India readies troops as Pakistan rattles arms across the border

[JohnyD]

I am very impressed and happy to know that most of the Pakistani members in this forum do not want a WAR…But I am equally frustrated and fade up by actions led by Pakistani institutions..pls read them as ISI and Pak Army…

We do want peace, we do want to live with you peacefully and prosper together…but the problem is, we Indians are always at the receiving end and there is no Pakistani counterpart who is willing or capable to take the responsibility and correct the situation…Pakistan all the time manage to get away after every inhuman act….

This has to stop somewhere, if elected people cant solve it even after 5 decades, then Wars are bound to take place!

 

[SQ8]

I am very impressed and happy to know that most of the Pakistani members in this forum do not want a WAR…But I am equally frustrated and fade up by actions led by Pakistani institutions..pls read them as ISI and Pak Army…

We do want peace, we do want to live with you peacefully and prosper together…but the problem is, we Indians are always at the receiving end and there is no Pakistani counterpart who is willing or capable to take the responsibility and correct the situation…Pakistan all the time manage to get away after every inhuman act….

This has to stop somewhere, if elected people cant solve it even after 5 decades, then Wars are bound to take place!

Which elected people?

 

[JohnyD]

Which elected people?

read your PM and our PM OR to broden the scope, ur Parliament and our!

 

[SQ8]

read your PM and our PM

Your PM I can think of as elected and with support.

Our PM is an entirely different matter.

Imagine an evil Neslon Mandela with serious issues to settle.
Plus.. it was much easier on Mandela in Jail than on Zardari..

Kept under boots(Literally)..
Tongue and genitals cut with blades.. not fed, not allowed to sleep..
All by military men and others..

You think this guy is here to lead the people into peace and prosperity?

 

[JohnyD]

Your PM I can think of as elected and with support.

Our PM is an entirely different matter.

Imagine an evil Neslon Mandela with serious issues to settle.
Plus.. it was much easier on Mandela in Jail than on Zardari..

Kept under boots(Literally)..
Tongue and genitals cut with blades.. not fed, not allowed to sleep..
All by military men and others..

You think this guy is here to lead the people into peace and prosperity?

agreed sir...but then what is the solution? isnt is easy to talk abt the problem than solution?

Your PM I can think of as elected and with support.

Our PM is an entirely different matter.

Imagine an evil Neslon Mandela with serious issues to settle.
Plus.. it was much easier on Mandela in Jail than on Zardari..

Kept under boots(Literally)..
Tongue and genitals cut with blades.. not fed, not allowed to sleep..
All by military men and others..

You think this guy is here to lead the people into peace and prosperity?

agreed sir...but then what is the solution? isnt is easy to talk abt the problem than solution?

 

[Mech]

@Oscar, our PM did not contest in elections. Not now, not ever.

 

[SQ8]

agreed sir...but then what is the solution? isnt is easy to talk abt the problem than solution?

Let it be..
Look at the "actual" response from the populous on both sides..
A lot of hubbub.. but not as much as before.
People are tired of it...
Yours are tired of the cat and mouse..
ours are tired of cat and mouse..

back home.. people are literally willing to let Indian lawyers come into courts and take on people like HS and others..
even the Army.. go ahead..
We are as sick of this charade as you are..
You have proof.. present it.
We have proof against those in the Samjhota thing.. tackle them too.

In the meantime.. we want some tomatoes and onions as our stocks are waning.. ..could we offer you some natural gas in return??


Thats al that matters.. its time to concentrate on those..
its not the 90's where you did not have places like PDF, FB or youtube.. where we did not know your problems and you ours..
Stop being blind to where the other stands...and move one..

This tit-for-tat solves NOTHING.

@Oscar, our PM did not contest in elections. Not now, not ever.

Yes..but the party did.. on actual grassroot representatives.. not "traditional" ones that are being carried on because of their status from a hundred years.
Plus, you have the Bhuttos and Gandhis in power..
two dynasties that have had the two nations within their grasp for too long.. But only one is answerable to the people.

 

[JohnyD]

Let it be..
Look at the "actual" response from the populous on both sides..
A lot of hubbub.. but not as much as before.
People are tired of it...
Yours are tired of the cat and mouse..
ours are tired of cat and mouse..

back home.. people are literally willing to let Indian lawyers come into courts and take on people like HS and others..
even the Army.. go ahead..
We are as sick of this charade as you are..
You have proof.. present it.
We have proof against those in the Samjhota thing.. tackle them too.

In the meantime.. we want some tomatoes and onions as our stocks are waning.. ..could we offer you some natural gas in return??


Thats al that matters.. its time to concentrate on those..
its not the 90's where you did not have places like PDF, FB or youtube.. where we did not know your problems and you ours..
Stop being blind to where the other stands...and move one..

This tit-for-tat solves NOTHING.

Oscar...I always enjoy ur posts....but guess u didnt try to address the main issue..the solution? I am not taking abt d solution to Kasmir problem...simple problems like Mumbai Bombing...whole world and you too must agree that it was originated from Pak....we asked to send ISI chief for discussion, ur president agreed, ur amry chief intervened and nothing happend...In our country Army does not discuss or solve the national problem for that we ve PM...now if at all our PM wants to make an inroad to peace whom shoud we talk? PM Vajapayi had initiated something and Mushy gave us Kargil...so if u talk to one party other has problem...!! and what evidence u r talking abt? that Dawood is not in Pak..? at least not from u!

 

[SQ8]

Oscar...I always enjoy ur posts....but guess u didnt try to address the main issue..the solution? I am not taking abt d solution to Kasmir problem...simple problems like Mumbai Bombing...whole world and you too must agree that it was originated from Pak....we asked to send ISI chief for discussion, ur president agreed, ur amry chief intervened and nothing happend...In our country Army does not discuss or solve the national problem for that we ve PM...now if at all our PM wants to make an inroad to peace whom shoud we talk? PM Vajapayi had initiated something and Mushy gave us Kargil...so if u talk to one party other has problem...!! and what evidence u r talking abt? that Dawood is not in Pak..? at least not from u!

What Im talking about is realizing that the power that was once held by the "second state" in Pakistan was waning.
people were asking questions and be less willing to accept half-truths..be it HS or Dawood... it would have come to pass in the courts. Actions such as these return the "power" to the second state.. its position as a servant of the people is pushed back to savior of the people..

Terrorism cannot be solved by courts or anything.. its become a part of the radicalization of society and hence must be countered by ignoring it and letting the society cycle it out. But the world along with India is doing JUST the opposite.. giving excused for terrorists and their supporters to be popular here.

You guys ever heard of Maslow's Pyramid?
Maslow's hierarchy of needs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Well in terms of a population need.. Pakistan is at the very bottom these days..
Which means that it will look to whosover provides the best outcome in that..
be it the Army or the Taliban..
Actions by the west deteriorate business, actions by India instigate violence...
Each ends up putting the population of Pakistan back at level 1.. back where it is MORE prone to terrorist conversions as compared to being left to society recycling.

Some people think its better to leave it at that if Pakistanis in general start embracing terrorism(which they wont) ..but the greater number of terrorists that emerge will not be content with having just Pakistan.. their first focus will be India(and there exists a large sleeper network inside India as well).
So at this time, the short term goals of revenge for both sides need to overlooked for the safety and security of the region.
it is best that this returns to normalcy.. and the peace process continues.
Eventually.. people like Dawood and HS will get hauled in by Justice.. as will the people of Kashmir get what they wish for themselves.

But taking harsh decisions in the false hope that it will only harm the other side is a very very bad idea.

 

[trident2010]

Kambhakhat meri news chura li.

Mujhe bhi Jr. Think Tank ban na hai jaldi se

 

[curioususer]

Yes..but the party did.. on actual grassroot representatives.. not "traditional" ones that are being carried on because of their status from a hundred years.
Plus, you have the Bhuttos and Gandhis in power..
two dynasties that have had the two nations within their grasp for too long.. But only one is answerable to the people.

Ours are not answerable to the people also. You need to understand how things work in India. It's just that ours are a bit more cunning than yours, less radicalism also helps. Or did you mean yours are answerable to people, from what I've seen and read it doesn't seem to be like that.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

I hope we won't have to test those MKEK Panters we got from Turkiye a few years back.

best to be prepared though in the event of any further belligerence from across the LoC

 

[WHITESMOKE]

What Im talking about is realizing that the power that was once held by the "second state" in Pakistan was waning.
people were asking questions and be less willing to accept half-truths..be it HS or Dawood... it would have come to pass in the courts. Actions such as these return the "power" to the second state.. its position as a servant of the people is pushed back to savior of the people..

Terrorism cannot be solved by courts or anything.. its become a part of the radicalization of society and hence must be countered by ignoring it and letting the society cycle it out. But the world along with India is doing JUST the opposite.. giving excused for terrorists and their supporters to be popular here.

You guys ever heard of Maslow's Pyramid?
Maslow's hierarchy of needs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Well in terms of a population need.. Pakistan is at the very bottom these days..
Which means that it will look to whosover provides the best outcome in that..
be it the Army or the Taliban..
Actions by the west deteriorate business, actions by India instigate violence...
Each ends up putting the population of Pakistan back at level 1.. back where it is MORE prone to terrorist conversions as compared to being left to society recycling.

Some people think its better to leave it at that if Pakistanis in general start embracing terrorism(which they wont) ..but the greater number of terrorists that emerge will not be content with having just Pakistan.. their first focus will be India(and there exists a large sleeper network inside India as well).
So at this time, the short term goals of revenge for both sides need to overlooked for the safety and security of the region.
it is best that this returns to normalcy.. and the peace process continues.
Eventually.. people like Dawood and HS will get hauled in by Justice.. as will the people of Kashmir get what they wish for themselves.

But taking harsh decisions in the false hope that it will only harm the other side is a very very bad idea.

Don't you think if people in Pakistan start giving democracy more importance then it will be much easier. Giving more importance means not letting the army taking control of nation again. Army in Pakistan has got the taste of power so it will be really hard for them to obey orders from a civilian government. So they will always avoid to give up their powers and even if a limited conflict with India helps them in this, they might try this. I think it will be fruitful only when a civilian government talks with other civilian government. You see youths in India are really asking the government about development. Narendra Modi is also hoping to become the PM by putting forward his development agenda. So if in Pakistan also people start looking more towards development, I see in next 15-20 years things can be sorted out very easily.

Regarding the troops getting ready, I am sure unkil will work hard not to get things messy. After all unkil wants to get out of Afghanistan .

 

[SQ8]

Don't you think if people in Pakistan start giving democracy more importance then it will be much easier. Giving more importance means not letting the army taking control of nation again. Army in Pakistan has got the taste of power so it will be really hard for them to obey orders from a civilian government. So they will always avoid to give up their powers and even if a limited conflict with India helps them in this, they might try this. I think it will be fruitful only when a civilian government talks with other civilian government. You see youths in India are really asking the government about development. Narendra Modi is also hoping to become the PM by putting forward his development agenda. So if in Pakistan also people start looking more towards development, I see in next 15-20 years things can be sorted out very easily.

Regarding the troops getting ready, I am sure unkil will work hard not to get things messy. After all unkil wants to get out of Afghanistan .

Pakistanis at this stage are giving Food, Clothing and Shelter.. along with security more importance..
because anything else is not being allowed to develop.. by the world at large .. trying to interfere.

Whoever offers these things to Pakistan.. they will consider them leadership. Be it Army, Politicians or the Taliban.

India has gone above the pyramid of wants to greater self-realization..
Pakistan is not.
What works there CANNOT work here.

 

[curioususer]

India has gone above the pyramid of wants to greater self-realization..
Pakistan is not.
What works there CANNOT work here.

India really is at the 'Safety' level presently.