In pictures: Isis destroys Iraq shrines

[Aepsilons]

There is no indication in either the Qur’aan or the Sunnah that would prescribe the actions described in the question. Based on this fact, these actions are bid‘ah (a reprehensible innovation) which is not permitted; we should avoid it and warn others not to do it. The Messenger of Allaah (Peace & Blessings of Allaah be upon Him) used to say in his khutbahs (sermons): "The truest of speech is the Book of Allaah, the best guidance is that of Muhammad and the worst of things are those which are newly invented. Every newly-invented thing is a bid‘ah, every bid‘ah is a going astray, and every going astray will end in the Fire of Hell." (Reported by al-Nisaa’i, may Allaah have mercy on him, in al-Sunan, Kitaab salaat al-‘eidayn, no. 1560).

It is permissible to pray for the deceased, without arranging a formal gathering, and without setting a specific date for doing so. We ask Allaah to help us and you to do that which He loves and which will please Him. ALLAH knows best.

 

[KingMamba]

. However, if someone constructs a mosque near the grave of a pious person for the prupose of seeking tabarruk and not for prostration or paying attention towards them, he will never be included in this prohibition


Ye$ i got your point.... But unfortunately the$e place$ turn into $hirk Capital... Many people $tart$ praying to the grave and Give it $hijdah....

Granted now I ask you, is the fault in the shrine or in the people? Would it not make more sense to tell people that is wrong than to blow up the shrine? Which is cost effective?

well I believe in the ahadith (obviously there are different grading for each hadith) as much as I do in the Quran. Just how there APPEAR to be contradictions within the Quran, the same is the case with the ahadith. My issue with wahabis is there picking up ahadith and implementing them straight away without first reconciling all the textual proofs with each other.

Scholars wrote large commentaries on trying to understand the meaning of the ahadith before they went on to draw legal rulings out of it. we today simply pick up a hadith and jump to the ruling.

As far as I am concerned hadith should always be questioned before taking them at face value, history tell us that many Hadith that were classified even as Sahih were fabricated. @Azlan Haider has already posted much about this in other threads. There are some hadith which contradict the Quran and they need to be tossed out as the forgeries they are.

 

[ajpirzada]

You know the Wahabbis talk about the pristine version of Islam but they base most of their nonsense on Hadith that came 300+ years after the death of the Prophet PBUH. Lol at the irony.

well I believe in the ahadith (obviously there are different grading for each hadith) as much as I do in the Quran. Just how there APPEAR to be contradictions within the Quran, the same is the case with the ahadith. My issue with wahabis is there picking up ahadith and implementing them straight away without first reconciling all the textual proofs with each other.

Scholars wrote large commentaries on trying to understand the meaning of the ahadith before they went on to draw legal rulings out of it. we today simply pick up a hadith and jump to the ruling.

 

[Aepsilons]

Isaal-e-Sawaab (to perform a virtuous act and grant the reward to any person, alive or deceased) is permissible.

On numerous occasions, Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) advised the Sahaaba (Radhiyallaahu Anhum) to give charity on behalf of the deceased. One specific incident is of Hadhrat Abu Talha (Radhiallaahy Anhu) when the Aayat, ‘You cannot attain virtue until your spend what is beloved to you…’ (Nisaa 4). Abu Talha gave his most valuable well and garden, Bi’r Haa as charity on behalf of his deceased mother. In fact, Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) slaughtered 100 sheep during his farewell Hajj and made intention for himself and all those (alive, deceased and to come) who bring faith on his prophethood. (Nasbur Raaya, Allama Zailee)

Hadhrat Anas (Radhiallaahu Anhu) reports that Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) said, ‘Whosoever reads Yaseen at anybody’s grave, Allah will decrease their punishment.’ This proves that reading the Qur’aan and conveying the rewards to the deceased, benefits the deceased. (Umdatul Qaari; Ahsanul Fataawa vol.4 pg.206)

 

[KingMamba]

Isaal-e-Sawaab (to perform a virtuous act and grant the reward to any person, alive or deceased) is permissible.

On numerous occasions, Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) advised the Sahaaba (Radhiyallaahu Anhum) to give charity on behalf of the deceased. One specific incident is of Hadhrat Abu Talha (Radhiallaahy Anhu) when the Aayat, ‘You cannot attain virtue until your spend what is beloved to you…’ (Nisaa 4). Abu Talha gave his most valuable well and garden, Bi’r Haa as charity on behalf of his deceased mother. In fact, Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) slaughtered 100 sheep during his farewell Hajj and made intention for himself and all those (alive, deceased and to come) who bring faith on his prophethood. (Nasbur Raaya, Allama Zailee)

Hadhrat Anas (Radhiallaahu Anhu) reports that Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) said, ‘Whosoever reads Yaseen at anybody’s grave, Allah will decrease their punishment.’ This proves that reading the Qur’aan and conveying the rewards to the deceased, benefits the deceased. (Umdatul Qaari; Ahsanul Fataawa vol.4 pg.206)

I have got to say, you are the most informed non-Muslim when it comes to Islam that I have come across in a while.

 

[ajpirzada]

. However, if someone constructs a mosque near the grave of a pious person for the prupose of seeking tabarruk and not for prostration or paying attention towards them, he will never be included in this prohibition


Ye$ i got your point.... But unfortunately the$e place$ turn into $hirk Capital... Many people $tart$ praying to the grave and Give it $hijdah....

I agree. However, a grave can become a place of shirk irrespective of whether there is a building on it or not. There should be strong regulation and dawah to discourage such practices rather than to simply destroy the structures. Destroying the structures which other view as permissible will only divide the Muslim nation and increase hatred for each other.

 

[Aepsilons]

I have got to say, you are the most informed non-Muslim when it comes to Islam that I have come across in a while.

In spirit and form, Christianity and Islam are the two most closest Faiths.

And , just like in Christianity, it is important to read the Holy Bible with the help of learned teachers (Priests, Pastors) rather than making personal interpretation, because one can be in err. The same also when reading the Holy Quran; it is important to read and ask the interpretation with a learned Imam , Islamic Scholar, and evade personal interpretation.

GOD gave us prophets to help us and guide us in interpreting works of holiness. We have to turn to Holy Men for guidance...!

 

[Desert Fox]

Even though as a Sunni i disagree with Shi'ite beliefs, i still don't condone such behavior on the part of ISIS. Let Allah (God) judge his creation and deal with them as he pleases.

 

[ajpirzada]

Granted now I ask you, is the fault in the shrine or in the people? Would it not make more sense to tell people that is wrong than to blow up the shrine? Which is cost effective?



As far as I am concerned hadith should always be questioned before taking them at face value, history tell us that many Hadith that were classified even as Sahih were fabricated. @Azlan Haider has already posted much about this in other threads. There are some hadith which contradict the Quran and they need to be tossed out as the forgeries they are.

Yes. But depends who is doing the authentication. I do not take any hadith authentication done by the orientalists seriously. If you get into reading and learning the rules of hadith authentication (usul al-hadith, jarh wa tadil), you'll be surprised with the depth the islamic scholars have gone into. Yes there can be certain discrepancies when you compare with the scientific understanding of today. But that is a different issue. A hadith is called authentic not that the statement is correct in its essence but that the statement was definitely said by the person to whom it is being attributed. And then there are other rules and differences as to what is considered an undeniable proof such as mutawatir hadith etc. At the face of it few things might look erroneous but everything is very streamlined and reasoned when you start getting into it.

 

[Aepsilons]

Even though as a Sunni i disagree with Shi'ite beliefs, i still don't condone such behavior on the part of ISIS. Let Allah (God) judge his creation and deal with them as he pleases.

ABSOLUTELY !

So whoever hopes for the Meeting with his Lord, let him work righteousness and associate none as a partner in the worship of his Lord.

[Al-Kahf, Verse: 110]

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If they want to make Dawah in these Holy sites, let them, they are praying not to men, but their prayer goes to God the Most Compassionate, The Most Merciful, whose Love is unbounded and cannot be comprehended by the finity of man. Let ALLAH make judgment. I wat to refer to a verse in Surat Al - Baqara;


"Everything in the heavens and everything in the earth belongs to Allah. Whether you divulge what is in yourselves or keep it hidden, Allah will still call you to account for it. He forgives whoever He wills and He punishes whoever He wills. Allah has power over all things."

(Surat Al-Baqara, 284)

 

[kobiraaz]

I agree. However, a grave can become a place of shirk irrespective of whether there is a building on it or not. There should be strong regulation and dawah to discourage such practices rather than to simply destroy the structures. Destroying the structures which other view as permissible will only divide the Muslim nation and increase hatred for each other.

we are on the same page..... I take Quran and Hadith as my $ource..... Not VVahabi$m..... I have a head to u$e...
I Agree to the po$t above....

 

[Desert Fox]

"Everything in the heavens and everything in the earth belongs to Allah. Whether you divulge what is in yourselves or keep it hidden, Allah will still call you to account for it. He forgives whoever He wills and He punishes whoever He wills. Allah has power over all things."

(Surat Al-Baqara, 284)

This Ayat pretty much sums it up!

 

[Aepsilons]

This Ayat pretty much sums it up!

This is why I don't like it when men started condemning men. We, all of us, are men, and are subject to the Law.

Only ALLAH is judge. The one who murders in the name of ALLAH , destroyers holy shrines in the name of ALLAH, might , in actuality be subject to the wrath of ALLAH, the Most Compassionate and Most Loving.

Eternity is Absolute!!

Allah does not forgive anything being associated with Him but He forgives whoever He wills for anything other than that. Anyone who associates something with Allah has gone very far astray.

(Surat An-Nisa, 116)

 

[sur]

In pictures: Isis destroys Iraq shrines..

This is deliberate attempt by West, to incite Shia against Sunni.
Exactly like Americans destroyed Iraq.
Those trained by Americans & having active US soldiers within them, with their faces covered & all, are doing the same thing.

RasoolAllah (peace and blessings be upon him and his family) is telling us to not take the graves as places of worship. Have i got it right so far? Now lets proceed:

1. Thus did We make their case known to the people, that they might know that the promise of Allah is true, and that there can be no doubt about the Hour of Judgment. Behold, they dispute among themselves as to their affair. (Some) said, “Construct a building over them”: Their Lord knows best about them: those who prevailed over their affair said,“Let us surely build a place of worship over them.” (Quran 18:21)

As I have explained in the earlier post, Allah has called those who built the mosque at the sight of ashab-e-kahf (people of the cave) believers. See the tafasir of this verse in my post.

3. Muhammad said: Abu hanifa informed us saying that Ata ibn as saib narrated to us saying the graves of Prophet Hud, Salih and Shuaib [aleh islam] is in Masjid Al Haram
[In pg 150,Kitab al-Athar of Imam al-Shaybani as published by Turath Publishing in London]

should it (Masjid al Haram) be demolished? Or is everyone committing shirk there?

4. What about the fact that RasoolAllah (peace and blessings be upon him and his family) was buried inside a room? And why did no one called it a bidda when Abu Bakr (Allah's mercy be on him) was buried in the same room? And what about Umar (Allah's mercy be upon him)? Did no one see the biddah happening there? People being buried under a physical structure?

These Quranic verses and ahadith (narrations) have been reconciled by Imam Ibn Hajr al-Asqalani (rha). He writes in his magnificent Fath ul Bari:
In view of the fact that the Jews and Christians were taking the graves of their Prophets as their qibla for the purpose of respect, and were paying attention towards them at the time of their prayers, their graves took the position of idols. For this reason the Muslims have been forbidden from this action. However, if someone constructs a mosque near the grave of a pious person for the prupose of seeking tabarruk and not for prostration or paying attention towards them, he will never be included in this prohibition.( Ibn Hajr al-‘Asqalani, Fath al-bari, vol. 3, p. 208)

Similarly the narration in which RasoolAllah (peace and blessings be upon him and his family) asked Ali bin abi Talib (Allah's mercy be upon him) to go and destroy certain graves was because those were being worshiped as objects by the disbelievers.

The problem with the wahabi mindset is that they pick up everything which applies to disbelievers and start applying it to believers without accommodating the other side of the argument.

Quran:4:59:and if you have a dispute concerning any matter, refer it to Allah and the messenger if you are (in truth) believers in Allah and the Last Day. That is better and more seemly in the end.



Best tafsir os Quran is Prophet Muhammad himself. No other tafsir stands a chance before Prophet's word.
Quran actually shows that those ppl had exact same mentality as you have, willing to build places of worship over dead\graves (Ashab-e-Kahf, who were actually sleeping; not even dead).


Um Habiba and Um Salama mentioned about a church they had seen in Ethiopia in which there were pictures. They told the Prophet about it, on which he said, "If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection.""Aisha added, "Had it not been for that (statement of the Prophet ) his grave would have been made conspicuous. But he was afraid that it might be taken as a place for worship.
Sahih al-Bukhari 4441, In-book reference : Book 64, Hadith 462, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 5, Book 59, Hadith 725
Sahih al-Bukhari 1390, In-book ref:Book 23, Hadith 143, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 2, Book 23, Hadith 472
Sahih al-Bukhari 427, In-book reference : Book 8, Hadith 77, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 1, Book 8, Hadith 419.
Sahih al-Bukhari 434, In-book reference : Book 8, Hadith 84, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 1, Book 8, Hadith 426.
Sahih al-Bukhari 3873, In-book reference : Book 63, Hadith 99, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 5, Book 58, Hadith 213
Sunan an-Nasa'i 703, In-book reference : Book 8, Hadith 16, English translation : Vol. 1, Book 8, Hadith 704.
Sahih Muslim 528a, In-book reference : Book 5, Hadith 21, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 4, Hadith 1076
Sahih Muslim 530a, In-book reference : Book 5, Hadith 25, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 4, Hadith 1080Sahih Muslim 530b, In-book reference : Book 5, Hadith 26, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Book 4, Hadith 1081..



Yahya related to me from Malik from Zayd ibn Aslam from Ata ibn Yasar that the Messenger of Allah, said, "O Allah! Do not make my grave an idol that is worshiped. The anger on those who took the graves of their Prophets as places of prostration was terrible."
Muwatta Malik:USC-MSA web (English) ref:Book 9, Hadith 88, Arabic ref:Book 9, Hadith 419.


Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Messenger said, "May Allah's curse be on those for they built the places of worship at the graves of their Prophets."
Sahih al-Bukhari 437, In-book reference : Book 8, Hadith 86, USC-MSA web (English) reference : Vol. 1, Book 8, Hadith 428
Sunan an-Nasa'i 2046,,, In-book ref:Book 21, Hadith 230,,, English translation:Vol. 3, Book 21, Hadith 2048.



Jabir said:The Messenger of Allah forbade that the graves should be plastered (made into permanent structures), used as sitting places (for the people) or building over them
Riyad as-Salihin: Sunnah.com reference : Book 18, Hadith 257, Arabic/English book reference : Book 18, Hadith 1767.



Do not sit on the graves and do not pray facing towards them.
Sahih Muslim 972 a,,, In-book ref:Book 11, Hadith 126,,, Online English ref:Book 4, Hadith 2121.




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As I have explained in the earlier post, Allah has called those who built the mosque at the sight of ashab-e-kahf (people of the cave) believers. See the tafasir of this verse in my post.

Firstly they never built a mosque were only planning to. Secondly that was NOT a grave nor were Ashab-e-Kahaf lying dead over there. It was just a cave.

Where did ALLAH call those who were to built mosque as "believers" again??????????????????????? Point out exactly.




People of that town about whom you just made a false claim that ALLAH called them believers.
Read what Ashab-e-kahaf themselves were saying about the ppl of that town.
Q:18:20: "اگر وہ تم پر دسترس پالیں گے تو تمہیں سنگسار کردیں گے یا پھر اپنے مذہب میں داخل کرلیں گے".

And Quran writes about ppl of that town, whom you just claimed were called believers:
Q:18:14-15 " ہم اس کے سوا کسی کو معبود (سمجھ کر) نہ پکاریں گے (اگر ایسا کیا) تو اس وقت ہم نے بعید از عقل بات کہی ان ہماری قوم کے لوگوں نے اس کے سوا اور معبود بنا رکھے ہیں۔".




Those whom you claimed as believers,,, were actually called "Mushrik" by Quran.


"هَـٰٓؤُلَآءِ قَوۡمُنَا ٱتَّخَذُواْ مِن دُونِهِۦۤ ءَالِهَةً۬‌ۖ "
"these ppl of our nation has taken as "Lords" others "besides HIM(ALLAH)"....




And you claimed ALLAH called that nation as believers...!!! Get some senses.
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There's no real quranic reference to back your religious claims. The deviant sect that you follow relies upon dubious ahaadis. Remember, not every hadis can be taken as the actual truth.

Where is the Quranic reference to back your grave worship??? or Quranic reference to even go to graves & raise hands towards them???& I said Quranic reference NOT ur corrupt bogus tafaseer by un-heard-of so-called imams.
And dubious Tafaseer that you follow are better that Ahadees.???
These are NOT any Hadees, these are authentic ahadees that are repeated & narratted by multiple Sahabees.

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[Aepsilons]

This is deliberate attempt by West, to incite Shia against Sunni.
Exactly like Americans destroyed Iraq.
Those trained by Americans & having active US soldiers within them, with their faces covered & all, are doing the same thing.





Best tafsir os Quran is Prophet Muhammad himself.


Um Habiba and Um Salama mentioned about a church they had seen in Ethiopia in which there were pictures. They told the Prophet about it, on which he said, "If any religious man dies amongst those people they would build a place of worship at his grave and make these pictures in it. They will be the worst creature in the sight of Allah on the Day of Resurrection."

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You are so quick to condemn. All men are SINFUL CREATURES and WORTHY OF DEATH in the SIGHT of ALLAH, Who Alone is Perfect.

But it is ALLAH who grants MERCY! GOD, is abundant in Mercy and Love. This is beyond the comprehension of MAN.