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IAF Indian Air Force Better Than PLAAF?

Guys yesterday my main ID got banned ( Possibly serving a detention in Askaban admist Dementos ) for cracking a chinese detective joke. If someone got offended i really feel sorry.

Ok here i'll give a fair comparison

Fighters
The two forces are fairly even matched after the IAF (India air force) brought Sukhoi Su-30MKI which is suppose to be better than the Chinese Sukhoi Su-30MKK. However the latest report from China is that the indigenous built J-11 surpasses the Sukhoi Su-30MKK and maybe (not sure) the Sukhoi Su-30MKI. So we have to look at the numbers: (numbers below are debatable)

(Forth-fifth Gen fighters)

PLAAF (391)

Su-27 (76)- In addition to license producing J-11s, China has purchased a number of fully-built Su-27s from Russia. By 2008, most of these aircraft has been upgraded to J-11A standard in terms of radar, avionics, and weapons.

Su-30MKK (100)- In terms of air-to-air capability, the Su-30 are probably the weakest of the Flankers flying Chinese colors. The Su-30 was primarily ordered for its advanced ground attack capabilities. The far more advanced Su-30MKK2, with both enhanced A2A as well as anti-shipping capabilities, is in service with the Chinese navy.

J-11 (95)- The first J-11s were license-produced copies of Russian Su-27SKs/UBKs that were imported from Russia. The first Chinese improvement to the basic J-11 was the J-11A, which featured an improved Russian radar, a Chinese Helmet-mounted-sight system, and some digitized, LCD displays. A new indigenous variant, classified the J-11B appeared in 2006. This variant featured an improved Chinese-designed radar, full air-to-ground and anti-shipping capability, improved missile-warning systems, much improved avionics, solid-state electronics, and a full-glass cockpit. A mixture of J-11A and J-11B avionic/radar upgrades have been since applied to nearly all J-11s and Su-27s in Chinese service. Other significant improvements to the Su-27 involves a more reliable Chinese-designed engine with a modest performance improvement over the Russian AL-31, use of composites which make up 70% of the weight of the aircraft, and minor redesigns that cumulate in a weight reduction of about 10% and radar-signature reduction of 88%.

J-10 (120)- The J-10 is China's only indigenous 4th-generation fighter. It is a much smaller fighter than the Flanker, and thus has less range, payload, and a less-powerful radar. However, it enjoys much greater maneuverability and reduced radar-cross section (of less than 1m squared, vs 3m squared of J-11B and 25m squared of baseline Flankers). The J-10 is also easier and cheaper to produce. Currently, the Chinese are working on a AESA radar for the J-10.

IAF (212)

Su-30MKI (110)- The Su-30MKI is one of the most advanced Flanker variants in current operation. It features a passive phased array radar, advanced FLIR and electro-optical capability, thrust-vectoring, and impressive low-speed maneuverability, thanks to the addition of canards. Hands-down, the Su-30MKI is superior to all Flankers short of the J-11B in PLAAF service. It is difficult to compare the MKI to the J-11B however, due to their relative advantages in different areas. The Su-30MKI is about 20% heavier, and features an engine with slightly less powerful dry(non-afterburning) thrust, thus giving it a slightly lower thrust-to-weight ratio. Furthermore, the Su-30MKI also has about 8 times the radar-cross section of the J-11B. In terms of radar, the Su-30MKI has a clear advantage, and the MKI still retains a slight advantage in avionics despite major improvements to China's indigenous avionics industry. The MKI is also more maneuverable at subsonic speeds, though the J-11B has a superior climb-rate and better acceleration.

Mig-29 (62)- The Mig-29 is a very capable fighter, and is a smaller complement to the Su-30MKI much like the J-10 is to the J-11. India has accumulated a variety of Mig-29 variants with a even larger variety of radars/avionics over the years, but they are all slated for upgrades and standardization in 2008. Both the Mig-29 and J-10 are claimed to be superior to the F-16 in terms of performance and maneuverability. It is possible for the Mig-29s to receive PESA radar, either with the currently ongoing upgrades or with a future upgrades package.

Mirage-2000 (51)- The Mirage is a multi-role French fighter that excels at both the A2A and A2G roles. However, the Mirages are incompatible with the Russian missiles that the IAF uses. Currently, India is undergoing negotiations with France to upgrade the Mirages with more modern weapons. The Mirage is an older and somewhat less capable design when compared to the Flanker, Fulcrum, and J-10.

(Third Gen fighters)

PLAAF (800)

J-8II (300)- The J-8 is an indigenous Chinese high-speed interceptor. The current variant, the J-8F uses Chinese radar with the ability to fire the latest Chinese BVR missiles and features a more powerful and efficient engine over earlier designs. Older J-8s are being upgraded to J-8H standard, which also features an advanced Chinese radar but retains the older engine type.

J-7- The J-7 is a Chinese fighter based on the Russian Mig-21 design. Current J-7s in Chinese service feature a double-delta wing design and a Chinese-designed engine, offering it much enhanced maneuverability and performance. Although BVR capable version exists for export, the PLAAF has instead decided to pursue upgrades in its WVR capabilities. Its radar is designed to work in tandem with a HMS, allowing it to fire a variety of the latest off-bore sight WVR missiles at multiple targets.

JH-7- The JH-7 is an indigenous fighter-bomber developed in China that is optimized for A2G precision strike. A naval version also exists, serving the PLANAF. In the air-to-air role, the JH-7 lacks BVR capability.

IAF (256)

Jaguar (131)- The Jaguar is an European fighter-bomber that is utilized primary for the deep-strike role by the IAF. Like the JH-7, Jaguars possess advanced A2G capabilities but lacks BVR capability for A2A combat. The Jaguar carries a lesser payload and has a lower top speed when compared to the JH-7.

Mig-21 BISON (125)- The Bison is an advanced Mig-21 variant, and the only one with BVR capability. It also has a significantly improved engine for better performance. However, its BVR range is limited and the one's in IAF service have been very prone to mishaps and accidents, hence earning the nickname "flying coffin."

(Second Gen Fighters)

PLAAF (0)

IAF (175)

Mig-21 (175)- The IAF still operates a number of older Mig-21 designs. These aging fighters are slated to be phased out of IAF service by 2011. They possess aging airframes, and lack both BVR capability or enhanced WVR capability.

Clearly the IAF is at an disadvantage in terms of number (1191 vs 593).

In terms of quality, it depends on the particular aircraft and capability. For example, the Su-30MKI is the most advanced aircraft out of the two air forces, yet the Mig-21bis is also the least advanced. Furthermore, Indian and Chinese aircraft possess dissimilar advantages and disadvantages, making it difficult to do direct comparisons such as J-11B vs Su-30MKI and J-10 vs Mig-29. This is also seen in the radars of the two air forces, with the IAF possessing PESA radar on the MKI and possibly the Mig-29 in the future, while the PLAAF uses inferior mechanical array radars. On the other hand, the PLAAF has been able to develop mechanical array radars superior to the generation of Russian and Western radars found on the majority of IAF fighters.

In term of missile, the R-77/R-73 BVR/WVR combo is seen in both air forces. Both nations also use the Russian R-27 BVR missile. However, in recent years the PLA has also added the SD-10 BVR missile and PL-9 WVR missile on some of its newer aircraft.

Next is pilot training, according to external sources, only recently has PLAAF training begin to improve. Prior to the induction of Flankers, the average PLAAF pilot only flew for about 80-100 hours a year, as compared to the 210 hour average of the USAF. In recent years, the PLAAF has stepped up its training, requiring 180 hours for frontline fighter pilots and 120 hours for J-8 and J-7 pilots.

Pilot training the IAF varies widely by unit, though it is upwards of 200 hours for elite Su-30MKI squadrons.

Futhermore, beyond actual fighters, the IAF & PLAAF both have AWACs capability Indian AWAC's can carry out surveillance at about 400-km range under all-weather situation and to lock on to 60 targets simultaneously has a 360-degree phased array radar mounted on to the heavylift IL-76 transport aircraft airframe and would provide the much-required battlespace situational awareness for the IAF for its tactical and strategic operations. PLAAF operates 4 KJ-2000 platforms and numerous smaller Y-8 platforms. The Chinese platforms all all indigenous, demonstrating that the Chinese are capable of designing and producing advanced AESA radars.

On a interesting note, China has got no air force wings or bases near India, for most of its airbases are either located near the Taiwan Strait, near Beijing, or in the Northeastern area of the country
 
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Guys yesterday my main ID got banned for cracking a chinese detective joke. If someone got offended i really feel sorry.
sorry for that, it's not a big deal auctually, just a joke.

J-10 (120)- The J-10 is China's only indigenous 4th-generation fighter. It is a much smaller fighter than the Flanker, and thus has less range, payload, and a less-powerful radar. However, it enjoys much greater maneuverability and reduced radar-cross section (of less than 1m squared, vs 3m squared of J-11B and 25m squared of baseline Flankers). The J-10 is also easier and cheaper to produce. Currently, the Chinese are working on a AESA radar for the J-10.

J-10's and J-11's RCS is said to be 3m and 5m respectively, 1m and 3m is an exaggeration.

about JH-7 and Jaguar or even MKK,MKK2, they are attack bombers not fighters. so they can not be categorize as fighter as G3 or G4. when came to the price tag: Bomber >> attack bomber > fighter, however, the air combat performances would be:Bomber(hardly any) <<< attack bomber < fighter .so gerneral speaking, they won't be used as fighters, coz it is not a cost-effective choice.
 
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I'll say what everyone else is thinking, don't get raged ladies and gentlemen...

China has about 2000+ combat aircrafts

India has about 1000 give or take...

Numbers going to 2:1:0 ratio in favor of China, but we don't know what they really have compared to India Sukhoi MKI aircrafts..(See I'm not biased towards any particular country :D..) But this also goes down to who are better fighter pilots, India as of course been trained by U.S Topgun, and Israeli Topgun, so overall with the best Fighter experience goes to them... Going to the MRCA deal, I highly doubt India will go for our F-16 Viper, and F-18 S/H we are going to get snubbed... They're going to go with the their Russian Counter-parts...
Well I just made a Useless wall of Text...

Inconclusion, I don't care because :usflag: > India, China Together :O...

U.S Airforce Combat aircraft: 5,200, 2,200+ combat aircraft..
U.S Navy Combat Aircraft: 3,700+
(I won't include adding of 400-500 F-35 Lightning II in the mix...)

Amen man. Hey, you forgot about the UCAV's already in the US inventory, or will be in the next 4 years. (mainly: X-47B and X-45C)

Let Pak, India, and China gloat about their "superior" 4th-gen fighter, while the US works on next-gen UCAV's and the 6th-gen fighter (to replace F-35....yes, the replacement fighter R&D begins when the current is "released"...15-20 year development cycle. Although, the 22/35 came with 10 years of eachother.) and bomber (to replace the B-2). Which, both will be unmanned.


:usflag:
 
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Guys yesterday my main ID got banned ( Possibly serving a detention in Askaban admist Dementos ) for cracking a chinese detective joke. If someone got offended i really feel sorry.

Ok here i'll give a fair comparison

Fighters
The two forces are fairly even matched after the IAF (India air force) brought Sukhoi Su-30MKI which is suppose to be better than the Chinese Sukhoi Su-30MKK. However the latest report from China is that the indigenous built J-11 surpasses the Sukhoi Su-30MKK and maybe (not sure) the Sukhoi Su-30MKI. So we have to look at the numbers: (numbers below are debatable)

(Forth-fifth Gen fighters)

PLAAF (391)

Su-27 (76)- In addition to license producing J-11s, China has purchased a number of fully-built Su-27s from Russia. By 2008, most of these aircraft has been upgraded to J-11A standard in terms of radar, avionics, and weapons.

Su-30MKK (100)- In terms of air-to-air capability, the Su-30 are probably the weakest of the Flankers flying Chinese colors. The Su-30 was primarily ordered for its advanced ground attack capabilities. The far more advanced Su-30MKK2, with both enhanced A2A as well as anti-shipping capabilities, is in service with the Chinese navy.

J-11 (95)- The first J-11s were license-produced copies of Russian Su-27SKs/UBKs that were imported from Russia. The first Chinese improvement to the basic J-11 was the J-11A, which featured an improved Russian radar, a Chinese Helmet-mounted-sight system, and some digitized, LCD displays. A new indigenous variant, classified the J-11B appeared in 2006. This variant featured an improved Chinese-designed radar, full air-to-ground and anti-shipping capability, improved missile-warning systems, much improved avionics, solid-state electronics, and a full-glass cockpit. A mixture of J-11A and J-11B avionic/radar upgrades have been since applied to nearly all J-11s and Su-27s in Chinese service. Other significant improvements to the Su-27 involves a more reliable Chinese-designed engine with a modest performance improvement over the Russian AL-31, use of composites which make up 70% of the weight of the aircraft, and minor redesigns that cumulate in a weight reduction of about 10% and radar-signature reduction of 88%.

J-10 (120)- The J-10 is China's only indigenous 4th-generation fighter. It is a much smaller fighter than the Flanker, and thus has less range, payload, and a less-powerful radar. However, it enjoys much greater maneuverability and reduced radar-cross section (of less than 1m squared, vs 3m squared of J-11B and 25m squared of baseline Flankers). The J-10 is also easier and cheaper to produce. Currently, the Chinese are working on a AESA radar for the J-10.

IAF (212)

Su-30MKI (110)- The Su-30MKI is one of the most advanced Flanker variants in current operation. It features a passive phased array radar, advanced FLIR and electro-optical capability, thrust-vectoring, and impressive low-speed maneuverability, thanks to the addition of canards. Hands-down, the Su-30MKI is superior to all Flankers short of the J-11B in PLAAF service. It is difficult to compare the MKI to the J-11B however, due to their relative advantages in different areas. The Su-30MKI is about 20% heavier, and features an engine with slightly less powerful dry(non-afterburning) thrust, thus giving it a slightly lower thrust-to-weight ratio. Furthermore, the Su-30MKI also has about 8 times the radar-cross section of the J-11B. In terms of radar, the Su-30MKI has a clear advantage, and the MKI still retains a slight advantage in avionics despite major improvements to China's indigenous avionics industry. The MKI is also more maneuverable at subsonic speeds, though the J-11B has a superior climb-rate and better acceleration.

Mig-29 (62)- The Mig-29 is a very capable fighter, and is a smaller complement to the Su-30MKI much like the J-10 is to the J-11. India has accumulated a variety of Mig-29 variants with a even larger variety of radars/avionics over the years, but they are all slated for upgrades and standardization in 2008. Both the Mig-29 and J-10 are claimed to be superior to the F-16 in terms of performance and maneuverability. It is possible for the Mig-29s to receive PESA radar, either with the currently ongoing upgrades or with a future upgrades package.

Mirage-2000 (51)- The Mirage is a multi-role French fighter that excels at both the A2A and A2G roles. However, the Mirages are incompatible with the Russian missiles that the IAF uses. Currently, India is undergoing negotiations with France to upgrade the Mirages with more modern weapons. The Mirage is an older and somewhat less capable design when compared to the Flanker, Fulcrum, and J-10.

(Third Gen fighters)

PLAAF (800)

J-8II (300)- The J-8 is an indigenous Chinese high-speed interceptor. The current variant, the J-8F uses Chinese radar with the ability to fire the latest Chinese BVR missiles and features a more powerful and efficient engine over earlier designs. Older J-8s are being upgraded to J-8H standard, which also features an advanced Chinese radar but retains the older engine type.

J-7- The J-7 is a Chinese fighter based on the Russian Mig-21 design. Current J-7s in Chinese service feature a double-delta wing design and a Chinese-designed engine, offering it much enhanced maneuverability and performance. Although BVR capable version exists for export, the PLAAF has instead decided to pursue upgrades in its WVR capabilities. Its radar is designed to work in tandem with a HMS, allowing it to fire a variety of the latest off-bore sight WVR missiles at multiple targets.

JH-7- The JH-7 is an indigenous fighter-bomber developed in China that is optimized for A2G precision strike. A naval version also exists, serving the PLANAF. In the air-to-air role, the JH-7 lacks BVR capability.

IAF (256)

Jaguar (131)- The Jaguar is an European fighter-bomber that is utilized primary for the deep-strike role by the IAF. Like the JH-7, Jaguars possess advanced A2G capabilities but lacks BVR capability for A2A combat. The Jaguar carries a lesser payload and has a lower top speed when compared to the JH-7.

Mig-21 BISON (125)- The Bison is an advanced Mig-21 variant, and the only one with BVR capability. It also has a significantly improved engine for better performance. However, its BVR range is limited and the one's in IAF service have been very prone to mishaps and accidents, hence earning the nickname "flying coffin."

(Second Gen Fighters)

PLAAF (0)

IAF (175)

Mig-21 (175)- The IAF still operates a number of older Mig-21 designs. These aging fighters are slated to be phased out of IAF service by 2011. They possess aging airframes, and lack both BVR capability or enhanced WVR capability.

Clearly the IAF is at an disadvantage in terms of number (1191 vs 593).

In terms of quality, it depends on the particular aircraft and capability. For example, the Su-30MKI is the most advanced aircraft out of the two air forces, yet the Mig-21bis is also the least advanced. Furthermore, Indian and Chinese aircraft possess dissimilar advantages and disadvantages, making it difficult to do direct comparisons such as J-11B vs Su-30MKI and J-10 vs Mig-29. This is also seen in the radars of the two air forces, with the IAF possessing PESA radar on the MKI and possibly the Mig-29 in the future, while the PLAAF uses inferior mechanical array radars. On the other hand, the PLAAF has been able to develop mechanical array radars superior to the generation of Russian and Western radars found on the majority of IAF fighters.

In term of missile, the R-77/R-73 BVR/WVR combo is seen in both air forces. Both nations also use the Russian R-27 BVR missile. However, in recent years the PLA has also added the SD-10 BVR missile and PL-9 WVR missile on some of its newer aircraft.

Next is pilot training, according to external sources, only recently has PLAAF training begin to improve. Prior to the induction of Flankers, the average PLAAF pilot only flew for about 80-100 hours a year, as compared to the 210 hour average of the USAF. In recent years, the PLAAF has stepped up its training, requiring 180 hours for frontline fighter pilots and 120 hours for J-8 and J-7 pilots.

Pilot training the IAF varies widely by unit, though it is upwards of 200 hours for elite Su-30MKI squadrons.

Futhermore, beyond actual fighters, the IAF & PLAAF both have AWACs capability Indian AWAC's can carry out surveillance at about 400-km range under all-weather situation and to lock on to 60 targets simultaneously has a 360-degree phased array radar mounted on to the heavylift IL-76 transport aircraft airframe and would provide the much-required battlespace situational awareness for the IAF for its tactical and strategic operations. PLAAF operates 4 KJ-2000 platforms and numerous smaller Y-8 platforms. The Chinese platforms all all indigenous, demonstrating that the Chinese are capable of designing and producing advanced AESA radars.

On a interesting note, China has got no air force wings or bases near India, for most of its airbases are either located near the Taiwan Strait, near Beijing, or in the Northeastern area of the country

You forgot the 100 odd Mig 27's. You could probably classify it as a 4th gen aircraft since its been upgraded or a 3.5 gen.
 
Ok here i'll give a fair comparison

Fighters
The two forces are fairly even matched after the IAF (India air force) brought Sukhoi Su-30MKI which is suppose to be better than the Chinese Sukhoi Su-30MKK. However the latest report from China is that the indigenous built J-11 surpasses the Sukhoi Su-30MKK and maybe (not sure) the Sukhoi Su-30MKI. So we have to look at the numbers: (numbers below are debatable)
Could you provide a source for that please?

J11B might improved and even reduced the RCS (but 3m² is doubtful), but in maneuverability, radar and EWS the MKI should still be clearly better, thanks to canards, TVC, Bars PESA and Israeli EWS. And this advantage will be bigger if the new Bars AESA and the new S117 engine will arrive. So in quality on the top side IAF is better, but the problem is on the lower side!
Our Mig 29 and Mirage 2000 will be upggraded, but could be inferior in numbers and quality to J10. Jaguars and Mig 27 are only ground attack fighters with limited a2a capabilities, so can't be taken to account. That's why LCA MK2 and MMRCA are so important, because these will increase numbers and quality of IAF on the lower side.
Even if we can't counter the numbers of PLAAF, we must be at least on par in quality, so fast induction of LCA MK2 and MMRCA should be a priority for IAF.
 
K^se- I think your a really rude dude. lol although i dont agree with the Gandhian guy who always goes Sir this Sir that i must agree that you like any American and Brit are a little racist when it comes to language. You guys find it perfectly okay when most of Europe doesn't speak English and French, German people shun it. Even high level diplomats and heads of state reply in their own language(while our Prime ministers speak in English) in UN meetings. But thats all hunky dory because they are Europeans. But answer this oh yankee. Do you speak hindi? Tamil?Punjabi? or any other language? i dont think so. We Asians master the language as an art. In your nations every tramp speaks in English. So kindly keep your right wing American supremacist views to yourself. We aren't all snake charmers. And puhleeze a handful of American planes cant necessarily take out a whole air force. Such confidence in a ''Paper dollar'' economy is really hilarious. And give me a ******* break here. You got your independence hundreds of years ago. You didnt get your *** plundered by a bunch of poms.
 
Wat about training quality?
Few days back there was a report saying tht 45&#37; indian crashes were due to pilot error?
 
Guys yesterday my main ID got banned ( Possibly serving a detention in Askaban admist Dementos ) for cracking a chinese detective joke. If someone got offended i really feel sorry.

Ok here i'll give a fair comparison

Fighters
The two forces are fairly even matched after the IAF (India air force) brought Sukhoi Su-30MKI which is suppose to be better than the Chinese Sukhoi Su-30MKK. However the latest report from China is that the indigenous built J-11 surpasses the Sukhoi Su-30MKK and maybe (not sure) the Sukhoi Su-30MKI. So we have to look at the numbers: (numbers below are debatable)

(Forth-fifth Gen fighters)

PLAAF (391)

Su-27 (76)- In addition to license producing J-11s, China has purchased a number of fully-built Su-27s from Russia. By 2008, most of these aircraft has been upgraded to J-11A standard in terms of radar, avionics, and weapons.

Su-30MKK (100)- In terms of air-to-air capability, the Su-30 are probably the weakest of the Flankers flying Chinese colors. The Su-30 was primarily ordered for its advanced ground attack capabilities. The far more advanced Su-30MKK2, with both enhanced A2A as well as anti-shipping capabilities, is in service with the Chinese navy.

J-11 (95)- The first J-11s were license-produced copies of Russian Su-27SKs/UBKs that were imported from Russia. The first Chinese improvement to the basic J-11 was the J-11A, which featured an improved Russian radar, a Chinese Helmet-mounted-sight system, and some digitized, LCD displays. A new indigenous variant, classified the J-11B appeared in 2006. This variant featured an improved Chinese-designed radar, full air-to-ground and anti-shipping capability, improved missile-warning systems, much improved avionics, solid-state electronics, and a full-glass cockpit. A mixture of J-11A and J-11B avionic/radar upgrades have been since applied to nearly all J-11s and Su-27s in Chinese service. Other significant improvements to the Su-27 involves a more reliable Chinese-designed engine with a modest performance improvement over the Russian AL-31, use of composites which make up 70% of the weight of the aircraft, and minor redesigns that cumulate in a weight reduction of about 10% and radar-signature reduction of 88%.

J-10 (120)- The J-10 is China's only indigenous 4th-generation fighter. It is a much smaller fighter than the Flanker, and thus has less range, payload, and a less-powerful radar. However, it enjoys much greater maneuverability and reduced radar-cross section (of less than 1m squared, vs 3m squared of J-11B and 25m squared of baseline Flankers). The J-10 is also easier and cheaper to produce. Currently, the Chinese are working on a AESA radar for the J-10.

J10 150+
J11A 100+
J11B 50+
Su30 100
su27 76
 
i don't want to spend hours talking air combact tatics here with you. so i will cut it short.
1) 50&#37; fuel can last for almost 2 hour depending on which ACs you are talking about. and that would be more then enough for the defender. and if you go back to my previous post, you will know how important it is to reduce the weight.

2) 50km fire one, and then 30-40km fire two before turn into evadation. after the evadation, fire three (if you got the chances, one left) before switching to WRM (2) and then dog fight.

Reduce the fuel for payload or vice versa, either way, these aircraft are hampered.

How long do they have to fly to find the enemy? Do you think they know that they are there? or here or anywhere? You have to have patrols. Even with radar what do they have for besides one shot at maximum distance? do they fly around waiting to see if the openent has been shot down or has evaded? endurance is very important to a fighter, they need fuel for air combat which burns the majority of they're fuel. A staggering amount is burnt on take off alone expecially with older engines. Its not debatable. Either way, the PLAAF gets A LOT less out of they're aircraft at these altitudes.

which idot would install their radar station amoung canyons rather then open space? and even if they are blocked, what about AWACS. and even without AWACS, can that be define "Tibet is free space" as you mentioned before?

Theres a difference between a 2d search radar or early warning that which is light and can be lifted to higher ground and a TOWED 3D tracking radar which is used for S300 and other SAM defense systems a like is heavier and portable, they can not climb a mountain and it would not be wise to have them sit on a mountain like a duck.

Even with AWACS or not the PLAAF has only a handfull bases. How are they going to support or escort they're awacs? PLANES do need to come down and with the major airbases in CHengdu they're too far from the Indian border. Tibetan border is free to fly over, theres not enough air defense that i've seen. What the PLA has there are artillery pieces for close support.

how many they deploied, it doesn't matter, and nobody knows. but if thousands of BMs is affordable, i don't see the reason why CMs are not affordable.

The PLA DOES NOT HAVE SOOOOOOOOOO MANY CRUISE MISSILES. they have ballistic missiles and they have trained to use them. They have only had cruise missiles since? 1997? Those ballistic missiles are also proven. I shouldn't have to argue about this point. The PLA relies on ballistic missiles, more expensive they are but they get the job done.

all right, as you wish, no more 3 million things. but what about the 5 to 1? i won't bother to findout how many airports do india has, but i know there are about 12-15 active airport within Tibet. so are you suggesting there 60-70 airport on the other side? and each of them house only 1 AC on average (if i didn't get it wrong, 6 squadeorn were deploied there)?

And how many of them actually support fighter jets or squadrons? How many wings?
You wont know and you dont know because you didn't look into it.

yes, i heard of air patrols, but an IAF awacs patroling insaide Tibet? forget it!

your awacs's maximum detect range is about 400km, considering they will stay clear from SAM's reach, they will fall back atleast 100km. so they can see no more then 300km into china.

They don't need to see into CHINA!. all they need to do is bomb forward bunkers around the current border. What do you think, they would waste there time on the PLA itself? when the real war is on the border!

yes, i know. so, the point is?they can did it in 70's then china can't do it in 2000?
No you don't. They have been doing it since then. Always testing its ground hugging capability. improving it. And during the strike on the Afganistan they lost a lot of cruise missiles, in the end they resorted to droping iron bombs.

what the hack are you trying to say

Short range quick reaction surface to air missiles like the ones PLA purchased from Russia and the IAFs Spyder system are meant to shoot down things like cruise missiles and even bombs dropped from the air to protect the static assets.

oh, is it? interesting! so you want some donation?

No just trying to prove a point. The Indian military purchased a few and never went back for more. Usually when they find the system to does do what is advertised they buy more. In this case, they figured the S300 is overpriced and the range is reduced because of radar clutter. 200 km radius is what it advertises. In reality that range is a lot shorter because of the horizion and the radar can not track properly until the threat is a lot closer.

can some one pls translate this into english for me, thx.

I can. If you were smart enough you;d know as well. The PLAAF doesn't drop bombs yet. thats why the PLA have such large stock piles of short range ballistic missiles. and a seperate artillery group for them. They launch in practice 3 ballistic missiles at a time! They wouldnt need to if the PLAAF could assure them they can do it for them.

you know what, i begin to question whether you can "understand" english or not. all right, i will make my statement simple. if USAF can not cut off PLA's supply, how can IAF do it?

?? what supply line? Air bases dont have one. Aircraft only need a airflied to takeoff and land, fuel and stockpiles of bombs and missiles. The IAF doesn't need to threaten the PLAAF in its own airbases, they the PLAAF will have they're hands full just trying to keep off the IAf from they're front line troops on the border.

of course they can't, how can you free a "free sky" again? and if you want to bomb the PLA army, go ahead. i just want to see how effective they are compare to USAF did in 1999 or 2003-2010. but i'm sure that PLAAF won't do anything stupid as you suggested.

Those bombers you keep mentioning need air excorts other wise they can be shot down. But i wont bother insead of how effective is the IAF. Why don't you watch Kargil when the IAF bombed the Pakistanis at theyre defense position? They are no USAF but they can still drop bombs and claim the sky around the border for forward helecopter support.

air dominance in Tibet huh, good thinking and keep dreaming.
"forward patrol"? just like sending you AWACS into Tibet. no definately not. no PLAAF fighter,bomber or other plane pilot would do risk their life for nothing.

uh huh. Do you think holes in tibet don't exist? You obviously dont know how big and unattended the IndoTibetan border is!

ANd to some it up for you. If the PLA was so sure they can bring the fight to India, why dont they take what they cliam to be Chinese terriortory? After all the Indian military can't handle the PLAAFs super cruise missile bombers. So why didn't the take what they captured during 1962? and why support Pakistan to the point they(Pakistan) recieve discount weapons?
 
I think the pilot training aspect is an interesting issue. I know a lot of time has passed, however during the Korean war, the Chinese pilots were able to match up with USAF pilots fairly well. They had some ACE pilots during the Korean war which indicates that Chinese pilots were as advanced in their tactics as their contemporaries and the present/future indicates that things may not be too different, even though the hours flown were limited compared to West.

PLAAF writings indicate that it has an impressive history defending China. The PLAAF established its credibility during the Korean War, the 1958 Taiwan Strait Crisis, and the Vietnam War, but it has not conducted any large-scale air battles since then. The official PLAAF history states that it has shot down 1,474 and damaged 2,344 aircraft of all types. Analysis of these figures shows that PLAAF aircraft have shot down or damaged only about 200 aircraft during air-to-air combat, most of which occurred during the Korean War.

Although this is a tale by gone, but the numbers shot down by the PLAAF in the Korean war is greater than what the IAF/PAF have been able to do together. So there is evidence that PLAAF were able to do quite well in air combat given they have comparatively similar hardware. Back then it was Mig-15/17 vs. F-86 Sabre and now its Su-30MKK/J-10s etc. vs. Su-30MKIs/Mirage 2000s. I would think this is a pretty even matchup.
 
A peace time display can to some effect portray the preparedness and the overall status of a fighting force, in recent times, the IAF for example doesn't risk flying single engine aircraft over it's republic day venues and usually resorts to the twin engined SU-30s, MIG-29s and Jaguars. The PLAAF, on other hand put up all it's inventory during the last republic day fly past .

 
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A peace time display can to some effect portray the preparedness and the overall status of a fighting force, in recent times, the IAF for example doesn't risk flying single engine aircraft over it's republic day venues and usually resorts to the twin engined SU-30s, MIG-29s and Jaguars. The PLAAF, on other hand put up all it's inventory during the last republic day fly past .

YouTube - 05 The Chinese Air Force [China's National Day, Chinese Military Parade 2009]

hmm that was quite a surprising judgment you have ...going by this LCA will never see the republic day sky over Delhi...okay now you can mock over LCA will never be inducted :D
 

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