Indian Muslims on the creation of Pakistan

[American Pakistani]

I am only going by what MQM leader Altaf Husain says. Since he has loads of supporters in Pakistan, I suupose they must be endorsing his views that the creation of Pakistan was the biggest blunder in human history. as far as we are concerned, all I can say is;

" Janab aapka ghar hai. jab dil kare aa jaiye."

RK

lol I support MQM & Altaf Hussain some times talk nonsence i know, but he didn't mean what all thinks after his statement, he cleared his statement too in TV program. & plz dont try to divide us.

 

[LaBong]

The bold part is factually wrong. Although it sounds similar to Hindi, Bhojpuri, Maithili and other Bihari languages are more similar to Eastern Indo-European languages than Hindi/Urdu. But Biharis mostly speak Hindi/Urdu fluently. Urdu wasn't a tongue of West Pakistanis as well, not atleast at the time of partition.

I don't know how you can say Bhojpuri is similar to Bengali. Even though I can't speak Bhojpuri fluently (I can do a decent amount), I can understand Bhojpuri 100% listening to my grandparents speak, and my parents sometimes. I cannot make out one word of Bengali. I'm a full-blooded Bihari. Are you Bihari? How did you come to this conclusion? Care to share some examples as to how Bhojpuri is closer to Bengali than it is to Urdu? I'm not attacking you, I'm genuinely interested.

All Eastern Indian languages are derived from Magadhi. Bhojpuri like another Bihari language Maithili are sister language of Bengali, Assamese, Oriya etc. It's more like Hindi sounds similar to Bhojpuri than the other way around as Bhojpuri heavily influenced literary Hindi.

 

[American Pakistani]

We got few Mojars in BD... Anybody want them back???? Hello.....

I am UtterPradeshi Muhajir Pakistani & my heart pains watching my Bihari Muhajir Pakistanis in hostile land, my biggest pray to Allah(SAW) is Ya Allah Pak kisi polititions ko un per taras aajai Ameen. Inshallah they will come to their own land Pakistan from BDSh.

Long Live Mother Pakistan

 

[53fd]

Just an honest question. What Pakistan has done for Indian Muslims till date except for creating more trouble for them? Just look what Israel has done for the Jews and compare that with Pakistan.

Unfortunately, the partition of India was not smooth to say the least. A huge number of Muslims were left back in India. Muhajirs in Pakistan always had their siblings in India in their hearts, my grandmother is a testament to that. Unfortunately, Muslims in India after 1947 had to go through some very rough times, and they had to constantly prove their loyalties to India. India and Pakistan were at loggerheads with each other, & as I mentioned earlier; if anyone in India was seen to have 'links' to Pakistan, they would be in trouble. The Indians that left for Pakistan as Muhajirs (& vice versa) had to give up their passports. My Naana was 30 when 1947 happened, he had to surrender his Indian passport in Pakistan to become a Pakistani. The relations between the 2 countries were EXTREMELY hostile. These were some of the reasons why Pakistan couldn't help out Indian Muslims, it would be considered as treason on the part of Indian Muslims if Pakistan did that for them.

 

[53fd]

Well if reaching W Pak was difficult, E PAK was virtually next door . Those migrating to / from E Pak did not face pogroms as those in the West did.

I think you are also underestimating how popular Jinnah was in 1947. A lot of his ardent Muhajir followers just followed him where he went. He went to Karachi, so a lot of Muhajirs followed him. My Naani used to tell me her father was politically active, and was an ardent Muslim League supporter. He used to wear a cap that had a Muslim League logo on it (according to her). She used to tell me that her father literally 'worshiped' Jinnah.

 

[53fd]

All Eastern Indian languages are derived from Magadhi. Bhojpuri like another Bihari language Maithili are sister language of Bengali, Assamese, Oriya etc. It's more like Hindi sounds similar to Bhojpuri than the other way around as Bhojpuri heavily influenced literary Hindi.

According to this link; Bihari, Urdu and Bengali all fall into the "Indic Language" subfamily.

Indo-Iranian Languages

 

[LaBong]

All Eastern Indian languages are derived from Magadhi. Bhojpuri like another Bihari language Maithili are sister language of Bengali, Assamese, Oriya etc. It's more like Hindi sounds similar to Bhojpuri than the other way around as Bhojpuri heavily influenced literary Hindi.

According to this link; Bihari, Urdu and Bengali all fall into the "Indic Language" subfamily.

Indo-Iranian Languages

Yes, but there are sub-sub-families among them.

Dramatic Prakrit - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

^this will help.

 

[53fd]

Abir, not doubting anything you said before, but just out of curiosity. If the Biharis were closer to Bengalis in East Pakistan in terms of language than they were to Urdu speakers in West Pakistan, why did the Biharis living in East Pakistan side with West Pakistan against the Bengalis? The religions of East and West Pakistan were the same, the only real differences I can see are the languages, why did the Biharis support West Pakistan even though they were living in East Pakistan?

 

[53fd]

Even if you look today, the bulk of the Indian poverty comes from Bihar, parts of UP and present day Jharkhand. These are the places from where many poor Muslims either could not, or did not want to migrate to West Pakistan. A lot of poor Muslims from Bihar and UP stayed back, a lot of them went to East Pakistan, and became stateless after the 1971 war. Both Pakistan and India (and ESPECIALLY) their people have had to suffer so much since 1947. I have great respect for India. I have deep appreciation for its history and culture as well as my family roots, and I'm sure a true Indian who has 'history' in Pakistan would feel the same.

I've been to Patna, Delhi, Agra once; I would love to go back there again. But I have extreme love for Pakistan, and will do anything to defend it, sacrifice my life for it. That doesn't make my appreciation for India any less. But it's a sad reality though, that we breed so much common hate, yet share so much of the past. Manmohan Singh was born in present day Pakistani Punjab, Musharraf was born in Delhi; and then they had to switch allegiances. Sad.

 

[LaBong]

Abir, not doubting anything you said before, but just out of curiosity. If the Biharis were closer to Bengalis in East Pakistan in terms of language than they were to Urdu speakers in West Pakistan, why did the Biharis living in East Pakistan side with West Pakistan against the Bengalis? The religions of East and West Pakistan were the same, the only real differences I can see are the languages, why did the Biharis support West Pakistan even though they were living in East Pakistan?

Biharis in Bangladesh were mainly Urdu speakers. It was more of a cultural conflict in Bangladesh than a linguistic one.

Maithili literature and poets like Vidyapati(Vidyapati - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) contributed heavily towards the development of early Bengali. You'd be amazed to know Tagore's first major literary work was in Maithili style.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brajabuli

Brajabuli is an artificial literary language developed in the sixteenth century. It was created primarily due to the influence of Vidyapati's lyrics on the love of Radha and Krishna on the Bengali poets of the medieval period.

Brajabuli is basically Maithili (as prevalent during the medieval period) but its forms are modified to look like Bengali.[1]. The medieval Bengali poets, Gobindadas Kabiraj, Jnandas, Balaramdas and Narottamdas composed their padas (poems) in this language. Rabindranath Tagore also composed his Bhanusingha Thakurer Padabali (1884) in this language (he initially promoted these lyrics as those of a newly discovered poet, Bhanusingha). Other 19th century figures in the Bengal Renaissance like Bankim Chandra Chatterjee have also written in the Brajabuli.

Also what happened in Bangladesh should not be taken as that of Bengal's context. You don't see folks beating up Biharis in Calcutta for linguistic issues.

 

[Valiant_Soul]

I've been to Patna, Delhi, Agra once; I would love to go back there again. But I have extreme love for Pakistan, and will do anything to defend it, sacrifice my life for it. That doesn't make my appreciation for India any less. But it's a sad reality though, that we breed so much common hate, yet share so much of the past. Manmohan Singh was born in present day Pakistani Punjab, Musharraf was born in Delhi; and then they had to switch allegiances. Sad.

The enmity created and still is maintained is not a product of nationalism or idealism, it is a product of political and opportunist interests. Politicos on both sides use the enmity between India and Pakistan to promote self-interests. Unfortunately, though in the case of Pakistan, the enmity with India is one of the prime drivers of their interests. Successive leaders in Pakistan have used the hatred to serve their interests and the propagation of hatred in turn has created more malefic image of India in the eyes of Pakistanis. Ordinary citizens of Pakistan needlessly suffer, while playing in the hands of a few hate mongers or themselves following that ideology without second thoughts.

 

[53fd]

Just an honest question. What Pakistan has done for Indian Muslims till date except for creating more trouble for them? Just look what Israel has done for the Jews and compare that with Pakistan.

Ok, I believe Pakistan funds groups in Kashmir against India. BUTTTT, I don't think Pakistan funds the extreme Muslim groups in the states of UP & Bihar etc. Why? The Muslims in these areas are the poorest in the country, even worse than Dalits. The extreme form of Islam Deobandi (which follows the Sunni Hanafi school of thought, Zakir Naik today its prime example), which was the birthplace of the Taliban ideology formed in the 90's, was founded in Deoband, UP long before 1947 (in 1867 I believe), not in Pakistan. The extreme Deobandis opposed the creation of Pakistan. So I don't see Pakistan funding these groups. These groups resort to Jihad because of poverty & not being helped by the government.

Indian Muslims are the largest but the most impoverished minority in India. By shifting blaming Pakistan for ALL terrorism, I think India is not addressing the core issue that it needs to eradicate poverty. Once it does that, all the local Mujahideen groups (that Pakistan has nothing to do with) in Bihar, Jharkhand, UP will stop their terrorism. India has made a lot of progress generally, but a large number of Indian Muslims (in UP, Bihar, Jharkhand, Madhya Pradesh) suffer because of extreme poverty. Unfortunately, India has created ill feelings between Indian Muslims and the nation of Pakistan by accusing each and everything on Pakistan. Some of the claims are substantiated (Kashmir, Mumbai), others are not. India has done its fair share of things as well, but I won't go there in this post.

 

[Valiant_Soul]

Just an honest question. What Pakistan has done for Indian Muslims till date except for creating more trouble for them? Just look what Israel has done for the Jews and compare that with Pakistan.

Ok, I believe Pakistan funds groups in Kashmir against India. BUTTTT, I don't think Pakistan funds the extreme Muslim groups in the states of UP & Bihar etc. Why? The Muslims in these areas are the poorest in the country, even worse than Dalits. The extreme form of Islam Deobandi (which follows the Sunni Hanafi school of thought, Zakir Naik today its prime example), which served as the ideology for the formation of the Taliban in the 90's was founded in Deoband, UP long before 1947 (in 1867 I believe), not in Pakistan. The extreme Deobandis opposed the creation of Pakistan. So I don't see Pakistan funding these groups. These groups resort to Jihad because of poverty & not being helped by the government.

I don't know of any jehadi group from UP or Bihar. But talking of poverty, there is no reason to believe that Muslims in these parts have been left because of their religion. The poverty is widespread into all religions, Muslims more because of socio-economic history and lack of education. But that is purely administrative fault, not of any discriminatory nature. In fact, you see the pseudo secular parties of India have been 'looting' the votes of Muslims, promising them development and then showing them the thumb when elections are done. Just like terrorism, corruption too knows no religion, it only knows self-interests.

But that is all beginning to change now. Bihar, under new governance, is making significant strides in development, and you will for sure see significant changes in the area in the years to come.

 

[53fd]

I don't know of any jehadi group from UP or Bihar.

Naxalites have a strong presence in these 3 states. Although they are not Jihadi, they are trying to fight poverty in these states.

Some of the local Mujahideen groups are:

Student Islamic Movement of India (UP). Collaborates with LeT to conduct attacks across India.

I already told you about Deobandis in Deoband, UP.

Randhir group (Bihar). Attacks the local policemen and security personnel of the state.

Balbir militias (Bihar). Same as above. Established its self-proclaimed rule in more than 14 villages

Indian Mujahideen (spread all over India). claimed responsibility for the blasts in the cities of Jaipur, Bangalore, Ahmedabad and New Delhi, saying they were in revenge for attacks on Muslims across India.

I remember reading some other articles too, I can't find them right now. I'll update my post with the new material.

 

[luckyyy]

the interesing part was how jinnah able to create this illusion that muslims wants partition even he never been to subcontinent for most of his life...