India to acquire three Admiral Grigorovich-class frigates from Russia

[Han Patriot]

Nobody is stubborn here but you. You dont build up and then expand. Even China, the so called country you claim to hail from did not follow the procedure you advocate, it first stole, copied the blue prints of some of the most successful designs from west, then expanded and later built up its production capacity..

I think we did exactly just that, first we acquire the ability to build the ships, example reverse engineering + development, then we improve our yards to build those ships. Then we mass produce, how else can we build a dozen 052Ds? If we follow the Indian logic, we could just import from Russia.

Let me put in simpler terms:

1) Learn how to build the ship by all means, copy, steal, reverse, improve...
2) Upgrade the yards to build those ships so you don't have to import.
3) Mass produce.

You can see this in our civilian industry too, HSR and so on. We buy a few types of HSRs and maglev to study. Then we copy, steal, learn, improve the design to a certain level, then we upgrade our production to mass produce it. Get it genius?

 

[satishkumarcsc]

I think we did exactly just that, first we acquire the ability to build the ships, example reverse engineering + development, then we improve our yards to build those ships. Then we mass produce, how else can we build a dozen 052Ds? If we follow the Indian logic, we could just import from Russia.

Let me put in simpler terms:

1) Learn how to build the ship by all means, copy, steal, reverse, improve...
2) Upgrade the yards to build those ships so you don't have to import.
3) Mass produce.

You can see this in our civilian industry too, HSR and so on. We buy a few types of HSRs and maglev to study. Then we copy, steal, learn, improve the design to a certain level, then we upgrade our production to mass produce it. Get it genius?

What is the ABS classification of steel used by China for building it's hulls? We and Russians use the D-MR 49/49A for out hulls. what do you use?

 

[Han Patriot]

What is the ABS classification of steel used by China for building it's hulls? We and Russians use the D-MR 49/49A for out hulls. what do you use?

DMR-249A/B is the same as Russian AB steel. For China, we have the 980 steel.
http://gentleseas.blogspot.my/2015/04/submarine-steel-strength-implications.html

Steel is the most basic thing, before we even learn how to make the ship systems, we made the right steel.

 

[satishkumarcsc]

DMR-249A/B is the same as Russian AB steel. For China, we have the 980 steel.
http://gentleseas.blogspot.my/2015/04/submarine-steel-strength-implications.html

Steel is the most basic thing, before we even learn how to make the ship systems, we made the right steel.

So can you tell me the hardness of the 980 steel. It was given as 800MPa whereas the Russian AB steel has exceeded 1000MPa. So does this effect the tonnage of the ship and its time at sea?

 

[AMCA]

I think we did exactly just that, first we acquire the ability to build the ships, example reverse engineering + development, then we improve our yards to build those ships. Then we mass produce, how else can we build a dozen 052Ds? If we follow the Indian logic, we could just import from Russia.

Let me put in simpler terms:

1) Learn how to build the ship by all means, copy, steal, reverse, improve...
2) Upgrade the yards to build those ships so you don't have to import.
3) Mass produce.

You can see this in our civilian industry too, HSR and so on. We buy a few types of HSRs and maglev to study. Then we copy, steal, learn, improve the design to a certain level, then we upgrade our production to mass produce it. Get it genius?

What else do you think we are doing here? We are upgrading our yards, we are getting TOT and we are mass producing it. Except we do not copy, we can always get a TOT for Money.

 

[Han Patriot]

What else do you think we are doing here? We are upgrading our yards, we are getting TOT and we are mass producing it. Except we do not copy, we can always get a TOT for Money.

I give up...continue what you have been doing for decades. See what had it done for you.

So can you tell me the hardness of the 980 steel. It was given as 800MPa whereas the Russian AB steel has exceeded 1000MPa. So does this effect the tonnage of the ship and its time at sea?

http://gentleseas.blogspot.my/2015/07/chinese-and-russian-submarine-pressure.html?m=1

I am not sure how you get 1000Mpa. Chinese steel research is actually quite advanced. We have been building submarines for decades, and yes using Chinese steel

 

[satishkumarcsc]

I give up...continue what you have been doing for decades. See what had it done for you.


http://gentleseas.blogspot.my/2015/07/chinese-and-russian-submarine-pressure.html?m=1

I am not sure how you get 1000Mpa. Chinese steel research is actually quite advanced. We have been building submarines for decades, and yes using Chinese steel

Why don't you scroll down your own link you provided and see the hardness of the steel used in Russian submarine hulls.

By the way you have been giving irrelevant answers to my question. I asked about the warship grade steel and you have been showing me steel used for submarines.

 

[AMCA]

I give up...continue what you have been doing for decades. See what had it done for you.


http://gentleseas.blogspot.my/2015/07/chinese-and-russian-submarine-pressure.html?m=1

I am not sure how you get 1000Mpa. Chinese steel research is actually quite advanced. We have been building submarines for decades, and yes using Chinese steel

Our Ship building industry is quite advanced and we are happy with our progress. You may mimd your own business. We are as capable of building everything on our own as China is.

 

[Han Patriot]

Why don't you scroll down your own link you provided and see the hardness of the steel used in Russian submarine hulls.

By the way you have been giving irrelevant answers to my question. I asked about the warship grade steel and you have been showing me steel used for submarines.

Mr. Satish, from your name, I reckon you must be Tamilan. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the table clearly states the ability of AB steel compared to Chinese 980 steel.

What's the difference between submarine steel and ship steel? The same AB2 steel used in LADA SSK is also used for shipbuilding but of course latest submarine steel has even better strength.

Our Ship building industry is quite advanced and we are happy with our progress. You may mimd your own business. We are as capable of building everything on our own as China is.

Yup, it's progressing so well until you need to import simple frigates.

 

[GuardianRED]

Mr. Satish, from your name, I reckon you must be Tamilan. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the table clearly states the ability of AB steel compared to Chinese 980 steel.

What's the difference between submarine steel and ship steel? The same AB2 steel used in LADA SSK is also used for shipbuilding but of course latest submarine steel has even better strength.


Yup, it's progressing so well until you need to import simple frigates.

First, why reply with he being Tamilian ? Are u racist? There is difference, between the steel used. One is to do with cost and the other the usage! One doesn't use Sub steel on Ships simply because the ship doesn't need to handle high pressures that the Sub does. If they do, then be ready to pay a high premium for the ship

Second, Have u read the article or u enjoy Trolling!!!.... I sure its the latter. IND Govt Wants to built these ships in our yard NOT import them. These ships the Russians built was for their navy Not ours. If u have read the article and understood the situation (which u haven't) is to why a discussion is going on.

 

[satishkumarcsc]

Mr. Satish, from your name, I reckon you must be Tamilan. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the table clearly states the ability of AB steel compared to Chinese 980 steel.

What's the difference between submarine steel and ship steel? The same AB2 steel used in LADA SSK is also used for shipbuilding but of course latest submarine steel has even better strength.


Yup, it's progressing so well until you need to import simple frigates.

Yes the DMR 249 and other warship grade steel are in the range of 510 - 749 MPa tensile strength but the 980 and the AK 33 are in the 800 - 1400MPa tensile strength which means it is a higher end of HSLA steel. which is used in submarines. The question I asked was what is the steel used in Surface ships of the Chinese which must be an equivalent of DMR 249. Building ships with submarine steel is a very costly affair as the tonnage is going to be higher and the cost factor must be taken into consideration.

 

[Han Patriot]

First, why reply with he being Tamilian ? Are u racist? There is difference, between the steel used. One is to do with cost and the other the usage! One doesn't use Sub steel on Ships simply because the ship doesn't need to handle high pressures that the Sub does. If they do, then be ready to pay a high premium for the ship

Second, Have u read the article or u enjoy Trolling!!!.... I sure its the latter. IND Govt Wants to built these ships in our yard NOT import them. These Russian was built for their navy Not ours. If u have read the article and understood the situation (which u haven't) is to why a discussion is going on.

I am not racist, I am just saying he has a Tamil sounding name. What's wrong with you. Again, I seriously doubt you understand anything, the AB steel used for submarine and the AB steel used for warships are the same, genius! It's the testing procedure that is different to qualify it for submarine use.

You still don't get it do you? Why can't you just friggin build the Shivalik class? Please take the time to understand the article and do some research, India will FULLY IMPORT 3 frigates that are under construction in Russia!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Admiral_Grigorovich-class_frigate

Do you even know why they are pushing these ships to you? Do some critical thinking.

So can you tell me the hardness of the 980 steel. It was given as 800MPa whereas the Russian AB steel has exceeded 1000MPa. So does this effect the tonnage of the ship and its time at sea?

Mr. Satish, see above quote. YOU SAID AB steel. India only managed to copy/import up to AB steel, so why are you comparing to AK33 steel which is clearly off limits to you?

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/385482/india-manufacture-indigenous-submarines-soon.html?mstac=0

Read the above article and understand it. Using AB class steel for submarines is like 2 decades behind Chinese technology. You haven't even seen the latest alloy for PLAN. =)

 

[GuardianRED]

I am not racist, I am just saying he has a Tamil sounding name. What's wrong with you. Again, I seriously doubt you understand anything, the AB steel used for submarine and the AB steel used for warships are the same, genius! It's the testing procedure that is different to qualify it for submarine use.

You still don't get it do you? Why can't you just friggin build the Shivalik class? Please take the time to understand the article and do some research, India will FULLY IMPORT 3 frigates that are under construction in Russia!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Admiral_Grigorovich-class_frigate



Mr. Satish, see above quote. YOU SAID AB steel. India only managed to copy/import up to AB steel, so why are you comparing to AK33 steel which is clearly off limits to you?

Then why question if he is a tamilian ? Have u read what u have posted as a link? u did see that there are grades to AB steel like AB2 and AB3 ? they are not all the same. They all have difference cost and difference pressure rating and difference uses!.

And you are quoting me from Wiki are u serious?

A lot of us have been following this story for years
http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...eal-for-4-stealth-frigates/article8014794.ece

The 3 frigates are FOR THE RUSSIAN NAVY read you OWN link ! or u just like posting and not reading!!???

If they were for the IN why name them ??
Admiral Butakov
Admiral Istomin
Admiral Kornilov

It is because of the Ukrainian crisis IS the discussion going on!! the Building of 4 ship of the Talwar class is also on the table to be built in the Indian Yard

NOTHING HAS BEEN FINALIZED

 

[Han Patriot]

Then why question if he is a tamilian ? Have u read what u have posted as a link? u did see that there are grades to AB steel like AB2 and AB3 ? they are not all the same. They all have difference cost and difference pressure rating and difference uses!.

And you are quoting me from Wiki are u serious?

A lot of us have been following this story for years
http://www.thehindu.com/news/nation...eal-for-4-stealth-frigates/article8014794.ece

The 3 frigates are FOR THE RUSSIAN NAVY read you OWN link ! or u just like posting and not reading!!???

If they were for the IN why name them ??
Admiral Butakov
Admiral Istomin
Admiral Kornilov

It is because of the Ukrainian crisis IS the discussion going on!! the Building of 4 ship of the Talwar class is also on the table to be built in the Indian Yard

NOTHING HAS BEEN FINALIZED

Mr. Guardian, first you tell me submarine steel and warship steel is different. I proved you wrong, then now you start babbling about AB/AB2/AB3 steel, of course those are different grades, and ALL had been used in submarine construction before. Your point being?

This is a quote from your link >

Like the earlier ships, these will also be built by Yantar shipyard

.
It has not been finalized but either way the 3 ships under construction were intended to be sold to India. I am merely quoting wikipedia, the all time favorite official Indian source. LOL.

 

[GuardianRED]

Mr. Guardian, first you tell me submarine steel and warship steel is different. I proved you wrong, then now you start babbling about AB/AB2/AB3 steel, of course those are different grades, and ALL had been used in submarine construction before. Your point being?

This is a quote from your link > .
It has not been finalized but either way the 3 ships under construction were intended to be sold to India. I am merely quoting wikipedia, the all time favorite official Indian source. LOL.

U haven't proved anything! but just saying, u don't read t what u post as a link! but like saying it. A STANDARD FLAWED LOGIC chinese reply

and NOW taking a small line WITHOUT Reading THE WHOL:E ARTICLE!!!

India, Russia likely to sign deal for 4 stealth frigates

"Like the earlier ships, these will also be built by Yantar shipyard but will additionally involve an Indian partner in line with the government’s ‘Make in India’ push. Officials said Pipavav shipyard owned by Anil Ambani’s Reliance group is likely to be the Indian partner in the deal. Incidentally Russian Navy too has recently ordered these ships for its Baltic fleet. Both sides have been in discussions for the additional frigates for some time but the deal was delayed as India insisted on building it through the ‘Make in India’ route"

Its ALL In DISCUSSION , the IND Govt wants to build this in our yard , if you read the article is DATED 2015!!

Which Idiot will name their ships and have them built for their Navy and then decides last minute to sell them!?