How Vietnamese still suffer thanks to America. Documentary

[terranMarine]

There is one thing you don't understand, it was not about win or lose, it was not about communism or capitalism. "There is nothing greater than INDEPENDENCE and FREEDOM". I am totally fine with NVN losing the war and being unified with the South, and the SVN would shake off US collars (which they already tried unsuccessfully a few times).

However, history is history. US came, then Soviet and China came. VCP blamed the US, but we VNese blamed all three. We are normal citizens, we don't care about politic, we don't care about diplomacy. We don't care whatever reason Soviet and China had to come along with US to make VN become a new battlefield of ideologies. All we know that because US, Soviet and China were there, the situation got hotter than it should, and our blood was shed for it.

Ingrates, for all i care you can blame Russia and China. The US declared you guys war first, just don't claim it was China that started the VN War as that senile grampy

 

[xesy]

Ingrates, for all i care you can blame Russia and China. The US declared you guys war first, just don't claim it was China that started the VN War as that senile grampy

I don't. But you don't shrug off China's part in VN war either.

 

[terranMarine]

I don't. But you don't shrug off China's part in VN war either.

China's part was to help you weaklings, now you guys are saying we started it

 

[xesy]

China's part was to help you weaklings, now you guys are saying we started it

Parts of the reason. I don't agree with other blaming only China or only Soviet or only US, and I don't intend to blame them all. All 3 countries were still not the whole reason VN war broke out.

 

[gambit]

Unfortunately your common sense is rather lacking due to the aging brain of yours. Who knows it could have been affected by the agent orange stuff when it was in the development stage. Therefor i must insist papers and academic materials supporting your so called worthy opinion on the matter. It would be a shame if the rest of the world are taught a different version of history if your common sense should be the one holding the mandate of truth.

Then you should have no problems providing academic papers explaining why it was necessary for China to get involved in Viet Nam, no ? After all, you guys have been spouting the lie that China helped 'liberated' Viet Nam. Let us see some academic papers.

 

[yue10]

Far more an expert about the subject than you kids.

what a joke is this guy, i remembered in one thread i am copy pasted quotes about chinese saviour and protector of vietnam and then 5 minute after i am posting he make his own summary just copy those quotes

Then you should have no problems providing academic papers explaining why it was necessary for China to get involved in Viet Nam, no ? After all, you guys have been spouting the lie that China helped 'liberated' Viet Nam. Let us see some academic papers.

it can easily be found but the authors is chinese but you can read this instead and CRYING!

1. A free, open-minded, and absolutely impartial adjustment of all colonial claims, based upon a strict observance of the principle that in determining all such questions ofsovereignty the interests of the populations concerned must have equal weight with the equitable claims of the government whose title is to be determined.

"National aspirations must be respected; people may now be dominated and governed only by their own consent. Self determination is not a mere phrase; it is an imperative principle of action. . . . "
—Woodrow Wilson with his famous self-determination speech on 11 February 1918[12] after he announced his Fourteen Points on 8 January 1918.
------------------------------------
"I am not asking for money or troops," the young man said, "only that you talk on our behalf." The young man didn't have much time as the meeting was only scheduled to last ten minutes, but to this young man it was an all important meeting. He was addressing President Woodrow Wilson and the future of his country. Although he had attempted and been denied a meeting on three previous tries, the young man stuck with it and finally through the intervention of a colleague he had a meeting with the President of the United States. President Wilson was in France meeting with the leaders of Britain, Italy, and France forging what would become known as the Treaty of Versailles. The young man meeting with the president was seeking for his country what he perceived America to be.....democracy and freedom. His country was under foreign rule and domination and through President Wilson he sought a voice, a voice for the democracy and self-determination of his homeland. He wanted President Wilson to be an intercessory for him to the President of France who was even harder to reach. It was the French who were dominating and oppressing his people. Wilson though would have none of it and even considered the very thought of asking the French to cease and desist as ludicrous.

this will be your life if not for such a guardian angel as chinese
[youtube]

 

[gambit]

what a joke is this guy, i remembered in one thread i am copy pasted quotes about chinese saviour and protector of vietnam and then 5 minute after i am posting he make his own summary just copy those quotes

Utter bullshit.

it can easily be found but the authors is chinese but you can read this instead and CRYING!

1. A free, open-minded, and absolutely impartial adjustment of all colonial claims, based upon a strict observance of the principle that in determining all such questions ofsovereignty the interests of the populations concerned must have equal weight with the equitable claims of the government whose title is to be determined.

"National aspirations must be respected; people may now be dominated and governed only by their own consent. Self determination is not a mere phrase; it is an imperative principle of action. . . . "
—Woodrow Wilson with his famous self-determination speech on 11 February 1918[12] after he announced his Fourteen Points on 8 January 1918.
------------------------------------
"I am not asking for money or troops," the young man said, "only that you talk on our behalf." The young man didn't have much time as the meeting was only scheduled to last ten minutes, but to this young man it was an all important meeting. He was addressing President Woodrow Wilson and the future of his country. Although he had attempted and been denied a meeting on three previous tries, the young man stuck with it and finally through the intervention of a colleague he had a meeting with the President of the United States. President Wilson was in France meeting with the leaders of Britain, Italy, and France forging what would become known as the Treaty of Versailles. The young man meeting with the president was seeking for his country what he perceived America to be.....democracy and freedom. His country was under foreign rule and domination and through President Wilson he sought a voice, a voice for the democracy and self-determination of his homeland. He wanted President Wilson to be an intercessory for him to the President of France who was even harder to reach. It was the French who were dominating and oppressing his people. Wilson though would have none of it and even considered the very thought of asking the French to cease and desist as ludicrous.

this will be your life if not for such a guardian angel as chinese

Speeches are not academic papers. And Wilson is old news.

During WW II, it was the US (Roosevelt), Russia (Stalin), and China (Chiang Kai-shek) who agreed that once the war was over, Indochina would be placed under UN protection towards independence. Roosevelt died and Truman who succeeded him had no reasons to deviate from what was agreed between the three powers. If Mao succeeded Chiang Kai-shek, and he did, what was the reasons for Mao to deviate ?

 

[yue10]

Utter bullshit.


Speeches are not academic papers. And Wilson is old news.

During WW II, it was the US (Roosevelt), Russia (Stalin), and China (Chiang Kai-shek) who agreed that once the war was over, Indochina would be placed under UN protection towards independence. Roosevelt died and Truman who succeeded him had no reasons to deviate from what was agreed between the three powers. If Mao succeeded Chiang Kai-shek, and he did, what was the reasons for Mao to deviate ?

sorry, my copy paste is not the academic papers, they are easy to find already posted by others on defence pk

this is interesting theory i have not heard, truman also ignored pleas from mr ho chi minh for big 4 to step in and stop the french so your post does not seem right, i am need you to source me up my annam friend

 

[gambit]

sorry, my copy paste is not the academic papers, they are easy to find already posted by others on defence pk

this is interesting theory i have not heard, truman also ignored pleas from mr ho chi minh for big 4 to step in and stop the french so your post does not seem right, i am need you to source me up my annam friend

Keywords search for you, kid: 'indochina un trusteeship'. The 'un' stands for 'United Nations'.

You will find all sorts of interpretations on what that plan stood for, but the core of it remains: That the US, Russia, and China agreed that after WW II, Indochina would be free of colonialism. A 'trusteeship' is not a form of colonialism, as some socialists/communists asserted. It meant the three 'Indo-Chinese' countries (Laos, Cambodia, and Viet Nam) would be placed under UN supervision and guidance towards independent governments.

United Nations Trusteeship Council - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Trusteeship Council was formed in 1945 to oversee the decolonization of those dependent territories that were to be placed under the international trusteeship system created by the United Nations Charter as a successor to the League of Nations mandate system. Ultimately, eleven territories were placed under trusteeship: seven in Africa and four in Oceania. Ten of the trust territories had previously been League of Nations mandates; the eleventh was Italian Somaliland.

National resources from countries that are under guardianship belongs to the peoples of those countries. Governmental institutions that never existed before would be created and/or modified from existing ones to contain natives, not foreigners. Multi-parties politics would be engaged, and this is where the communists objected.

The problem with the Chinese members here is one of logic, or rather illogic. You guys thinks that just because a device, be it mechanical or political, was constructed and functions a certain way, under your version of 'logic', it became the only way. So if communism brutally took over a country and unified the people, it means the only way that people could be governed is via communism. It is a self serving and circular 'logic' necessary to preserve a delusion.

As for Ho and the Viet Minh, it was them, not the US, who invited France back to Viet Nam. Now see if you can figure that one out, kid.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

I was born in a hospital. Thus, I am a doctor.

Ridiculous? Yes. Just because you were somewhere when something happened, doesn't make you an expert.