IDEAS 2018/New Fighter Induction

[Signalian]

Okay I took a pain killer to help reply you. Ever heard a word standoff weapons?
Destroying S-400 is not an issue it can be destroyed. The issue is destroying it cost-effectively. Firing a salvo of ballistic missile will destroy it but it will cost more. So we need to find a way to cheaply destroy it. Jf-17 can do it with RAAD but it will require 17 jets to take out one battery. So what is the solution our current solution is Mirage that is the jet which has the strike capability and payload capacity to give a hit but they are old boys. We need a jet that can launch at least 4 missiles of 600 km and we need a new air to ground missile with smaller war head and 600 km range and it as to be supersonic. Under this we can take out one battery of S-400 cheaply and can also have a stop gap fighter.

why be so limited in options to take out S-400.

We did a blunder by trusting US with block 52 and now we are stuck with them with bleak prospects of further machines and upgrades

It wasn't about trust. The F-16's were offered as part of aid package with other options. If really anything then it was the 2005 earthquake which brought the orders down from 75 or 55.

 

[BHarwana]

why be so limited in options to take out S-400.

Had a little headache so I was trying to be brief. I agree there many options. Yes you can also help on shedding some light on electronic warfare side and let's take the discussion on a more relevant thread. I was waiting to know your insight. Please tag me there if you can.

 

[Signalian]

Had a little headache so I was trying to be brief. I agree there many options. Yes you can also help on shedding some light on electronic warfare side and let's take the discussion on a more relevant thread. I was waiting to know your insight. Please tag me there if you can.

Im just not getting time. but apart from "salvo of BM's, CM's"....

There are many points to ponder and many point of views to look at it.

S-400 Radar's signal cannot be strong everywhere in a 250km radius. weak spots due to terrain, exploiting radar border ranges etc.
S-400 hunted by SF/assets in enemy territory during war.
S-400 missiles vs AAM.
S-400 missile vs decoys and jammers. similarly S-400 radar vs decoys and jammers. at which range of S-400 the signal is weak so jamming is extremely effective without knowledge of presence of jamming taking place. self defense counter measures by aircrafts.
and then again Deployment of S-400 in war time. Its availability in a sector.
Should S-400 be engaged or avoided.

There are a lot of variables.

 

[帅的一匹]

i think its L15 advanced trainer. and its for AZM training.

Im just not getting time. but apart from "salvo of BM's, CM's"....

There are many points to ponder and many point of views to look at it.

S-400 Radar's signal cannot be strong everywhere in a 250km radius. weak spots due to terrain, exploiting radar border ranges etc.
S-400 hunted by SF/assets in enemy territory during war.
S-400 missiles vs AAM.
S-400 missile vs decoys and jammers. similarly S-400 radar vs decoys and jammers. at which range of S-400 the signal is weak so jamming is extremely effective without knowledge of presence of jamming taking place. self defense counter measures by aircrafts.
and then again Deployment of S-400 in war time. Its availability in a sector.
Should S-400 be engaged or avoided.

There are a lot of variables.

we will try s400 with J 16D and J 20. try to exploit its weakness and will share with PAF.

 

[Signalian]

we will try s400 with J 16D and J 20. try to exploit its weakness and will share with PAF.

PLAAF assisting PAF aside, is there a portal here where i can upload an e-book on forum so anyone interested can get an idea about the stuff i'm talking about.

books name is :
David L. Adamy, EW101: A first course in electronic warfare.

@BHarwana ?

 

[HRK]

PLAAF assisting PAF aside, is there a portal here where i can upload an e-book on forum so anyone interested can get an idea about the stuff i'm talking about.

books name is :
David L. Adamy, EW101: A first course in electronic warfare.

@BHarwana ?

I think very large size of documents could not be uploaded to forum if possible share the link after uploading the book at google drive

 

[The Accountant]

why be so limited in options to take out S-400.


It wasn't about trust. The F-16's were offered as part of aid package with other options. If really anything then it was the 2005 earthquake which brought the orders down from 75 or 55.

I would have utilised that aid in other equipments with less dependancy on OEM ... we witnessed pressler amendment scenario and we were bitten multiple times by same snake from same whole ... we should have known that fighter aircrafts is the way to control us ... we witnessed this in 65, 71 and 85 but still in 2008 we offerred our hand to same snake ...

Very few people know that had india continued 65 war we would have started loosing as we were out of ammunition due to sanctions by our main supplier USA

We should have planed it in our way rather than the way american wanted

 

[Signalian]

I think very large size of documents could not be uploaded to forum if possible share the link after uploading the book at google drive

found the link for the book:

http://falcon.blu3wolf.com/Docs/Electronic-Warfare-Fundamentals.pdf

 

[CriticalThought]

found the link for the book:

http://falcon.blu3wolf.com/Docs/Electronic-Warfare-Fundamentals.pdf

I'll ping you once I make some progress on it.

 

[ziaulislam]

Ideally the JF-17 should have had the same size & capabilities as the F-16. The PAF was totally mesmerised by the Gripen they tested in the 90s. They decided to build a cheaper one for themselves without thinking it through.

What engine would have PAF opted for than...do you think PAF knew abt J10 and would have asked if they can join that project instead..and how would have that affected the cost dynamics ...seeing we cant even afford the thunder!

 

[Ultima Thule]

Okay I took a pain killer to help reply you. Ever heard a word standoff weapons?
Destroying S-400 is not an issue it can be destroyed. The issue is destroying it cost-effectively. Firing a salvo of ballistic missile will destroy it but it will cost more. So we need to find a way to cheaply destroy it. Jf-17 can do it with RAAD but it will require 17 jets to take out one battery. So what is the solution our current solution is Mirage that is the jet which has the strike capability and payload capacity to give a hit but they are old boys. We need a jet that can launch at least 4 missiles of 600 km and we need a new air to ground missile with smaller war head and 600 km range and it as to be supersonic. Under this we can take out one battery of S-400 cheaply and can also have a stop gap fighter.

you have no idea what is you taking about @BHarwana you can't launch standoff missile with extreme ranges, first you have to guide your proposed 600 km missile with precision we don't have satellite to guide most its flight, to increase chance of PK (probability of hit) you have to launch it relatively closer to the targets if you have a range of 600 km missile then you have to launch 500- 400 km from the targets @BHarwana

And Subsonic CM is best because supersonic missile has big IR signature and be countered Ir guided SAMs and AAMs @BHarwana

 

[Suff Shikan]

Can any bloody civilian attend?

Yes u can... just need a pass. for that u have to visit National Coaching Centre, there will be a temporary setup for passes 2 days earliers from Expo to 30th i think. I visited last time.

 

[YeBeWarned]

we will try s400 with J 16D and J 20. try to exploit its weakness and will share with PAF.

I am very interested to see how J20 performed against S400

 

[The Accountant]

I am very interested to see how J20 performed against S400

S400 requires a network of sensor to detech stealth plan... TO target S-400 you have to disable its sensors away from command and control structures one by one using stealthy cruise missiles ... It requires lot of efforts and careful planning and excellent execution to do this but if we succeed in taking out S400 Indian Air defense will be very weak ...

 

[Signalian]

I'll ping you once I make some progress on it.

I worked on three types of domains in Radars:
1. Firstly, in an anechoic chamber for radar cross section measurements.
2. Then in a signal jamming scenario and noise jamming scenario.
3. And in the end on IR Systems using FLIR camera on different materials for their heat signatures.

so i might be able to help you with RCS, jamming and FLIR concepts. I would have loved to share the reports i wrote on all 3 and pictures of equipment and materials of all these, but i'm not allowed to, however being a research student in this field, i have access to EW 102, 103 and 104 books and lots of other material online through my research portal.