IAF to get fifth gen fighters only after 2019

[GR!FF!N]

The F35 does not figure in India's procurement plan, it still a few years away from production, and has huge backlog of orders. so atleast one indian 5th gen platform will be nearer to induction in that time frame.

yes the FGFA will be the F 22
the AMCA will be the F35 for the IAF. + 250 T 50 is also planned.

not 250...its lesser than that.but yup,FHFA will be for air superiority role where AMCA will be for strike role..I hope AMCA's payload will be significantly larger than F-35..

 

[newdelhinsa]

That sounds more realist.

Also a good insight for those who think making Fifth-gen fighter is easy by mere testing a canopy made of tin with some criss cross angles.

 

[Edevelop]

So it does seem like China will have a couple of squadrons of J-20 by 2019. As India gets its hands on 5th gen, i hope Pakistan can too be in the same boat

 

[GR!FF!N]

So it does seem like China will have a couple of squadrons of J-20 by 2019. As India gets its hands on 5th gen, i hope Pakistan can too be in the same boat

being realist,I can say,it'll be more likely that J-20 will enter production in 2018-2019(if everything go properly)..so,few squadrons are incorrect.

 

[Ambitious.Asian]

So it does seem like China will have a couple of squadrons of J-20 by 2019. As India gets its hands on 5th gen, i hope Pakistan can too be in the same boat

i should suggest pakistan not to buy J-20...

 

[illusion8]

With regard to the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA), being jointly designed and developed by India and Russia, both sides noted that the first stage of the preliminary design contract has been successfully completed and the second stage of the PD Contract is to be finalised before September, 2012. The training programme for the Indian engineers covering nearly 20 courses was completed in July, 2011. Both sides agreed to continue discussions for finalization of the R&D contract as per the agreed time lines of the general contract signed in December, 2008.

Press Information Bureau English Releases

 

[Mercenary]

India's weapon acquisitions move at a glacial pace. I say even the 2020 time frame is not realistic. It probably won't be until 2025 until the first planes are absorbed into the Indian Armed Forces and not until 2030 until a proper squadrons are deployed to the front lines.

 

[faithfulguy]

Well the delay is a bit dissapointing but given the magnitude of this project....it's quite normal.Our air force can afford 1-2 years of delay but the dead line shouldn't slip more than that.If that happens,then IAF will again face problems like it's facing now.

Don't hold your breath. Expect more delays. Even F-35 has delays and that happens when its a joint project when there are too many chefs in the kitchen.

 

[illusion8]

not 250...its lesser than that.but yup,FHFA will be for air superiority role where AMCA will be for strike role..I hope AMCA's payload will be significantly larger than F-35..

Speculative figures are around 200-250 to absorb the high development cost of the program and to reduce the need to export the aircraft substantially.

reg. AMCA payload, In February 2011, Air Chief Marshal Pradeep Vasant Naik said the MCA will have a payload capability of more than five tons.

 

[faithfulguy]

I am not surprised considering the lack of proper defense planning at the highest level, courtesy which our defense infrastructure remains unceremoniously myopic. In fact, I'd have been astounded had IAF started inductions by 2017.

But looking at this scenario, it can be assumed that we will be needing hell load of Tejas and MRCAs (at least 250 each) to balance off for the delay of PAKFA. At this rate, I don't see AMCA's first taxiing tests anywhere before 2022, forget induction by 2025.

To be honest, by 2022, the needs of Indian AF would change and the requirements won't be the same. So a plane envision to start development by 2020 would be impossible to predict what it would be like.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

India's weapon acquisitions move at a glacial pace. I say even the 2020 time frame is not realistic. It probably won't be until 2025 until the first planes are absorbed into the Indian Armed Forces and not until 2030 until a proper squadrons are deployed to the front lines.

India's weapon acquisitions depends upon Pakistan , if PAF ends having a 5th gen operational before India, you"ll see India MOD doing her best to have an operational 5th gen within a year.

 

[Edevelop]

The difference is India is signing contacts for the future and Pakistan and China are actually building fighter jets at a very fast pace.

JF-17 Block 1 (4 Gen) was first tested in 2003. In a few years, we improved to include DSI (Diverterless supersonic inlet), Pods (radar jamming), different kinds of weapons carrying (PL-5, Aim-9, C803 anti-shipping, SD-10 BVR, MR-1 anti Radiation, Ra'ad), data links with other fighter jets (F-16, Mirage, F-7) and with AWACS (Saab Eriye, ZDK-03). Lol about 50 have been produced

JF-17 Block 2 (4.5 Gen) which will come out later in 2012 will have greater use of composites, reduced RCS, improved avionics/data link, and an IFR Probe. over 100 will be produced

J-10A (4 Gen) has been produced since 1998. The inventory has been over 210.

J-10B (4.5 Gen) tested in 2008 with changes such as DSI intake, AESA radar, IRST, IFR Probe and new Chinese WS-10B Engine!

J-11 A, B, BS, BH. (4.5 Gen) Uptil now there are almost 200 of the first production

J-20 (5th Gen) tested in 2011. There have been 2 produced as of 2012.

Future for Pakistan:
JF-17 Block 2 production starts by end of 2012
F-16 Block 40/52 ...more purchase...
J-10B delivery to Pakistan by end of 2014
JF-17 Block 3 (5th Gen) production starts on 2015


By 2019 we will be ready!

 

[The enlightened]

The difference is India is signing contacts for the future and Pakistan and China are actually building fighter jets at a very fast pace.

I can't believe JF-17 Block 1 (4 Gen) was first tested in 2003. In a few years, we improved to include DSI (Diverterless supersonic inlet), Pods (radar jamming), different kinds of weapons carrying (PL-5, Aim-9, C803 anti-shipping, SD-10 BVR, MR-1 anti Radiation, Ra'ad), data links with other fighter jets (F-16, Mirage, F-7) and with AWACS (Saab Eriye, ZDK-03).

JF-17 Block 2 (4.5 Gen) which will come out later in 2012 will have greater use of composites, reduced RCS, improved avionics/data link, and an IFR Probe.

J-10A (4 Gen) has been produced since 1998. The inventory has been over 210.

J-10B (4.5 Gen) tested in 2008 with changes such as DSI intake, AESA radar, IRST, IFR Probe and new Chinese WS-10B Engine!

J-11 A, B, BS, BH. (4.5 Gen) Uptil now there are almost 200 of the first production

J-20 (5th Gen( tested in 2011. There have been 2 produced as of 2012.

Future for Pakistan:
JF-17 Block 2 production starts by end of 2012
F-16 Block 40/52 ...more...
J-10B delivery to Pakistan by end of 2014
JF-17 Block 3 (5th Gen) starts on 2015


By 2019 we will be ready!

Advanced Avionics, JF-17 B-III (stealth), composites, Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah
The very fact that you throw these words around without any substance is enough for anyone to believe that you don't even know what they are.
And yes, by 2019 your PAF will be ready............................ to be massacred.

 

[Boobytrap]

No work has even started on JF-17 block-II PERIOD !! And ^this guy is talking of block -III.

Apparition at its best.. wut !!



#when specifically questioned, even chinese members don't know the specs of AESA radar in PLAAF and here we see pakistanis claiming all BS. Really funny. Feel sorry for them though

 

[sancho]

The Indian designers are trying to mirror the USAF programs:

the FGFA will be the F 22
the AMCA will be the F35 for the IAF.

That's possibly what DRDO and ADA had in mind and what the common mistake is, because that is based just by the fact that we would have 2 x stealth fighters in different weight classes, but it completely ignors the different requirements of IAF and USAF or that F35 and AMCA will be completely different fighters too!

1. F35 will replace nearly all older types of aircrafts in all US forces, that's by far not the case for AMCA because it will be just a minor and operationally not needed addition to the fleet, since IAF will have FGFA, Super 30 MKI, Rafale and LCA at the same time!

2. F35 is meant to be a cost-effective low end alternative, to the more capable F22. That's why it won't have all the latest features a 5th gen fighter actually should have (SC, supermaneuverability...). That again is not the case for AMCA, because apart from the weight class, it is planned to get any feature FGFA actually offers too, which doesn't make it really cost-effective.

3. Operationally, F35 is highly aimed on strike capability contrary to F22 that has Air superiority as the main goal. FGFA and AMCA on the other side will be developed to have a more balanced multi role capability. Both will have good flight performance, carry many A2A but also A2G weapons, which again makes them completely different from the F22/F35 idea.

The only need for AMCA will be in IN, since it has no 5th gen fighter selected or under development yet, while IAF with already 4 x different types of fighters selected for the next at least 30 years don't need it. It would be easier and more useful to add more numbers of MMRCA, LCA and FGFA + developing armed drones and UCAVs, instead of inducting another fighter, but it's doubtful that IAF will just look and see IN getting an indigenous fighter that they don't have, even if they don't need it.


Wrt the topic, it's actually not surprising since Russia and India are known for delayed programms and if the US have so much trouble with their stealth fighters, it should be clear that we will face even more problems in the coming years too. Around 2020 was always the more realistic timeframe and it still needs to be seen what kind of changes India requires compared to Russia.