India, Japan pantomime message to China

[Krueger]

May 31, 2013

New Delhi: During a three-day visit to Japan this week, Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh signed several major infrastructure and defence-technology deals, and agreed to speed up dialogue on nuclear co-operation and conduct more joint naval exercises. His host, Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, called Mr Singh a "mentor-like leader".

But the bonhomie appeared calculated, at least in part, to send a not-so-subtle diplomatic message to Beijing in the wake of a border row between India and China last month, as well as the dispute between Japan and China over resource-rich islands in the East China Sea.

The goal, analysts say, is to isolate China with a view to limiting its territorial ambitions in the region.

On Wednesday, Mr Singh said India and Japan are "natural and indispensable partners" in efforts to bring about a "peaceful, stable, co-operative and prosperous future for the Asia-Pacific and Indian Ocean regions".

Mr Abe said the two democracies, "India from the west, Japan from the east", must shoulder the task of keeping Asia peaceful.

"It is quite clear that all this is happening with China as the backdrop, because both Japan and India look upon China as a threat," said Lalit Mansingh, a former Indian diplomat and strategic affairs analyst. "The Japanese prime minister wants to redefine the Indian Ocean and the Pacific region as a community of maritime democracies. That automatically excludes China. This is an important and clever move by India, too. I think Beijing has reasons to be worried."

The message has not been lost on China. On Tuesday, the Communist Party-controlled People's Daily newspaper described China and India as natural partners, and hailed India's "great wisdom" in handling its ties with China "in a calm way, undisturbed by internal and international provocateurs". The article also criticised recent visits by Mr Abe to China's neighbours to discuss ways to contain the superpower, saying, "Some politicians just made themselves petty burglars on China-related issues."

Indian officials have portrayed Mr Singh's visit to Japan as a logical extension of India's two-decade-old "Look East" policy of seeking closer ties with countries in east and south-east Asia. After some dithering, India also appears to support the recent US emphasis on a strategic pivot towards Asia, as a response to China's rapid rise.

Mr Abe has turned in recent times not only to India, but also to south-east Asian countries to parry China's influence in the region. He visited Indonesia, Thailand and Vietnam during his first overseas trip in office, and this week paid the first visit to Myanmar by a Japanese leader in 36 years.

Japan is also beginning to co-operate with countries that share concerns about China's maritime ambitions, considering training Vietnamese submarine crews and helping bolster the Philippines coastguard.

India and Japan conducted their first joint naval exercise off the coast of Tokyo last year and this week pledged to deepen the co-operation with more.

"India, Japan join hands to break string of pearls," read a headline in the Times of India newspaper on Thursday, using the catchphrase for Beijing's strategy of wooing Indian neighbours such as Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and the Maldives by establishing commercial and strategic facilities.

This week, Japan offered to lend $700 million to help build a new metro system in India's financial capital of Mumbai, pledged to invest in India's high-speed railway system and promised to supply advanced naval reconnaissance aircraft.

"Traditional Asian rivals Japan and China are at loggerheads again, and one country stands to gain the most from the chilly ties this time round: India," the country's Hindustan Times newspaper commented.


Washington Post

 

[acid rain]

Of course, the concerns are not misplaced, many are worried by China's belligerence and expanist moves.

India and Japan share good relations from the 50's, its not a new phenomena. The surprising part was India going out of the way to make a point which was not expected from Mr.Singh.

 

[Genesis]

Japan is part of the US Alliance of developed countries such as UK, France, Germany South Korea(sort of)m and other European nations.

India is, well not. Indians can only be the junior partner in such an "alliance" if nothing else, the Japanese weapons will always be better, the Japanese forces will always be more educated and well trained as well as better paid, the Japanese will have the backings of US.

China is trying to establish a new world order, not out of boredom, but necessity. The old order has no room for China with US as the one on top and the developed countries on tier two and China can only be on the bottom.

It is better if India is looking to establish its own power rather than alliance with a world order that pretty much puts you on the bottom of the food chain.

 

[AUTOBOTS]

curry is really hot ......

 

[Okemos]

Japan is part of the US Alliance of developed countries such as UK, France, Germany South Korea(sort of)m and other European nations.

India is, well not. Indians can only be the junior partner in such an "alliance" if nothing else, the Japanese weapons will always be better, the Japanese forces will always be more educated and well trained as well as better paid, the Japanese will have the backings of US.

China is trying to establish a new world order, not out of boredom, but necessity. The old order has no room for China with US as the one on top and the developed countries on tier two and China can only be on the bottom.

It is better if India is looking to establish its own power rather than alliance with a world order that pretty much puts you on the bottom of the food chain.

It reminds me of Obama's comment to the effect that if every Chinese has same living standard as American, the earth has not enough resources. As if we Chinese are doomed to live subpar life, while Americans were all born with silver spoon. Wouldn't it a better and more humane approach that each human being on earth live sufficient and modest life? Chinese and Indian's life improve a bit while Americans try not to be so wasteful?

But alas, I am always a romantic guy that underestimates selfishness of humanity. The developed world will try its hardest to maintain current world order.

 

[Markus]

If China is to be contained, all neighbors will have to gangup, no individual neighbor can do much.

 

[acid rain]

Japan is part of the US Alliance of developed countries such as UK, France, Germany South Korea(sort of)m and other European nations.

India is, well not. Indians can only be the junior partner in such an "alliance" if nothing else, the Japanese weapons will always be better, the Japanese forces will always be more educated and well trained as well as better paid, the Japanese will have the backings of US.

China is trying to establish a new world order, not out of boredom, but necessity. The old order has no room for China with US as the one on top and the developed countries on tier two and China can only be on the bottom.

It is better if India is looking to establish its own power rather than alliance with a world order that pretty much puts you on the bottom of the food chain.

China's New World Order with Pakistan & North Korea - yeah sure, go right ahead. LOL.

 

[OrionHunter]

India is, well not. Indians can only be the junior partner in such an "alliance" if nothing else, the Japanese weapons will always be better, the Japanese forces will always be more educated and well trained as well as better paid, the Japanese will have the backings of US.

So? WTF are you trying to get at? What has pay got to do with forming an alliance? Silly lemming!

China is trying to establish a new world order, not out of boredom, but necessity.

What were you smoking when you wrote this nonsensical tripe? Try unadulterated Afghan weed next time.

It is better if India is looking to establish its own power rather than alliance with a world order that pretty much puts you on the bottom of the food chain.

India is at the bottom of the 'food chain'? Are you even aware that India is No. 4 in the list of strongest military powers in the world, ahead of Japan, Australia, Germany, France and the UK?

You're talking like an idiot with half a brain cell.

 

[Minjitta]

The New World Order started out with USA and EU, China now copy the New World Order too?hehehe Chinese are hyperhilarious

 

[grandmaster]

it is not a big issue. China still build ports in Pakistan near by India and china also present in Diaoyu islands. I see both india and japan can nothing. it is just a game of japan. Japanese wants to handle fire from its hand to Indian's hand.

 

[madooxno9]

It reminds me of Obama's comment to the effect that if every Chinese has same living standard as American, the earth has not enough resources. As if we Chinese are doomed to live subpar life, while Americans were all born with silver spoon. Wouldn't it a better and more humane approach that each human being on earth live sufficient and modest life? Chinese and Indian's life improve a bit while Americans try not to be so wasteful?

But alas, I am always a romantic guy that underestimates selfishness of humanity. The developed world will try its hardest to maintain current world order.

You just think like me Nice to know some1 sees it this way.
I totally hate when West is worried coz Asia is raising ..they are not worried weapon or education level ...all they want is their Supremacy , dominance and Life style should not be compromised .

 

[Genesis]

So? WTF are you trying to get at? What has pay got to do with forming an alliance? Silly lemming!


What were you smoking when you wrote this nonsensical tripe? Try unadulterated Afghan weed next time.

[/B]
India is at the bottom of the 'food chain'? Are you even aware that India is No. 4 in the list of strongest military powers in the world, ahead of Japan, Australia, Germany, France and the UK?

You're talking like an idiot with half a brain cell.

You are right, a nation's power has nothing to do with its decision making power, that's why the BRICS is such a solid group and India objects in no way to a BRICS bank with China.

As to the second thing, I guess you would know about the Weed wouldn't you.

India is number 4? IF you are talking about the list I think you are talking about then that list is stupid. I'm pretty sure there was a thread here that listed the reasons why it is so I won't bring up again.

But the nations you listed? All except Australia has sold or is selling you weapons, all have Per capita you can't achieve in this century, all are strong Allies of Americans with access to latest Tech.

BTW

Total Tonnage of warships in the world, Japan fourth

Number of warships in service worldwide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

World military spending

France, Japan, UK all spend more and Germany spends just a little less, but has way way less troops and part of their expenditures are covered by US too, which is not included here.

So before you want me to stop smoking, maybe you should stop it first.

@Minjitta

We are speaking in English, of course I will use terms used by the English speaking countries. If we were having this discussion in Chinese there would be no world order.

Besides, China wants more of its own old system rather than the American system.

 

[Minjitta]

You are right, a nation's power has nothing to do with its decision making power, that's why the BRICS is such a solid group and India objects in no way to a BRICS bank with China.

As to the second thing, I guess you would know about the Weed wouldn't you.

India is number 4? IF you are talking about the list I think you are talking about then that list is stupid. I'm pretty sure there was a thread here that listed the reasons why it is so I won't bring up again.

But the nations you listed? All except Australia has sold or is selling you weapons, all have Per capita you can't achieve in this century, all are strong Allies of Americans with access to latest Tech.

BTW

Total Tonnage of warships in the world, Japan fourth

Number of warships in service worldwide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

World military spending

France, Japan, UK all spend more and Germany spends just a little less, but has way way less troops and part of their expenditures are covered by US too, which is not included here.

So before you want me to stop smoking, maybe you should stop it first.

@Minjitta

We are speaking in English, of course I will use terms used by the English speaking countries. If we were having this discussion in Chinese there would be no world order.

Besides, China wants more of its own old system rather than the American system.

The China old system never work why would it work now, even the modern system that the West are pursuing will not work. Every nations are different you can't put 1 size govern fit all to all other nations.

 

[Genesis]

The China old system never work why would it work now, even the modern system that the West are pursuing will not work. Every nations are different you can't put 1 size govern fit all to all other nations.

Sure it worked, that's why it was continued for so long. The modern system of the west is also working, why else would the Western block be so powerful and rich.

True different countries need different system, when did I say other nation should copy another? Not sure where this is coming from.

Anyone can clearly see Chinese foreign relationships with Pakistan, NK, and many African countries as well as some Asian countries are clearly different from the West. So while I call it new world order, it really is just that. True coined by the West, never the less the term world order in Chinese has existed long before the coining of this term by the West.

 

[Wright]

Sure it worked, that's why it was continued for so long. The modern system of the west is also working, why else would the Western block be so powerful and rich.

True different countries need different system, when did I say other nation should copy another? Not sure where this is coming from.

Anyone can clearly see Chinese foreign relationships with Pakistan, NK, and many African countries as well as some Asian countries are clearly different from the West. So while I call it new world order, it really is just that. True coined by the West, never the less the term world order in Chinese has existed long before the coining of this term by the West.

Only NK is exclusively under your influence, the rest of the nations you mentioned have just recently been taking their ties with China seriously. Time will tell if you can transform those nations into another SK, Germany success story.

But thus far we only have NK to judge the Chinese/Soviet order.