

100% wrong. Recent exercises with Europe and US proved that Russia have edged in some area. Russia produces some of the best missiles, fighters, ships, submarines in the world.

When it comes to defence industry, nothing Russia produces in superior to west. Its true that certain specific European components can be better than what US can produce but that is because US choose to go in another direction. US cannot focus on everything as Obama choose to focus on expanding the government instead of defending the country.

As for ship born air defence technology. I doubt that India-Israel can produce anything close to Aegis ABM. As for China's ABM on their ships, I only read about they have technology that is similar to the 80-90 Aegis capability. I'm not sure how that measure up against he system produce by India as I'm not an expert.

As for China could eventually catch up with Russia. technology development requires money. If the current economic growth trend continues, China will eventually surpass the US in technology eventually. Even though it might be 100 years from now as US has a technology lead and is continually padding that lead as US has 3 times the GDP of China. But if the current trend of economic growth continues, than China will eventually surpass the US. But of course, economic growth rate might change and 100 years is a long time.
 
When it comes to defence industry, nothing Russia produces in superior to west. Its true that certain specific European components can be better than what US can produce but that is because US choose to go in another direction. US cannot focus on everything as Obama choose to focus on expanding the government instead of defending the country.
It was difficult for Europe to develop 4th+ generation fighter EFT now Russia developed 5th generation fighter. Russian missiles like S-400, S-300, Brahmos, Club are better than US and European equivalents.

As for ship born air defence technology. I doubt that India-Israel can produce anything close to Aegis ABM. As for China's ABM on their ships, I only read about they have technology that is similar to the 80-90 Aegis capability. I'm not sure how that measure up against he system produce by India as I'm not an expert.

First Aegis was a combat system, similar things already there in Indian Navy ships. If you talk about BMD than India is not considering BMD for ships because we don't need it.

China have no BMD on their ships. The phased array radars and long range SAM doesn't mean BMD.

Barak-NG is good for India. Its technology is the best of its kind. Very very difficult to survive from it.

As for China could eventually catch up with Russia. technology development requires money. If the current economic growth trend continues, China will eventually surpass the US in technology eventually. Even though it might be 100 years from now as US has a technology lead and is continually padding that lead as US has 3 times the GDP of China. But if the current trend of economic growth continues, than China will eventually surpass the US. But of course, economic growth rate might change and 100 years is a long time.

If money could do everything than Japan already had the second best defence industry in the world! Arab country should do good as well but they didn't. Russia, Europe and US's technological base is much more higher than China and India. Now India getting some helps to fill the gap but China doesn't.
 
Last edited:
When it comes to defence industry, nothing Russia produces in superior to west. Its true that certain specific European components can be better than what US can produce but that is because US choose to go in another direction. US cannot focus on everything as Obama choose to focus on expanding the government instead of defending the country.

As for ship born air defence technology. I doubt that India-Israel can produce anything close to Aegis ABM. As for China's ABM on their ships, I only read about they have technology that is similar to the 80-90 Aegis capability. I'm not sure how that measure up against he system produce by India as I'm not an expert.

As for China could eventually catch up with Russia. technology development requires money. If the current economic growth trend continues, China will eventually surpass the US in technology eventually. Even though it might be 100 years from now as US has a technology lead and is continually padding that lead as US has 3 times the GDP of China. But if the current trend of economic growth continues, than China will eventually surpass the US. But of course, economic growth rate might change and 100 years is a long time.

dont do propaganda here for chinese....
Yes in some years even India will overtake every other country in this world....if it were to continue development like now and China/US were to continue to decline in future......

India will catch up earlier with european/western then China...infact much earlier .....coz india beleives in Innovation and not copy paste...
 
How does India has P8I if US doesn't even produce them yet. For some reason, I feel most Indian members regard purchased or yet to be developed weaponry as "already operational" in this forum.

But I have to applaud that India is purchasing from boeing though as US weaponry has astronomical edge over any other.

As for Brahmos, its a short range version of an existing Russian anti-ship missle. US has the ability to shoot it down with evolve sparrows. As a defensive weapon, it will be export soon.

AS for Anti-air defence, I seriously doubt that anything produce by India can have any parameter that surpasses Aegis ABM. I believe China has some integrated anti-air defence but I'm not sure its ability as compare to what India can produce. But the point I was trying to make is that with China's technological advancement, in 20 years, China should surpass Russia and maybe Europe in technology advancement. So if India want any edge over China in the future, it will need US and only US technology.

Finally, Russian tech sucks and Europeans are not that far behind.

This is what I call an un-educated reply.
US technology is not far ahead of its compitetors.If you fall for the R&D investments and fancy programs and PR, then let it be with you.Just dont spread the BS here.

Wait a min, and you are the one who says,russian tech sucks? when US desperate of russian SAMs and ABM. May be you should know that russia is going to throw few seats for US astronauts to reach ISS.
As for your information,Brahmos AShM is not short ranged.It is above medium ranged.If you call a 300km anti ship missile a short range, then I am interested to know what you term an 100km AShm ?

Before that,you should also have to know how an AShM works at sea rather than on paper.Also Brahmos is meant for IN needs and for couple of exports.This might clarify you that IN weapons systems are its present enemy specific.

And it is clear that India ventured into this technological race after long gestation periods.But still it put contemporary systems out there in the name of akash,Arjun,PAD,AAD,Samyukta(it is one of its own kind)Sword fish Radar,Sonars, what not?

IF IN stopped importing these very systems from abroad and is more than happy with indigenous means only that the Indian made are either comparable or better than what IN can get from abroad.

Mind you that,Indian armed forces are so picky in inducting home made weapons.But these days,the very forces are showing much interest in local systems( may be this has to be something beyond my ALU processing capability and only a person like you can solve it)

Talking about Aegis? ABM configeration is strictly country specific.The ABM that US developed might not answer the needs of India and vice versa.But on the good note, India has its own multi-tier ABM program that is going to deal with its own adversaries.DRDO is readying a ship launched variant for Phase-II of ABM program.As I said,we entered lately into the technology sphere, but brought up all the latest.

PAC-3 and THAAD are pretty good on paper and does carry aesthetic appearances,but didnt live upto the mark.

India can give program to program competition to either US/Europe.But unfortunately we are not rich and capitalists.We are a penny saving nation that only develops what it needs,but not go after luxury of spending spree.

Finally,May be as much as you know-your top brass didnt know much abt russian systems,hence they keep importing them and copying nut to nut and bolt to bolt designs.You should let them know about the russian standards and stop importing/copying them.
 
This is what I call an un-educated reply.
US technology is not far ahead of its compitetors.If you fall for the R&D investments and fancy programs and PR, then let it be with you.Just dont spread the BS here.

Wait a min, and you are the one who says,russian tech sucks? when US desperate of russian SAMs and ABM. May be you should know that russia is going to throw few seats for US astronauts to reach ISS.
As for your information,Brahmos AShM is not short ranged.It is above medium ranged.If you call a 300km anti ship missile a short range, then I am interested to know what you term an 100km AShm ?

Before that,you should also have to know how an AShM works at sea rather than on paper.Also Brahmos is meant for IN needs and for couple of exports.This might clarify you that IN weapons systems are its present enemy specific.

And it is clear that India ventured into this technological race after long gestation periods.But still it put contemporary systems out there in the name of akash,Arjun,PAD,AAD,Samyukta(it is one of its own kind)Sword fish Radar,Sonars, what not?

IF IN stopped importing these very systems from abroad and is more than happy with indigenous means only that the Indian made are either comparable or better than what IN can get from abroad.

Mind you that,Indian armed forces are so picky in inducting home made weapons.But these days,the very forces are showing much interest in local systems( may be this has to be something beyond my ALU processing capability and only a person like you can solve it)

Talking about Aegis? ABM configeration is strictly country specific.The ABM that US developed might not answer the needs of India and vice versa.But on the good note, India has its own multi-tier ABM program that is going to deal with its own adversaries.DRDO is readying a ship launched variant for Phase-II of ABM program.As I said,we entered lately into the technology sphere, but brought up all the latest.

PAC-3 and THAAD are pretty good on paper and does carry aesthetic appearances,but didnt live upto the mark.

India can give program to program competition to either US/Europe.But unfortunately we are not rich and capitalists.We are a penny saving nation that only develops what it needs,but not go after luxury of spending spree.

Finally,May be as much as you know-your top brass didnt know much abt russian systems,hence they keep importing them and copying nut to nut and bolt to bolt designs.You should let them know about the russian standards and stop importing/copying them.

Its obvious that Indian army and air force doesn't trust Indian domestically produced weaponry. The question is which other country should India procur them from. Many people talk about working with Russia and co-develop with Europeans. But India buy P8-I and transport planes from the US without TOT. Its clear that these are the best technology around. As India plans to import weapons in the future, why worry about TOT instead of getting the best possible weaponry, which are from the US.

As for comparing US vs Russian weapons, I won't waste my time as its obvious that US has the best technology. US is a generation away from the Russians. As matter in fact, Russian technology is closer to Indian and Ethiopian technology than to the US technology. This might not be the case during the cold war. But Russia is a shell of the former soviet union
 
faithfulguy I suppose you somehow have in depth knowledge of all American, Russian, Chinese, European weapons which is why you are able to conclude that American technology is the best? Or is it just blind patriotism?

*snort*

Tell me one technology, that the US has, which doesn't have an effective counter from non-US arsenals?
 
Back
Top Bottom