India to acquire three Admiral Grigorovich-class frigates from Russia

[nang2]

well yes india buy too much you will have hole in the budget
remember you stiil have the deal with isreal to do


yes im sure the kolkata is beter 3 bilion can be invested on more importent things

Don't worry about it. Indians know what they are doing. They may have many intentions, offers, tenders, etc. But they have much fewer deals signed. They couldn't even fully spend the allotted money for weapon imports and they had to give it back to the government.

 

[Blue Marlin]

Problem was the lack of clarity in GoI over going for private players. The pressure from PSUs was too high. Now, with picture cleared up regarding entry of private players,capacity building is being undertaken.
L&T is busy withLPDs and SSN SSBNs(?) It's more of lack of space. The mandate is being shifted from control of IOR to power projection into Pacific and show of flag in SCS while assuming a dissuasive and if need be, sea denial posturing on western seaboard till Aden and African coast

whos gol ? if indian ship yards are to capacity or lacking space then why is it buying 3 more hulls from russia where they will go to india to be fitted out and not to mention the issue with the engines where india has to buy them from kiev directly.

I wish we could. Russia/Ukrainian engines are good, but American are way better!!!

we have some good marine engines the wr-21 and the mt-30 ?
heck the mt-30 are powering these bad boys

 

[desimorty]

I don't get the logic here. If you have indigenous capability in frigates, then why are you still buying Russian? You have the Shivalik class right? 3 billion is alot of money. My sincere suggestion to Indians, stop this bullshit, invest 100-200 million and upgrade a private yard, then build the Shivalik. All I can see here is Indians paying tribute to appease the Russians.

You have access to good Israeli electronics, why settle for lower grade Russian junk. China stopped buying any Russian naval electronics long ago. I like to mess up you guys to teach you humility, but it makes me sad seeing you guys getting fleeced by a former 'superpower'. The money could have been spent hiring Indians, giving income to thousands of workers.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/india-to...gates-from-russia.442768/page-2#ixzz4GTctH7xb

Your an idiot. If the Indians could have built it in India they would have. However if the the docks are full for the next 2 decades then why not buy abroad what is NOT sustainable!
Problem with building a Nimitz class aircraft carrier is that the Americans now have to build dozens of them. What happens when the USN no longer requires such ships?
Docks are part of the economy, they need to expand and be sustainable. If not. then you have a lot of unemployed.

 

[dani958]

i dont under stand from where all the money for the purshment

 

[Hellfire]

whos gol ? if indian ship yards are to capacity or lacking space then why is it buying 3 more hulls from russia where they will go to india to be fitted out and not to mention the issue with the engines where india has to buy them from kiev directly

GoI - government of India. Being bought .. will take time for them to come. Wont be shipped overnight would they?

Yeah, engines are better of west - but .. like members said, business being given to Russia also?

 

[Han Patriot]

Your an idiot. If the Indians could have built it in India they would have. However if the the docks are full for the next 2 decades then why not buy abroad what is NOT sustainable!
Problem with building a Nimitz class aircraft carrier is that the Americans now have to build dozens of them. What happens when the USN no longer requires such ships?
Docks are part of the economy, they need to expand and be sustainable. If not. then you have a lot of unemployed.

Realize I don't like to call people idiot or stupid. But in your case, ... you know math? If you want to expand your navy, don't overbuild it suddenly, make sure you expand your yards, build it in incremental stages, then development and economic returns will be for many years to come. Importing is a short term solution. Don't bankrupt yourselves! If you overspend internally, the money would still trickle back into the economy, if you import, you get nothing for the economy.

Look at how China does things, they always get the basics right, expand and modernize a few yards, plan the long term figures for each yard, then they would have work for years to come. Understand? Use some intelligence.

Your yards are full? Do you even know the production rate of Chinese yards? We are launching 052Ds like cars in modular fashion. Why we could do it? Because we modernize and expanded our yards, its planning, understand? All of it is linked, because we could produce most of the port equipment and most foreign brands manufacture in China, the supply chain is efficient and robust.

 

[dani958]

I don't get the logic here. If you have indigenous capability in frigates, then why are you still buying Russian? You have the Shivalik class right? 3 billion is alot of money. My sincere suggestion to Indians, stop this bullshit, invest 100-200 million and upgrade a private yard, then build the Shivalik. All I can see here is Indians paying tribute to appease the Russians.

You have access to good Israeli electronics, why settle for lower grade Russian junk. China stopped buying any Russian naval electronics long ago. I like to mess up you guys to teach you humility, but it makes me sad seeing you guys getting fleeced by a former 'superpower'. The money could have been spent hiring Indians, giving income to thousands of workers.

yes im sure isreal will love to help with technology on the ships

Don't worry about it. Indians know what they are doing. They may have many intentions, offers, tenders, etc. But they have much fewer deals signed. They couldn't even fully spend the allotted money for weapon imports and they had to give it back to the government.

yes from 2014 they dont sign the spike deal with defael advenced system

 

[California]

Realize I don't like to call people idiot or stupid. But in your case, ... you know math? If you want to expand your navy, don't overbuild it suddenly, make sure you expand your yards, build it in incremental stages, then development and economic returns will be for many years to come. Importing is a short term solution. Don't bankrupt yourselves! If you overspend internally, the money would still trickle back into the economy, if you import, you get nothing for the economy.

Look at how China does things, they always get the basics right, expand and modernize a few yards, plan the long term figures for each yard, then they would have work for years to come. Understand? Use some intelligence.

Your yards are full? Do you even know the production rate of Chinese yards? We are launching 052Ds like cars in modular fashion. Why we could do it? Because we modernize and expanded our yards, its planning, understand? All of it is linked, because we could produce most of the port equipment and most foreign brands manufacture in China, the supply chain is efficient and robust.

super power by 2020

 

[Jana Assassin]

Hope they arrive fast....

 

[desimorty]

Realize I don't like to call people idiot or stupid. But in your case, ... you know math? If you want to expand your navy, don't overbuild it suddenly, make sure you expand your yards, build it in incremental stages, then development and economic returns will be for many years to come. Importing is a short term solution. Don't bankrupt yourselves! If you overspend internally, the money would still trickle back into the economy, if you import, you get nothing for the economy.

Look at how China does things, they always get the basics right, expand and modernize a few yards, plan the long term figures for each yard, then they would have work for years to come. Understand? Use some intelligence.

Your yards are full? Do you even know the production rate of Chinese yards? We are launching 052Ds like cars in modular fashion. Why we could do it? Because we modernize and expanded our yards, its planning, understand? All of it is linked, because we could produce most of the port equipment and most foreign brands manufacture in China, the supply chain is efficient and robust.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/india-to...gates-from-russia.442768/page-3#ixzz4GbMs4kpw

I'm gonna call you an idiot because to talk like you know things. The Indians don't have the infastructure but they are investing in it as well as foreign firms. Now docks in China are different. You can not compare China's gun run with Indias for 1 simple reason. For China, production of weapons and boats have NEVER been cheaper! For the Indian Navy, they have to compete with local demand etc... There is a lesson. Don't try what the CCP does because only they can do it hence why no one copies the CCPs style of economics.
That being said, India is not bankrupting its self. Far from it. Would you believe that India has spent less overall in the 50 years on imported arms than China?
The manufacture of weapons is not the best use of GDP! However, since now India is spending a lot more than before, India now has to offset the cost locally. No longer a buyers military not because of choice but lack of it. India is far to big now including the military budget.
So you can imagine that Delhi would take its time.

 

[Han Patriot]

I'm gonna call you an idiot because to talk like you know things. The Indians don't have the infastructure but they are investing in it as well as foreign firms. Now docks in China are different. You can not compare China's gun run with Indias for 1 simple reason. For China, production of weapons and boats have NEVER been cheaper! For the Indian Navy, they have to compete with local demand etc... There is a lesson. Don't try what the CCP does because only they can do it hence why no one copies the CCPs style of economics.
That being said, India is not bankrupting its self. Far from it. Would you believe that India has spent less overall in the 50 years on imported arms than China?
The manufacture of weapons is not the best use of GDP! However, since now India is spending a lot more than before, India now has to offset the cost locally. No longer a buyers military not because of choice but lack of it. India is far to big now including the military budget.
So you can imagine that Delhi would take its time.

Can you provide me a list and quantity of how much we imported compared to India for the last 50 years? Well I dont want to argue with a stubborn Indian, it was my good intention to advise you to invest in infrastructure first before mass production and not rely on imports. Do you know Chinese yards dont just produce naval platforms, we are one of the largest civilluan shipbuilders too.

You still dont get my point. The point is build up the facilities to produce then expand. If you expand now when ur local facilities can't cope up, you end up importing. Undrstand genius? Simple logics.

 

[desimorty]

Can you provide me a list and quantity of how much we imported compared to India for the last 50 years? Well I dont want to argue with a stubborn Indian, it was my good intention to advise you to invest in infrastructure first before mass production and not rely on imports. Do you know Chinese yards dont just produce naval platforms, we are one of the largest civilluan shipbuilders too.

You still dont get my point. The point is build up the facilities to produce then expand. If you expand now when ur local facilities can't cope up, you end up importing. Undrstand genius? Simple logics.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/india-to...gates-from-russia.442768/page-3#ixzz4GcGNP9RZ

China is one of the top ship builders. How long are you gonna keep building them that cheap as well?
The Indians are building their capability only now on scale. Before they had limited their ventures for RnD and small scale production of 3 batches etc..
So while the Indians are making sustainable infrastructure that isn't going to bust any time soon. Remember the Indians are a decade behind China not 2 decades. Production is major issue for which the Indians have massive investments about to show.
You claim the Indians don't know what they are doing but the Indians have aircraft carriers and nuclear submarines at 1/3 the cost of PLAN budget.

Now as far as PLA imports.
The FLankers series. China bought 200 Su-27 vinallas from the broke Russians. How much was that you think? Cold hard cash. How long until lic prod? How many Flanker series engines have PLAAF bought?
The Russians can not disclose the sales to CCP for precise reason. CCP doesn't need Chinese knowing what they are spending on second hand Soviet stock. But that was in the past.
India will out do China in Imports of weapons but it has NOT done it yet. India may also out do China weapons exports as well given the Russians are willing to let the Indians meet support demand for Soviet era platforms and systems.
The Indians in comparison bought 30 Su-30MKI off the shelf until the first local assembly and gradual increase in domestication. This is in stark contrast to 200 Su-27s directly sold PLAAF not to mention the SU-30s and other weapons systems.
Also the Indians will also outdo China in weapons imports because they Indians are not limited be military embargo poised by the West or Russia. You'll notice India enjoys a favoured spot with Russias RnD while enjoying limited defence relations with America. China is not offered the best technology from Russia, often with extreme strings attached which only come off with higher price. The CCP especially since the Technology has almost caught up to the best of standards will keep for now domestic production. You'll also notice there are a lot of failed projects and allocation's of funds within CCP/PLA and defence industry in China. Corruption is the norm every where but the scale in China is absurd because of the budget!.
You'll remember the PLA had multiple missile defence projects but failed to produce their own. Luckily a Ukrainian firm looking for Money and to screw the Russians assisted China not only in their newer missiles but their new transport aircraft and other projects.

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

China is one of the top ship builders. How long are you gonna keep building them that cheap as well?
The Indians are building their capability only now on scale. Before they had limited their ventures for RnD and small scale production of 3 batches etc..
So while the Indians are making sustainable infrastructure that isn't going to bust any time soon. Remember the Indians are a decade behind China not 2 decades. Production is major issue for which the Indians have massive investments about to show.
You claim the Indians don't know what they are doing but the Indians have aircraft carriers and nuclear submarines at 1/3 the cost of PLAN budget.

Now as far as PLA imports.
The FLankers series. China bought 200 Su-27 vinallas from the broke Russians. How much was that you think? Cold hard cash. How long until lic prod? How many Flanker series engines have PLAAF bought?
The Russians can not disclose the sales to CCP for precise reason. CCP doesn't need Chinese knowing what they are spending on second hand Soviet stock. But that was in the past.
India will out do China in Imports of weapons but it has NOT done it yet. India may also out do China weapons exports as well given the Russians are willing to let the Indians meet support demand for Soviet era platforms and systems.
The Indians in comparison bought 30 Su-30MKI off the shelf until the first local assembly and gradual increase in domestication. This is in stark contrast to 200 Su-27s directly sold PLAAF not to mention the SU-30s and other weapons systems.
Also the Indians will also outdo China in weapons imports because they Indians are not limited be military embargo poised by the West or Russia. You'll notice India enjoys a favoured spot with Russias RnD while enjoying limited defence relations with America. China is not offered the best technology from Russia, often with extreme strings attached which only come off with higher price. The CCP especially since the Technology has almost caught up to the best of standards will keep for now domestic production. You'll also notice there are a lot of failed projects and allocation's of funds within CCP/PLA and defence industry in China. Corruption is the norm every where but the scale in China is absurd because of the budget!.
You'll remember the PLA had multiple missile defence projects but failed to produce their own. Luckily a Ukrainian firm looking for Money and to screw the Russians assisted China not only in their newer missiles but their new transport aircraft and other projects.

Ignore these parasites , the likes of him cling to clean threads here and destroy it.

 

[AMCA]

Can you provide me a list and quantity of how much we imported compared to India for the last 50 years? Well I dont want to argue with a stubborn Indian, it was my good intention to advise you to invest in infrastructure first before mass production and not rely on imports. Do you know Chinese yards dont just produce naval platforms, we are one of the largest civilluan shipbuilders too.

You still dont get my point. The point is build up the facilities to produce then expand. If you expand now when ur local facilities can't cope up, you end up importing. Undrstand genius? Simple logics.

Nobody is stubborn here but you. You dont build up and then expand. Even China, the so called country you claim to hail from did not follow the procedure you advocate, it first stole, copied the blue prints of some of the most successful designs from west, then expanded and later built up its production capacity..

 

[assassin123]

The advantage of these three frigates from the earlier ones that we bought from Russia is that they come with 36 VLS launched shitl air defence missiles which provides complete 360 degree coverage with a range of 48 km