In Future we should get Gripen NG for our AF

[ANPP]

SAAB making Gripen NG for export too. Gripen NG will available in 2018 for export. Bro use Google if you have confusion.

Actually now future of NG is still not clear.
Testing of NG is going facing very problems. Swedish air force is questioning about that. No potential user except Swetzerland, even not Swesh air force.
Most imp factor is that whole world is going for 5 gen ( will go for 5 gen). SAAB also seeking partner for its 5 gen fighter so that NG would be scraped in favor of new fighter by Swesh air force. Let see what happen.

 

[Flynn Swagmire]

Hi, whoever started the Thread and All those who favored Gripen NG need to do some Research.

NG/IN A proposed Program including for india [fell through] but continues with Sweden/Switzerland. NG is Next Generation Program in development of Gripen E/F Variants. The Final product would have a value of $65M And double the price with life time complete support costs including training. Do you Think BAF can pay $150M per Gripen E/F[PAF paid appx $167M per F-16 BLK 52], Highly doubt so. BAF doesn't even have money to upgrade mig-29s or second mig-29 out of russian inventory being put on sale for 20M-25M AS IS.

Gripen E/F Engine US
Gripen E/F [US refused F-16s to BAF, assuredly Gripen would be refused]
BVR weapons is still AM-120 AMRAAM [Neither US would sell it nor would Sweden allow you to temper with Gripen]
Nothing special would come for Anti-Shipping and Chinese/Russian weapons cannot be integrated.
Data Link between Gripens would be fine or ground stations but without AEW&Cs which in my opinion is essential.
Higher Price Tag even a second hand mig-29 with upgrades and spares for next 20 Years would costs $60M.

There are three Threads with BAF purchase of suitable Aircraft and I read a couple of bangladeshis without keeping data and information on JF-17/FC-1 rated F-7BGI better then JF-17s. The go ahead would be of BAF. The way Technology is moving ahead and Economy is slowing down Globally BAF is out of options for a high end fighter in next 10 Years except if Russians sell them sukhoi-30/35 on soft very long term loans because sukhoi-35 is more expensive then Gripen and perhaps under indian pressure russians might never offer su-35 but a specific variant of su-30 yet it would depend upon if long term soft loans are offered or not as well as the total cost could end up $150M.

Nobody is going to advocate FC-1/JF-17 but logically any Air Force with limited budget would go for it along with reasons/factors.

No Sanctions, Effective Radar [PESA/AESA might be part of program in future blocks], IFR BLK II+, Array of weapons/weapons assistance equipment available to choose from for Air Force/Navy, HMD/HMS, Eventually Chinese WS series Engine or better russian Engine would come by. Brazil is a reliable seller and does not come under western pressure. Anti Radiation Missile MAR-1A could be weapon of choice/offer, Chinese AEW&C available for sales, procuring even one in a package would prove heavy capabilities with Eyes in the Skies.

To all of this if we forget about any aircraft purchase, did you people think of better ground Radars and Surface to Air Missiles. If I have $2B before going for any Aircraft I would buy Medium/Long Range SAMs network centric mesh and to make it difficult for Enemy to enter into my relatively small Air Space even for Rafale/su-30 it would not be easy to roam in Bangladeshi Air Space. A network centric warfare is need of the hour.

Now instead of coming here opening Threads that I like it so I want it, shall we talk the technical side the cost associated in long run, the weapons of choice, sanctions, the fair partners.

Wait...I gotta reply to a bangladeshi post from other Threads a poor logic comparing RD-93 to be poor with Mach 1.6 vs F-7BGI Mach 2 Engine. If PAF wanted it would along with Chinese designed the aircraft to take WP-14C Kunlun-3 Engine or WP-13F Engine short life but works but there are alot of technicalities associated with it.

Bro, I am not that kind of fool. Well Gripen NG enter service with name of Gripen E/F. Price of Gripen NG will be under 75 MIL USD with all costs, low cost is an advantage of Gripen. We are not want missile from USA we want engine and USA must not refuse to sell engine to us. SAAB give Gripen users weapon control software source code to make missiles or other ordinance compatible, we can use chinese or russian or any missile in Gripen NG. I have done many research before posting this thread.

 

[Flynn Swagmire]

Actually now future of NG is still not clear.
Testing of NG is going facing very problems. Swedish air force is questioning about that. No potential user except Swetzerland, even not Swesh air force.
Most imp factor is that whole world is going for 5 gen ( will go for 5 gen). SAAB also seeking partner for its 5 gen fighter so that NG would be scraped in favor of new fighter by Swesh air force. Let see what happen.

SAAB will go for Gripen NG. Many country using Gripen at this time and many looking for future Gripen NG. Making of 5th gen fighter is possible for SAAB but they cant compit with US companys and SAAB know that.

 

[Zabaniyah]

Add China to the list.

This is one area where Japan is actually lagging in, for a country that is highly respected for its advancements in all areas of science and particularly, technology.

Aviation propulsion is not one of Japan's strengths, compared to Western, Russian or Chinese companies.




Even though I disagree with you on a lot of issues, I still respect you for reasons I have mentioned earlier.

One request: do not ever mention China and that 'blot on humanity' blighted with the worst humanitarian crises in the world in the same sentence.

Also, whether you use an alphabetical list, or whether you use a list based on 'power ranking', China should come first, as China is far and away multiple times (4 to 10) stronger than that hellhole afflicted with the worst humanitarian crises in the world.


On topic: NO. WE SHOULD NEVER GO FOR GRIPEN-NG.

1. Price tag of $60 million is way too high for such a 'lightweight' aircraft with low payload and radar capabilities.

2. What air to air and air to surface missiles would we use on Gripen-NG?

3. Engines come from USA! Another big reason for a "No".

If some of these teenagers are so desperate, they should go and beg USA personally to donate 5 squadrons of F-16 block-60 for free to be delivered starting in 2013 and ending in 2018, let's say. That'd be much cheaper, comes with the same set of strings attached as a Gripen-NG, and same set of restrictions of warfighting capabilities as the West would impose if we go for Gripen-NG.

I never said China is incapable of manufacturing effective turbofan engines in the future. They are still working on it right now.

And I have said earlier that given the engine is an American design, it will inevitably have political strings attached to it. These are often complex and add additional costs to acquiring the aircraft and other critical components.

And there is the AMRAAM BVR missile. Something the Americans do not easily sell to anyone. Though, Gripen would be able to fire the Meteor in the near future. But again, it'd be a question of money.

*sigh*

See, some people in this country equate such complex procurement to buying rice from the local bazaar. And there's the reason for why everything in this country is out of control ranging from our ridiculous loan from Russia to other issues.

americans will never sell us amraams, malaysia wanted some and the US refused.

Well, Pakistan and Thailand are currently active users of the AMRAAM.

It's not impossible to acquire it. It is just time-consuming and costly with a lot of political dilly dallying. That's why Malaysia acquired Su-30s instead of Super Hornets.

Being a major non-NATO ally also helps in acquiring such items!

 

[Luftwaffe]

Bangladeshi fellas; You people can consider Gripen as Popsicle at the end of day Gripen C/D has a flyaway cost of $60M without life time support costs associated which take it to $150M plus.

Get 2.5B to buy a squadron [16 BAF] even with 4B sweden would not sell it to BAF, there are too many US Technologies inside it.

Like it or not you're gonna hang out with russians and Chinese and you can see what russians did to iran took the money kept it made profit over it and then at sanctions returned it without weapons delivery that was signed before resolution of sanctions were passed. If russians can refuse to sell anything to Pakistan under indian pressure bangladesh is nothing. Who knows russians provide source codes to indians for your future russian fighters you would be sitting ducks.

 

[UKBengali]

Bangladeshi fellas; You people can consider Gripen as Popsicle at the end of day Gripen C/D has a flyaway cost of $60M without life time support costs associated which take it to $150M plus.

Get 2.5B to buy a squadron [16 BAF] even with 4B sweden would not sell it to BAF, there are too many US Technologies inside it.

Like it or not you're gonna hang out with russians and Chinese and you can see what russians did to iran took the money kept it made profit over it and then at sanctions returned it without weapons delivery that was signed before resolution of sanctions were passed. If russians can refuse to sell anything to Pakistan under indian pressure bangladesh is nothing. Who knows russians provide source codes to indians for your future russian fighters you would be sitting ducks.

The other issue is that the capabilities of the aircraft would be known to the Indians. Yes, BD may also have the advantage of being familiar with some Indian aircraft like SU-30 but it would be clueless against others like Rafale.

BD should not purchase all it's 4th gen fighters solely from Russia.

A force of 24 SU-3027/30s when combined with 24-36 J-10Bs would make an ideal addition to the BAF this decade

 

[bigzgvr4]

change ur q-5 with jf-17,f-7 with j-10b and change ur mig-29 or keep them and add south korean FA-50 very potent combo
jf-17 and j-10 offers weapon system which can be used with any 4th gen aircraft and are very potent unlike others like the grippen have no latest anti ship missile check out the c803 and cm400akg real nice and c803 varriants are battle proven by hezbollah destroying israeli ship

These are the list of fourth Gen Fighter air crafts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4.5_generation_jet_fighter#.22Fourth_and_half.22_generation

 

[Luftwaffe]

change ur q-5 with jf-17,f-7 with j-10b and change ur mig-29 or keep them and add south korean FA-50 very potent combo

 

[bigzgvr4]

For the price of 2 sqaudrons of Gripen NG(which is more expensivethen the Regular Grippen C/D which cost $60mil each) you can Have 2 sqaudrons of Each of those Fighters i posted above JF-t cost 12 to 15 mil each, j-10b cost 15-20 mil each and i dont know about the South KoreAN ONE

 

[Luftwaffe]

The other issue is that the capabilities of the aircraft would be known to the Indians. Yes, BD may also have the advantage of being familiar with some Indian aircraft like SU-30 but it would be clueless against others like Rafale.

BD should not purchase all it's 4th gen fighters solely from Russia.

A force of 24 SU-3027/30s when combined with 24-36 J-10Bs would make an ideal addition to the BAF this decade

IF PAF goes for J-31 you have yourself a chance for J-10B provided Govt is reliable enough unlike the current Govt.

A fair opinion; refurbished modernized J-10As along with J-10Bs would be a good approach.

 

[bigzgvr4]

IF PAF goes for J-31 you have yourself a chance for J-10B provided Govt is reliable enough unlike the current Govt.

A fair opinion; refurbished modernized J-10As along with J-10Bs would be a good approach.

PAF does not own the J-10 Franchise buddy its only China and they can sell it to who ever they want

 

[Luftwaffe]

PAF does not own the J-10 Franchise buddy its only China and they can sell it to who ever they want

That remains to be seem.

 

[kalu_miah]

For the price of 2 sqaudrons of Gripen NG(which is more expensivethen the Regular Grippen C/D which cost $60mil each) you can Have 2 sqaudrons of Each of those Fighters i posted above JF-t cost 12 to 15 mil each, j-10b cost 15-20 mil each and i dont know about the South KoreAN ONE

http://www.defence.pk/forums/bangladesh-defence/192696-mig-29-bought-baf-6.html#post3152794
Fly away cost of FA50 is about $30 million.

 

[bigzgvr4]

http://www.defence.pk/forums/bangladesh-defence/192696-mig-29-bought-baf-6.html#post3152794
Fly away cost of FA50 is about $30 million.

One problem with fa50 it uses american engine ijust saw it on wikki just like the gripen ng does So it is very unreliable when it comes to sanctions

 

[kalu_miah]

One problem with fa50 it uses american engine ijust saw it on wikki just like the gripen ng does So it is very unreliable when it comes to sanctions

Precisely. So that pretty much rules out the FA50 and leaves us with the Chinese as the best option for the medium term. In the long term, I expect the Koreans to develop their own engines, at which time it may become a viable option. Note also that Philippines and Indonesia invested with Korean aerospace and if I remember correctly, bought either FA/TA-50 planes already.