India to spend $3 billion for 3 more Talwar-class frigates

[Roybot]

By 'they' you mean Indian I guess. Four will be constructed by Mazgaon Dock Ltd in Mumbai and three by Garden Reach Shipbuilders & Engineers in Kolkata.

And you're spot on with the cost. But these are far more expensive than the Talwar Class frigs or even the Shivaliks because Lockheed Martin and Hyundai Heavy Industries have jointly responded to the Project 17A combat systems Request for Information (RFI) issued by Indian Navy. They have offered the Aegis Combat System to be included in its Project 17A frigate proposal.

Fair enough. But we don't exactly know the details of what goodies will be inside the follow on Talwar class. Who is to say that Russians haven't come up some AegisSki of their own.

Needless to say the $3 Billion figure is still speculative. It could be less, or the deal could include more than what meets the eyes.

 

[danger007]

How about buying destroyer from SK with Aegis tech? If i am not wrong IN is not like IA and IAF..... they are doing best as they can....

 

[joekrish]

Is a destroyer bigger faster better armed ship* and a frigate* is smaller lesser armed* and slower...have I got it right or is there more to it? @arp2041

 

[GR!FF!N]

Roger Rose, head of Lockheed martin, India said that the Indian Navy is buying the world’s most advanced shipboard Weapons System, the Aegis Combat System (ACS) for Project 17A. The US Navy has briefed the Indian Navy on the capabilities of the world's premier area air defense combat system. Other Asia Pacific navies operating Aegis systems are Japan, South Korea and Australia. Lockheed Martin and Hyundai Heavy Industries had included the Aegis CMS concept when answering the Project 17A RFI.

any confirmed report on "India buying Aegis"??I only heard that they offered us Aegis.there was no confirmation on buying,and we are also buying Barak-8 which will be deployed on P-17A

Fair enough. But we don't exactly know the details of what goodies will be inside the follow on Talwar class. Who is to say that Russians haven't come up some AegisSki of their own.

Needless to say the $3 Billion figure is still speculative. It could be less, or the deal could include more than what meets the eyes.

there is strong possibilities of what you are saying...

read this..

http://en.rian.ru/military_news/20120831/175538466.html

 

[Koovie]

How about buying destroyer from SK with Aegis tech? If i am not wrong IN is not like IA and IAF..... they are doing best as they can....

Thats not gonna happen, using AEGIS would mean that we had to share highly sensitive information with the US.

 

[UKBengali]

Okay, the price was $533 million in 2006, keeping in mind standard cost inflation, advanced stealth feature and VLS Brahmos, the price quote of $1 Billion does makes sense.



The displacement of our Frigates is good enough to pass on as Destroyers in many countries. And for the $1 billion part, do some search on net.

OK. let's be blunt here.

India got ripped off in 2006 and is getting ripped off again in 2013.

Compare this ship with the Type-054A from China. They are around the same displacement of around 4,000 tonnes if anyone would like to check.

Last batch of ships that were procured for just over 500 million dollars in 2006 were equipped with only 24 medium-range SAMs while the China Type-054A that appeared in 2007 has 32 medium-range SAMs, while costing around 250 million dollars a ship. Let's not get into any arguments as to the quality of the two ships as we all know that Russia would have sold the Talwar class to China if it wanted it.

I know that Russia has to make some profit but it looks like India is being completely ripped off here and am amazed that any Indian in their right mind would be happy about this at all!!!

Not even more advanced Western Frigates cost anywhere near 1 billion dollars each to purchase.

 

[Mirza Jatt]

I have always said on the forum....India should partner with SK to develop warships..they also have the experience and we'll surely save some of the dollars.

 

[shiv]

OK. let's be blunt here.

India got ripped off in 2006 and is getting ripped off again in 2013.

Compare this ship with the Type-054A from China. They are around the same displacement of around 4,000 tonnes if anyone would like to check.

Last batch of ships that were procured for just over 500 million dollars in 2006 were equipped with only 24 medium-range SAMs while the China Type-054A that appeared in 2007 has 32 medium-range SAMs, while costing around 250 million dollars a ship. Let's not get into any arguments as to the quality of the two ships as we all know that Russia would have sold the Talwar class to China if it wanted it.

I know that Russia has to make some profit but it looks like India is being completely ripped off here and am amazed that any Indian in their right mind would be happy about this at all!!!

Not even more advanced Western Frigates cost anywhere near 1 billion dollars each to purchase.

Our local shipbuilding yards are full And please compare type054 frigates with our indigenous p17 frigates.. till then GTFO !

 

[Skull and Bones]

OK. let's be blunt here.

India got ripped off in 2006 and is getting ripped off again in 2013.

Compare this ship with the Type-054A from China. They are around the same displacement of around 4,000 tonnes if anyone would like to check.

Last batch of ships that were procured for just over 500 million dollars in 2006 were equipped with only 24 medium-range SAMs while the China Type-054A that appeared in 2007 has 32 medium-range SAMs, while costing around 250 million dollars a ship. Let's not get into any arguments as to the quality of the two ships as we all know that Russia would have sold the Talwar class to China if it wanted it.

I know that Russia has to make some profit but it looks like India is being completely ripped off here and am amazed that any Indian in their right mind would be happy about this at all!!!

Not even more advanced Western Frigates cost anywhere near 1 billion dollars each to purchase.

Why should everything be compared with Chinese products? Their subsystems are some of worst in class.

BDW the cost of

1.De Zeven Provinciën-class frigate (6000 tonnes displacement) of Netherlands was $800 million back in the 2002.

2. French La Fayette class Frigate (3500 tonnes) costs 650 million in 2005.

3. German Sachsen class Frigate (5600 tonnes) costs 700 million in 2003.

4. Spanish Alvaro de Bazan class Frigate (6200 tonnes) costs $1.2 billion in 2010.

5. Russian Neustrashimyy-class frigate (3800 tonnes) costs $600 million in 2008.

Now there are dozens to be listed, but as i've made my point, i'd rather not respond to your rhetorical Chinese product endorsement from now on.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Firstly this article is factually wrong-the follow-on of 3 TALWAR class are equipped with Bhramos CMs(8 each).


Secondly I believe this proposed 3 will be based on the Krivak-IV frigates so will be slightly larger and more capable.

Having said that I simply cannot see any justification for a doubling in the price. These ships are in NO WAY worth close to $1BN each. The IN's P-17A that will be FAR more advanced and far larger than these proposed ships are going to cost ~$850-900MN. each.


The Russians do have the IN over a barrel to an extent as the IN wants to undertake MASSIVE expansion of their fleet but Indian shipyards are all full for the foreseeable future.


This money would be much better spent on 3 more P-17As if the IN can wait 7-8 years.


Time is the issue here.

 

[UKBengali]

Why should everything be compared with Chinese products? Their subsystems are some of worst in class.

BDW the cost of

1.De Zeven Provinciën-class frigate (6000 tonnes displacement) of Netherlands was $800 million back in the 2002.

2. French La Fayette class Frigate (3500 tonnes) costs 650 million in 2005.

3. German Sachsen class Frigate (5600 tonnes) costs 700 million in 2003.

4. Spanish Alvaro de Bazan class Frigate (6200 tonnes) costs $1.2 billion in 2010.

5. Russian Neustrashimyy-class frigate (3800 tonnes) costs $600 million in 2008.

Now there are dozens to be listed, but as i've made my point, i'd rather not respond to your rhetorical Chinese product endorsement from now on.

Type 26 Global Combat Ship (GCS) Programme - Naval Technology

""Each frigate is expected to cost between £250-£350m, which is much less expensive than the Type 45 Destroyers.""

Cost per ship will be between 400-500 million US dollars.

Better sensors but shorter range SAM missile of 25-30km.

I rest my case.

 

[Abingdonboy]

I was thinking the same! There seems to be something wrong here.

And I wonder why we have given orders for the older Talwar Class frigates and not the latest Shivalik-class which costs only US $480 million per piece? That's probably because the Russians have no gen on building the Shivalik class frigates as these were built in India at the Mazagon Docks.

mate, the P-17s cost ~$700-800MN apeaice, the P-17As will cost $850-900MN apeice, the P-15As cost $900MN-1BN apeice and the P-15B will cost ~$1BN-1.2BN apiece. All well worth the price IMHO, these are some of the most potent ships in their respective classes.

 

[Skull and Bones]

Type 26 Global Combat Ship (GCS) Programme - Naval Technology

""Each frigate is expected to cost between £250-£350m, which is much less expensive than the Type 45 Destroyers.""

Cost per ship will be between 400-500 million US dollars.

Better sensors but shorter range SAM missile of 25-30km.

I rest my case.

Expected? Ah sure, why not. F-35 was expected to cost below $60 million.

And even the manufacturer is same.

The Type 26 programme is considered similar to the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter programme being developed for the US military by Lockheed Martin.

Don't forget to ping me up when it enters service, if it ever does.

 

[Abingdonboy]

Type 26 Global Combat Ship (GCS) Programme - Naval Technology

""Each frigate is expected to cost between £250-£350m, which is much less expensive than the Type 45 Destroyers.""

Cost per ship will be between 400-500 million US dollars.

Better sensors but shorter range SAM missile of 25-30km.

I rest my case.

The Type 26 was offered to India as part of the IN's requirement for 7 advanced stealth frigates, the IN rejected this deal and went for the P-17A.

 

[UKBengali]

The Type 26 was offered to India as part of the IN's requirement for 7 advanced stealth frigates, the IN rejected this deal and went for the P-17A.

Well the Type 26 has a major handicap as it's SAMs have a range of only 25-30 km which is not a true medium-range missile able to protect a fleet. The UK would have to rely on the Type-45 destroyer to provide fleet air-cover.

The upcoming Type 26 is actually a cut-down version of the original which would have cost around 500 million pounds(800 million US dollars) per ship. If the Type 56 had stayed at it's original design specification then it would have been the most advanced frigate in the world - superior to the billion dollar frigates that India is buying from Russia.

Simply, Russia is taking the Indians for a ride with this frigate at 1 billion per ship.

.