India to spend $3 billion for 3 more Talwar-class frigates

[lilaspr]

This here....

Royal Navy's Deadly New £1 Billion Supersub!

its good, to be in more clear India will never get such a submarine from US/UK (its best tech from both countries), the only country can get is Israel not even my country Germany.

Indian navy is not stupid enough to request MOD for it.

 

[arp2041]

Simply, Russia is taking the Indians for a ride with this frigate at 1 billion per ship.

Can we cut the crap here??

Simply Put, NO ONE, i repeat, NO ONE knows the real Price of these Frigates nor the weapons complement of them as the final contract is still some months away, $1 billion a Piece is the SPECULATION of the author.

its good, to be in more clear India will never get such a submarine from US/UK (its best tech from both countries), the only country can get is Israel not even my country Germany.

Indian navy is not stupid enough to request MOD for it.

Actually we don't need them on the first place.

We have our own SSBN & SSN programs in the various stages + we have 1 Akula II already on the lease with talks for another one in the process.

+ Israel can get nuke subs??

 

[janon]

Can we cut the crap here??

Simply Put, NO ONE, i repeat, NO ONE knows the real Price of these Frigates nor the weapons complement of them as the final contract is still some months away, $1 billion a Piece is the SPECULATION of the author.



Actually we don't need them on the first place.

We have our own SSBN & SSN programs in the various stages + we have 1 Akula II already on the lease with talks for another one in the process.

+ Israel can get nuke subs??

Israel doesn't need nuke subs, since its enemies are all quite close. And the Mediterranean sea is not as large as the Indian Ocean.

Is this website and author reliable? There are several inaccuracies and errors. For one thing, the three follow on talwars all have brahmos. Also, the article states that the "Brahmos naval variant" could not be developed on time. But in fact, Brahmos BEGAN as a naval anti-ship missile, and it was the navy that first inducted it. The land attack and air launched variants came later, those were the "variants", not the naval version, which was the original one.

But India going for another three Talwars, based on the Krivak-IV was reported last year too. Excellent decision IMO. Provides a nice force structure to the navy.

 

[arp2041]

Israel doesn't need nuke subs, since its enemies are all quite close. And the Mediterranean sea is not as large as the Indian Ocean.

Is this website and author reliable? There are several inaccuracies and errors. For one thing, the three follow on talwars all have brahmos. Also, the article states that the "Brahmos naval variant" could not be developed on time. But in fact, Brahmos BEGAN as a naval anti-ship missile, and it was the navy that first inducted it. The land attack and air launched variants came later, those were the "variants", not the naval version, which was the original one.

But India going for another three Talwars, based on the Krivak-IV was reported last year too. Excellent decision IMO. Provides a nice force structure to the navy.

Mate don't know about the author but "Russia & India Report a.k.a indrus.in" is a credible website, have been following it since a long time & many important threads are opened here taking it as a source.

Though not ruling out any inaccuracies on the part of the author as he is just a Journalist & not a defense expert.

+ on the Israel part - On the contrary, Israel do need a nuke sub & would not be surprised if it gets one, as you said that it's enemies are all close so it makes it's nuclear delivery platforms vulnerable plus the Mediterranean sea is filled with European powers & Israel's neighbors so it is very congested/contested sea so as to say.

One of the Important aspect of Indo-Israeli aspect was close IN & Israeli Navy's relations, since Israel want access to IO so as to safely launch underwater missiles of which Israel has the complete tech.

 

[Dillinger]

@arp2041 The reason is actually pretty simple, our shipyards needed to be vacated of the frigate orders for two reasons:-

1) After the roaring success of the Shivalik Class Stealth frigate the IN felt that another such patently heavy frigate is feasible only if it comes out with all the bells and whistles. Mind you, the superstructure of the Shivalik is as stealthy as stealthy can get but the masts and the uncovered deck are spoilers. The P-17A Project will rectify this with a flush deck and completely refined mast with integrated sensors.

2) To do the above, and to progress with such a critical project the aforementioned shipyards needed to be upgraded. Which, if you read the news was completed just last year, I'll dig up the articles I had on the completion of the said major upgrades and post them later.

In the mean time a lighter albeit equally armed alternative was required and ergo the Talwar Class. Mind you, this is not a stop gap due to unavailability of indigenous articles but rather a stop gap meant to cover for the lead time and seed investment that have been done in our shipbuilding sector so as to speed up our projects such as the P-17A all the while maintaining some of the IN's force levels at sea as fa as principle surface combatants go.

 

[ralphleo]

Friends!

I love when i hear news like this where price is a little too much! 1B USD is way too much. IF the price was quoted in INR I would have accepted that cos USD has not appreciated since then therefore steep appreciation in price in USD terms looks fishy. So i did some research and came up with these 5 reasons for the hefty payment

- The Anti-Sub capability is below par in Krivak. They can be targeted by subs having torpedos beyond 10 Km range. The extra money is to include a better ASW capability that will then become the standard for rest of Indian ships. Various IN ships face a lack of powerful anti-sub punch so this follow on deal is a way to get hands on advanced ASW tech.

- Second Nuke boat will be funded using this additional money. (Why would navy wait for 3rd frigate to be delivered to place a follow on order. It makes little sense for prodcuction and suppllychain point of view. It would have made more sense for IN to place the order last year itself after having received 4 Krivaks. They are waiting for russians to come back with the quote for second INS Chakra completion)

- They are not seeking help for second INS Arihant. Indians are fairly confident on the capabilities and their ability to deliver. The technology seed for advanced nuke subs has already been sown and DRDO doesn't need more help to expedite things.

- Brahmos is not the reason for hike in prices. A pack of 8 Brahmos vis-a vis Klub costs only approx. 10M USD more

- These ships might get the advanced Barak missile for Anti Air role. Some money will move into Israeli hands.

- There is one extremely important component that i am still researching about. I am not sure about it but will post once i learn more. It has something to do with rocket propelled torpedo tech!!!

More later!

 

[OrionHunter]

Is a destroyer bigger faster better armed ship* and a frigate* is smaller lesser armed* and slower...have I got it right or is there more to it? @arp2041

There are Cruisers too, which are modern guided-missile vessels that are used primarily in a battle force role.

Destroyers, like Cruisers, are guided-missile vessels. They take part in a variety of missions, supporting carrier and expeditionary strike groups and surface strike groups. They are much larger than frigates.

Frigates are multi-purpose platforms capable of long-range, long-endurance independent low and medium intensity missions. They are equipped with advanced weapons, sensors and computer processing ability to defeat multiple air, surface and subsurface threats simultaneously and surviving in a high intensity battle environment. Stealth frigates are getting popular in many navies including India.

Cheers!

 

[qwerrty]

It's better for India to build the hull/structure of the ship themselves and import those equipments for self installation instead. Unless Indian politicians get a lot of "commission" from the Russian for this kind of deal.

their p-17 and new ddg doing just that and still at the shipyard after 15 years. you think they don't know this is a rip off? they just have no other choice..

 

[kaykay]

their p-17 and new ddg doing just that and still at the shipyard after 15 years. you think they don't know this is a rip off? they just have no other choice..

Hello! get out of your hole and see the world pls.....P17s are in active service for quite some time now.....

 

[selvan33]

their p-17 and new ddg doing just that and still at the shipyard after 15 years. you think they don't know this is a rip off? they just have no other choice..

am sure you are a moron. we already inducted our three frigates of project 17. and we will start to induct our p17a frigates from 2017 or 2018. so shut your trolling mouth.

 

[Koovie]

their p-17 and new ddg doing just that and still at the shipyard after 15 years. you think they don't know this is a rip off? they just have no other choice..

Are you really sooo desperate to troll????

P17 class frigates in service:

Now shut up troll

 

[RISING SUN]

Yesterday I was thinking whether there is any possibility that 2nd Akula is secretly added into this deal. Earlier deal was also done in same manner. There are only two deals in which we can add/ink some secret clauses with Russia for naval role in near future. 1 frigate and another one sub deal. Sub deal is multi vendor. So I don't think India will take chance there, but in the case of frigate there is chance for such manipulation. Earlier price was 1.6 billion dollars for 3 frigates, even if we increase it to 2 billion dollars for 3 frigates, still there is 1 billion dollar left. That may include 1 Akula sub because earlier stated price for 1st Akula was some 900 million dollars.

 

[qwerrty]

am sure you are a moron. we already inducted our three frigates of project 17. and we will start to induct our p17a frigates from 2017 or 2018. so shut your trolling mouth.

p15 still no where ready laidown since early 2000's. that tiny size p17 took about a decade to complete

 

[selvan33]

p15 still no where ready laidown since early 2000's. that tiny size p17 took about a decade to complete

really!!! p17 frigates are tiny size. you know p17 frigates are 6 tonnes not a 4 tonne size frigates.

 

[Koovie]

p15 still no where ready laidown since early 2000's. that tiny size p17 took about a decade to complete

Ok, +6000 tonnes are tiny...

P15s are almost finished, the 1st one will be commissioned in this year.

Again, your level of stupidity is astonishing