How would subcontinent look like if there was only Islam and Urdu?

[Nityam]

They seems to have written a lot about it happening in Pakistan, Afghanistan and India but not in Bangladesh. One ow two cases may happen in a decade but surely nothing like India or Pakistan. Otherwise much more would be written about it. Which basically invalidates this.

Then go complain to the UN.

I would rather trust the UN, than some punk on a pakistani forum.

 

[Mustang06]

Probably another Muslim country made to chose between Saudi or Iran. Worse case another Syria!

 

[Nityam]

The list shows plenty of Indian Muslim mansabs. Not only that, but it makes the strange distinction between Indians and Rajputs, when both should be considered part of the same category.

Also, the foreigners didn't just disappear. Their descendants are the Muslims of Pakistan and north-west India.

Their dependents probably died in battle. Of those who survived , the would constitute 0.00000001% of the population.

The list shows the COLONIAL nature of the Mughal empire.

Anyway enjoy our mullah fantasy...don't quote me here again @Nityam

You offer nothing of value to quote you.

 

[PakSarzameen5823]

We set this up essentially.

No you didn't.

When Homayun lost to Sher Shah, we had to raise an army to put him back on the throne

He also had help from Afghanistan and Pakistan. Also, it was really Akbar (who came from Umerkot, which is in Pakistan) who made the Mughal Empire.

The Taj was designed by Ostaad Esa Khan shirazi

It's main architect was Ustad Ahmed Lahori, the name should give you a hint about where he came from.

as were most of the other monuments.

I doubt it.

. Without Iran there would've been sweet fukk all!

I doubt it.

Throughout the moghal era we sent our intellectuals to their courts. The Moghals spoke Persian!

That is true.

I fail to see a single contribution of Iran, other than death and colonization. Can you point out to a SINGLE contribution of this "persian intellectuals" ?

Can you please open a history book?

 

[Nityam]

Can you please open a history book?

Ok.

Which History book and which page number ?

 

[PakSarzameen5823]

Their dependents probably died in battle. Of those who survived , the would constitute 0.00000001% of the population.

No. Just about every Muslim from Pakistan and north-west India who doesn't live in a village will (some way or another) be related to people who worked for the Mughal Empire. Even Hindus belonging to tribes like the Rajputs will be related to them (since the Mughals got busy with a lot of Rajput princesses).

Ok.

Which History book and which page number ?

Any one that talks about the history of Iran.

This website isn't a bad source either:

http://www.iranicaonline.org/

 

[Nityam]

No. Just about every Muslim from Pakistan and north-west India who doesn't live in a village will (some way or another) be related to people who worked for the Mughal Empire. Even Hindus belonging to tribes like the Rajputs will be related to them (since the Mughals got busy with a lot of Rajput princesses).

lol..... That is Fantasy to cover up your own humiliation.

Reality is that the Maratha's had wiped out the Mughals before the East India company took over the Maratha empire.

This website isn't a bad source either:

http://www.iranicaonline.org/

I am not interested in the history of Iran.

Provide me ONE SINGLE proof of any contribution of ANY Persian Intellectual to India.

That was the claim, right ?

 

[Tokhme khar]

I disagree on your points. The moghal empire was started by Timur lang. Not Akbar.

Ostad Esa Shirazi is widely credited with designing both the Taj and the Red Fort.

Sher Shah Suri was from Afghanistan.......an enemy of both Iran and the Moghals. Homayun ran away to Isfahan after he was defeated. We had to raise an army in Iran to put him back on the throne in Delhi.

Doesn't seem like you know much of your history.

No you didn't.



He also had help from Afghanistan and Pakistan. Also, it was really Akbar (who came from Umerkot, which is in Pakistan) who made the Mughal Empire.



It's main architect was Ustad Ahmed Lahori, the name should give you a hint about where he came from.



I doubt it.



I doubt it.



That is true.



Can you please open a history book?

 

[PakSarzameen5823]

lol..... That is Fantasy to cover up your own humiliation.

No it's not. The bulk of the workforce of these Muslim empires came from what is now Pakistan and north-west India, and even those that didn't still assimilated into our population.

https://www.harappadna.org/2012/05/harappaworld-admixture/

This is the Harappa admixture sheet. You will find that Muslims from Pakistan and north-west India have higher amounts of SW Asian (i.e Arab) ancestry than their non-Muslim counterparts from the same ethnic group. The only exceptions are a few of the Sikh populations, which would be expected since many Muslims did convert to Sikhism (since Islam was already pretty firmly established in the Punjab at that time).

I'll give you some examples:

Kashmiri Paharis (overwhelmingly Muslim): 2% SW Asian admixture
Kashmiri Pandits (overwhelmingly not Muslim): 0% SW Asian admixture

Punjabi Arains (overwhelmingly Muslim): 2% SW Asian admixture
Punjabi Muslim Jatts: 2% SW Asian admixture
Punjabi Brahmins: 0% SW Asian admixture

Gujarati Muslims: 4% SW Asian admixture
Gujarati Patels (overwhelmingly not Muslim): 0% SW Asian admixture

Here is a Punjabi Muslim Gujjar's ancestry results, he obtained 3% SW Asian admixture:

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?12411-Pakistani-Gujjar-Results-Harappa

Here are some studies on Muslim Gujjars from north-western India, they are shown to be genetically and physically distinct from their non-Muslim counterparts:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3163234

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3812661

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14524001

 

[Nityam]

I disagree on your points. The moghal empire was started by Timur lang. Not Akbar.

Ostad Esa Shirazi is widely credited with designing both the Taj and the Red Fort.

Sher Shah Suri was from Afghanistan.......an enemy of both Iran and the Moghals. Homayun ran away to Isfahan after he was defeated. We had to raise an army in Iran to put him back on the throne in Delhi.

Doesn't seem like you know much of your history.

"widely credited" ?

By whom ? Self appointed historians who substituted fantasy for Proof ?

 

[PakSarzameen5823]

The moghal empire was started by Timur lang. Not Akbar.

No, Tamerlane was his ancestor, but he founded a completely separate empire (the Timurid Empire).

Babur was technically the founder of the Mughal Empire, but Akbar was the one who made it into what most people think of when they hear the word 'Mughal'.

Sher Shah Suri was from Afghanistan.

He was a Pashtun. Back then, the word Afghan was used for anyone who was a Pashtun. Sher Shah Suri himself was actually born and raised in the Punjab.

Reality is that the Maratha's had wiped out the Mughals before the East India company took over the Maratha empire.

And then the Mysoreans and Pashtuns smacked them around like a chew-toy.

I am not interested in the history of Iran.

Then why the heck are you making claims about it?

 

[Nityam]

No it's not. The bulk of the workforce of these Muslim empires came from what is now Pakistan and north-west India, and even those that didn't still assimilated into our population.

https://www.harappadna.org/2012/05/harappaworld-admixture/

This is the Harappa admixture sheet. You will find that Muslims from Pakistan and north-west India have higher amounts of SW Asian (i.e Arab) ancestry than their non-Muslim counterparts from the same ethnic group. The only exceptions are a few of the Sikh populations, which would be expected since many Muslims did convert to Sikhism (since Islam was already pretty firmly established in the Punjab at that time).

I'll give you some examples:

Kashmiri Paharis (overwhelmingly Muslim): 2% SW Asian admixture
Kashmiri Pandits (overwhelmingly not Muslim): 0% SW Asian admixture

Punjabi Arains (overwhelmingly Muslim): 2% SW Asian admixture
Punjabi Muslim Jatts: 2% SW Asian admixture
Punjabi Brahmins: 0% SW Asian admixture

Gujarati Muslims: 4% SW Asian admixture
Gujarati Patels (overwhelmingly not Muslim): 0% SW Asian admixture

Here is a Punjabi Muslim Gujjar's ancestry results, he obtained 3% SW Asian admixture:

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?12411-Pakistani-Gujjar-Results-Harappa

Here are some studies on Muslim Gujjars from north-western India, they are shown to be genetically and physically distinct from their non-Muslim counterparts:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3163234

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3812661

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14524001

From the first link the data does not load.

From the subsequent link about Gujjars, they seem to have infusion due to islamic invaders.

That make them the VICTIMS of the Invasion, not the Invaders.

 

[Tokhme khar]

Mate no offense, but you boyz as a nation have nothing to show for in history. As bad as you think Persians are/ were.......at least we have a legacy. Can you name anything you did in those 800 years when you were colonized?

"widely credited" ?

By whom ? Self appointed historians who substituted fantasy for Proof ?

 

[PakSarzameen5823]

From the first link the data does not load.

Read the first paragraph, it gives a link to the data. If you want it so bad you can Google Harappa admixture table and it should come up as a Google document file (I'd upload it myself but it keeps glitching).

That make them the VICTIMS of the Invasion, not the Invaders.

Are you stupid or something? If Muslims from Pakistan and north-west India have ancestry from the invaders, then yes, we WERE the invaders. You were the victims since you're not related to them.

 

[Nityam]

And then the Mysoreans and Pashtuns smacked them around like a chew-toy.

Nope, its the other way around. After panipath, Maratha' consolidated their power over Mysore and Delhi.

Then why the heck are you making claims about it?

I am questioning claims about Persian intellectual contribution to INDIA. Is that so hard to understand ?