Indian Ground Forces....The Future.

[MrIndianSikh]

Still its havier than modern assault rifles. For a army only trying to compete with smaller neibours it might be useful. But thread is regarding making IA one of the best and most modern Ground forces in the world, INSAAS really lags behind. We have the economy and IA soldiers deserves the best. The same attitude like u is costing our soldiers soldiers their dear life. When netaas and baboos can spend billions for luxury , yes we can spend a few billion to provide our soldiers with best assault rifle in the world.

it can't even fire in full auto it only can do 3 round burst and semi auto not to mention IA jawans in Kashmir have said the orange plastic camo on the rifle easily reveals their position same in the jungles of the tribal belt against Naxals

i am all for the use of indigenous equipment but INSAS is a dud its one ugly looking mofo that malfunctions after short usage IA should seriously buy K2 or M16 as they are proven platforms and reliable or even the TAR-21 and have it license produced by private firm NOT OFB

 

[baker]

Still its havier than modern assault rifles. For a army only trying to compete with smaller neibours it might be useful. But thread is regarding making IA one of the best and most modern Ground forces in the world, INSAAS really lags behind. We have the economy and IA soldiers deserves the best. The same attitude like u is costing our soldiers soldiers their dear life. When netaas and baboos can spend billions for luxury , yes we can spend a few billion to provide our soldiers with best assault rifle in the world.

Go easy with your comments.......

of course our ground forces need the best..... so what you want to do .. shutdown our OFB and DRDO... buy everything from US or other europeans....?

see whether you agree or not our economy is not at all in shape to buy the assault rifles that posted in above posts....

it can't even fire in full auto it only can do 3 round burst and semi auto not to mention IA jawans in Kashmir have said the orange plastic camo on the rifle easily reveals their position same in the jungles of the tribal belt against Naxals

i am all for the use of indigenous equipment but INSAS is a dud its one ugly looking mofo that malfunctions after short usage IA should seriously buy K2 or M16 as they are proven platforms and reliable or even the TAR-21 and have it license produced by private firm NOT OFB

oh god INSAS is semi automatic becaue our army wants in that way..... even US army M16A2 works the same way as insas.. and why do so many military forces in the world supply their regular troops with semi-automatic only weapons? That's because of the US experience in Vietnam. They noted that less experienced soldiers generally tended to hold the trigger down and spray the bushes when they came under attack. As a result, many of them ended up using all their ammunition within a couple of minutes. To prevent this situation from occurring, regular troops were supplied with semi-auto only weapons and fully-auto weapons were only supplied to special forces units, who are well trained to use fire discipline.

and FYI

http:///insas-rifles-prove-its-mattel-at-alaskan-heights

 

[Vibs]

Go easy with your comments.......

of course our ground forces need the best..... so what you want to do .. shutdown our OFB and DRDO... buy everything from US or other europeans....?

see whether you agree or not our economy is not at all in shape to buy the assault rifles that posted in above posts....




oh god INSAS is semi automatic becaue our army wants in that way..... even US army M16A2 works the same way as insas.. and why do so many military forces in the world supply their regular troops with semi-automatic only weapons? That's because of the US experience in Vietnam. They noted that less experienced soldiers generally tended to hold the trigger down and spray the bushes when they came under attack. As a result, many of them ended up using all their ammunition within a couple of minutes. To prevent this situation from occurring, regular troops were supplied with semi-auto only weapons and fully-auto weapons were only supplied to special forces units, who are well trained to use fire discipline.

and FYI

http:///insas-rifles-prove-its-mattel-at-alaskan-heights

Insisting on dependence on above average Indian made weapons is not the way to take the DRDO and OFB forward. Look at HAL. Only after buying and licence manufacturing SU30's were they able to build a base to develop Tejas. The same goes for the Navy which is constructing French Scorpene Submarines at Mazgaon to develop in-house capabilities.
By going for advanced foreign attack rifles we achieve 2 objectives.
1. Equipping our soldiers with the best weapons
2. Developing in-house capabilities through licensed manufacturing

DRDO and OFB cannot be given preference over other quality manufacturers.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

Go easy with your comments.......

of course our ground forces need the best..... so what you want to do .. shutdown our OFB and DRDO... buy everything from US or other europeans....?

see whether you agree or not our economy is not at all in shape to buy the assault rifles that posted in above posts....




oh god INSAS is semi automatic becaue our army wants in that way..... even US army M16A2 works the same way as insas.. and why do so many military forces in the world supply their regular troops with semi-automatic only weapons? That's because of the US experience in Vietnam. They noted that less experienced soldiers generally tended to hold the trigger down and spray the bushes when they came under attack. As a result, many of them ended up using all their ammunition within a couple of minutes. To prevent this situation from occurring, regular troops were supplied with semi-auto only weapons and fully-auto weapons were only supplied to special forces units, who are well trained to use fire discipline.

and FYI

http:///insas-rifles-prove-its-mattel-at-alaskan-heights

Its not about DRDO or OFB, its about life of our soldiers. If they cant produce the best for soldiers what the use of having them. For gods sake They use billions in the name of R&D, and they produce a sub standerd weapon. I simply cant understand IA logic, they buy tanks from abroad instead Procuring ARJUNs and same top brach gives thumbs up to Inaas. Why??? Becoz there is little chance in getting Bribes in procurment of guns.
I will still say our army deserves the best and untill and unless OFB and DRDO donot produces and world beater assault rifle, we should procure from abroad.

 

[baker]

Insisting on dependence on above average Indian made weapons is not the way to take the DRDO and OFB forward. Look at HAL. Only after buying and licence manufacturing SU30's were they able to build a base to develop Tejas. The same goes for the Navy which is constructing French Scorpene Submarines at Mazgaon to develop in-house capabilities.
By going for advanced foreign attack rifles we achieve 2 objectives.
1. Equipping our soldiers with the best weapons
2. Developing in-house capabilities through licensed manufacturing

DRDO and OFB cannot be given preference over other quality manufacturers.

devellopment of Su 30 has nothing to do with Tejas.. we started in house production of su 30 at around 2001-2002 by the time we already had made the first flight of tejas

 

[Vibs]

devellopment of Su 30 has nothing to do with Tejas.. we started in house production of su 30 at around 2001-2002 by the time we already had made the first flight of tejas

Should have been more clear. Tejas is still only 60-65% indegenous. The development of versions that could clear IOC came in after HAL was able to modify the Su 30 MKI to make it the most advanced flanker in operation. Also it was at best a 3-3.5 generation plane. Within a decade we are looking at designs and test flights of a 4th gen Mk2. Had this been done for attack rifles we could probably have the expertise to better develop a indegenous version of an attack rifle. Even the Insas could have been upgraded.

 

[danger007]

Should have been more clear. Tejas is still only 60-65% indegenous. The development of versions that could clear IOC came in after HAL was able to modify the Su 30 MKI to make it the most advanced flanker in operation. Also it was at best a 3-3.5 generation plane. Within a decade we are looking at designs and test flights of a 4th gen Mk2. Had this been done for attack rifles we could probably have the expertise to better develop a indegenous version of an attack rifle. Even the Insas could have been upgraded.

r u saying su-30mki 3-3.5 gen jet or tejas????

 

[Vibs]

r u saying su-30mki 3-3.5 gen jet or tejas????

I'm talking about tejas.

 

[danger007]

I'm talking about tejas.

it was a 4+ gen jet.

 

[Vibs]

it was a 4+ gen jet.

They wanted to make it one. But it isn't. Mk 2 is potentially.

 

[danger007]

They wanted to make it one. But it isn't. Mk 2 is potentially.

on what basis u saying tejas is 3gen jet. mk2 is upgrade of initial jet.

1] Quadruplex fly-by-wire.
2] All weather, multi-role capability.
3] Multi-mode radar of range 100 kms.
4] Cockpit of international standards with HOTAS, multiple MFDs, and advanced HUD.
(Photo of cockpit: Aerospaceweb.org | Aircraft Museum - Cockpit Panels)
5] Capability to carry BVR weapons, and laser-guided bombs. Has laser pod, and FLIR.

 

[Vibs]

on what basis u saying tejas is 3gen jet. mk2 is upgrade of initial jet.

1] Quadruplex fly-by-wire.
2] All weather, multi-role capability.
3] Multi-mode radar of range 100 kms.
4] Cockpit of international standards with HOTAS, multiple MFDs, and advanced HUD.
(Photo of cockpit: Aerospaceweb.org | Aircraft Museum - Cockpit Panels)
5] Capability to carry BVR weapons, and laser-guided bombs. Has laser pod, and FLIR.

Shortly after two Tejases roared into the sky for a quick flight display, Naik went on to describe the Tejas as a "MiG-21++" fighter, and went on to say, "At present it is not a fourth generation aircraft. It will come up, but at present it is not." He also indicated that the Tejas Mk-II would not only be powered by the F414 engine, but would incorporate airframe design changes and newer avionics. A statement issued today by ADA today said that the IAF had projected a need for 83 Tejas Mk-II aircraft (which would give the IAF a fleet of 123 aircraft in total -- far less than projected). The first flight of the Mk-II is scheduled for December 2014. Indigenous content on the Mk-II will be 75 per cent according to the HAL chief.
Can we get back to the topic now.

 

[danger007]

Shortly after two Tejases roared into the sky for a quick flight display, Naik went on to describe the Tejas as a "MiG-21++" fighter, and went on to say, "At present it is not a fourth generation aircraft. It will come up, but at present it is not." He also indicated that the Tejas Mk-II would not only be powered by the F414 engine, but would incorporate airframe design changes and newer avionics. A statement issued today by ADA today said that the IAF had projected a need for 83 Tejas Mk-II aircraft (which would give the IAF a fleet of 123 aircraft in total -- far less than projected). The first flight of the Mk-II is scheduled for December 2014. Indigenous content on the Mk-II will be 75 per cent according to the HAL chief.
Can we get back to the topic now.

u cant jump from 3gen -4 gen with upgrades.u can make it frm 4gen to 4.5gen.

 

[Vibs]

u cant jump from 3gen -4 gen with upgrades.u can make it frm 4gen to 4.5gen.

There is a thread to debate about Tejas. Not this one. SO we can continue there if you like. ANd it's not upgrade it's redesigning the plane for mk2.
Tejas Mk-II would not only be powered by the F414 engine, but would incorporate airframe design changes and newer avionics.

 

[danger007]

There is a thread to debate about Tejas. Not this one. SO we can continue there if you like. ANd it's not upgrade it's redesigning the plane for mk2.
Tejas Mk-II would not only be powered by the F414 engine, but would incorporate airframe design changes and newer avionics.

ok please gimme link of it. and Tejas Mark 2 - Featuring more powerful General Electric F414-GE-INS6 engine with 120 kN of thrust and refined aerodynamics