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Housing apartheid flourishes in Delhi

I thought we already had cleared your misunderstanding on the anti-conversion laws issue.

Unless you support conversion through improper ways or prefer to remain Indo-phobic.

What misunderstanding?

Laws brought in to prevent conversions in a "secular" country? That makes total sense doesn't it.

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The roots of Muslim rage run deep in India, nourished by a long-held sense of injustice over what many Indian Muslims believe is institutionalized discrimination against the country's largest minority group. The disparities between Muslims, who make up 13.4% of the population, and India's Hindus, who hover at around 80%, are striking. There are exceptions, of course, but generally speaking, Muslim Indians have shorter life spans, worse health, lower literacy levels and lower-paying jobs. Add to that toxic brew the lingering resentment over 2002's anti-Muslim riots in the state of Gujarat. The riots, instigated by Hindu nationalists, killed some 2,000 people, most of them Muslims. To this day, few of the perpetrators have been convicted.

Read more: India's Muslims in Crisis - TIME
 
What misunderstanding?

Laws brought in to prevent conversions in a "secular" country? That makes total sense doesn't it.

---

The roots of Muslim rage run deep in India, nourished by a long-held sense of injustice over what many Indian Muslims believe is institutionalized discrimination against the country's largest minority group. The disparities between Muslims, who make up 13.4% of the population, and India's Hindus, who hover at around 80%, are striking. There are exceptions, of course, but generally speaking, Muslim Indians have shorter life spans, worse health, lower literacy levels and lower-paying jobs. Add to that toxic brew the lingering resentment over 2002's anti-Muslim riots in the state of Gujarat. The riots, instigated by Hindu nationalists, killed some 2,000 people, most of them Muslims. To this day, few of the perpetrators have been convicted.

Read more: India's Muslims in Crisis - TIME


(Freedom of Religion Act) in 1968, stating that it is a crime to “convert or attempt to
convert, either directly or otherwise, any person from one religious faith to another by the use of
force or by allurement or by any fraudulent means nor shall any person abet any such
conversion.”8 Any person who converts

How does the above law have anything to do remotely whatsoever with secularism? :woot:

So unless you beileve it is rightful and justified to convert or attempt to convert, either directly or otherwise, any person from one religious faith to another by the use of force or by allurement or by any fraudulent means.

One can say the above laws are discriminatory. :lol:
 
The roots of Muslim rage run deep in India, nourished by a long-held sense of injustice over what many Indian Muslims believe is institutionalized discrimination against the country's largest minority group. The disparities between Muslims, who make up 13.4% of the population, and India's Hindus, who hover at around 80%, are striking. There are exceptions, of course, but generally speaking, Muslim Indians have shorter life spans, worse health, lower literacy levels and lower-paying jobs. Add to that toxic brew the lingering resentment over 2002's anti-Muslim riots in the state of Gujarat. The riots, instigated by Hindu nationalists, killed some 2,000 people, most of them Muslims. To this day, few of the perpetrators have been convicted.

Read more: India's Muslims in Crisis - TIME

An article dated Nov 27 ,2008..Pls check the significance of the date wrt to Indian history
From the same article:

The disembodied voice was chilling in its rage. A gunman, holed up in the Oberoi Trident hotel in Mumbai (formerly Bombay), where some 40 people had been taken hostage, told an Indian news channel that the attacks were revenge for the persecution of Muslims in India. "We love this as our country, but when our mothers and sisters were being killed, where was everybody?" he asked via telephone. No answer came. But then he probably wasn't expecting one.

Read more: India's Muslims in Crisis - TIME

Now the whole world knows who were this "WE".
 
We have the exact same situation where sunni - shia landlords do not rent out their properties to other sects. If any one has tried home hunting first thing you are asked is your sect ! Thats unfortunately is the landlords call brokers cannot do a thing as they are only mediating the deal , instead of naming and shaming the companies the hindu should have looked a bit more deeper
 
The comments in the comment section is interesting to read

Heres another example of this in Bangalore:

India’s IT powerhouse is mired in social prejudice

THE SUNDAY STORY The property and real estate sections of free advertisement-only newspapers offer the best insight. Most advertisements titled ‘for vegetarians only’ were from areas such as Jayanagar, Basavangudi and Malleshwaram.

In the last 30 years, his firm has helped thousands of people find properties of their choice. He is one of the biggest names in the highly competitive real estate industry of Bangalore. Fardeen Ahmed (name changed) is equally well known as a philanthropist who has associated himself with several progressive and secular causes. But then, in the summer of 2009, he was rudely reminded that his standing counts for little in a city where landlords hide their prejudice behind a mask of modernity.

Ahmed was renovating his ancestral bungalow in Shivajinagar and wanted to move temporarily to a rented house. He wanted a house in a ‘respectable’ locality that suited his class. But to ‘respectable’ house owners, Ahmed and his family were just meat-eating Muslims. With an army of his own employees and all the financial resources at his command, it took Ahmed several months to find a house on rent that satisfied his sense of status. He is still recovering from his sense of ‘hurt.’

Dalit feminist Ruth Manorama was reminded of her identity less than a year after she was honoured with the Alternative Nobel Prize or Right Livelihood Award. In 2007, Ruth wanted to shift her office from Jayanagar 4th Block to a more spacious building a few metres away.

“It was a large house owned by a seemingly nice, English-speaking, elderly Brahmin couple," she says. But they refused to give her the house on rent. "After the award, I had been featured all over the newspapers and it was well known that I am Dalit and Christian,” she says.

The couple, retired scientists with a son working overseas, explained that they could not rent the house to a non-vegetarian. “I wanted the house for an office. It is not like I wanted to turn it into a Biriyani hotel,” she says, still smarting from the insult.

Dalit poet and Chairman of the Kannada Book Authority Siddalingaiah had a similar experience in upper-caste and class dominated South Bangalore.

“Because of my name, most house owners thought I was a [so-called upper caste] Lingayat. But my dark skin gave them doubts. They felt no shame in asking about my caste and I felt none in telling them that I am Dalit,” he says. The negotiations would quickly end after the house owners discovered his caste.

“For many house owners, we are dog-eaters, prostitutes or drug addicts,” says an office-bearer of the Naga Students’ Union who did not wish to be quoted.

During the ‘Justice for Richard Loitam’ campaign in April, hundreds of students from the North-East took to the streets alleging that Richard was the victim of a hate crime. Several agitators had told The Hindu that they are treated as foreigners in Bangalore. Most complained they could not find a house on rent.

Bangalore’s real-estate industry has several prominent Muslim names. All of them denied the existence of an apartheid-like system when The Hindu spoke to them. None wished to be quoted on the controversial subject.

Seven Raj, the proprietor of the well known Sevenraj Estate Agency, says, “These things are very much there. But as far as possible, I don’t do business with communal-minded people.”

“I don’t have a religion and I don’t ask my clients theirs,” he says.

According to him, the most guarded areas in the city are also those endowed with the best infrastructure. House owners in Jayanagar, Basavangudi, Malleshwaram, Sadashivnagar, Indiranagar, Rajajinagar, Upper Palace Orchards, Koramangala and J.P. Nagar hold some of the worst prejudices, says Seven Raj.

“In these localities, neighbours gang up against an owner who dares to rent his house out to somebody from a lower caste or a minority community,” says M. Paari, a former Bruhat Bangalore Mahanagara Palike Corporator.

Paari feels that much of the blame for segregation should go to agencies such as the Bangalore Development Authority. “A caste-wise survey of some of the residential layouts formed by the BDA will show that all the prime plots have gone to upper-caste applicants. Dalits and Muslims get allotments only in EWS (Economically Weaker Section) colonies,” he says.

Paari’s claims of segregation are borne out by a study conducted by the NGO Jana Sahayog in 2004-05 titled ‘Anthropological Study of Slums in Bangalore.’ Isaac Arul Selva says, “Eighty-five per cent of Kannada-speaking slum residents were from the so-called untouchable communities. Sixty-five per cent of non-Kannada speaking residents were from communities considered untouchable.”

The property and real estate sections of free advertisement-only newspapers offer the best insight. Most advertisements titled ‘for vegetarians only’ were from areas such as Jayanagar, Basavangudi and Malleshwaram.

The true meaning of ‘vegetarian only’ emerged when this reporter contacted some of these owners. “This is a Brahmin layout. We do not want any SC/STs,” said a woman before slamming the phone. “No Kashmiri Muslims. Other Muslims are ok,” said one owner from HRBR Layout. Another owner from HSR Layout said, “We don’t mind Muslims but we want only clean Muslims.”

Lawyer Byatha N. Jagdeesha says, “Vegetarian only is just the code to say Brahmins only. If they put out what they actually mean, they can be booked under the Indian Penal Code and the SC/ST (Prevention of Atrocities) Act.”

The Hindu : News / National : India

We have the exact same situation where sunni - shia landlords do not rent out their properties to other sects. If any one has tried home hunting first thing you are asked is your sect ! Thats unfortunately is the landlords call brokers cannot do a thing as they are only mediating the deal , instead of naming and shaming the companies the hindu should have looked a bit more deeper

We already know Pakistan has these issues, point is we're not the ones claiming that we live in some kind of utopia without any discrimination.
 
^^ The Hindu is communalising a diet based discrimination. It seems they are trying to be secular than the secularists. Most of the land lords tell their tenants to keep their apartments clean and their voice /music down. Some also wants their tenants to keep non-veg out of their house. Whats so wrong with it?..I think the problem can be easily solved if the Muslim/non-Vegetarians give in writing that they will not cook non-veg inside their apartments.
 
let me tell you about my story.
My sister had gotten admission in BHU (banaras hindu uni) in 2000 for bachelors. She was alloted hostel room jointly with a brahmin UP girl. Their parents created ruckus and made the warden change her room. But the girl didn't like it and made friends with my sister. After one year they were inseparable and in second year they both became roommates once again. Until this day, they both are married in Varanasi and share flats in same building with their hubbies.
I, myself when came to Mumbai in 2006, was made to share room with telegu brahmin person, but no such thing arose and we became very good friends during collage. And now i live in Mumbai with my friends on sharing basis and didn't face difficulty in finding flat. Same is the case with my brother, who lives in Kolkata.
I know, there are problems in Indian society but you have got to believe in modern youth who are genuinely not interested in knowing your religion. I have strong hope for this generation.

There is still problem for american blacks to get flats in all white neighbourhoods. Hell muslims live in ghetto in america and canada too.Nobody asks America to prove their secular credentials.
Change is on the way. Its a process and hopefully it will come in near future.
 
guys.. dont feed trolls.. many indian vegetarians have problem with noveg eating people. jains dont give flats to even marathi brahmins because of diet. Even i wouldnt rent to non veg person. so whats wrong.. If the person decided not to cook and eat non-veg or garlic in the house i am ok.. does anyone have any issue?
 
Shabana Azmi could not buy apartment in Mumbai

....Toh ab tak voh jhopperpatti mein rahathe hai kya.
 
guys.. dont feed trolls.. many indian vegetarians have problem with noveg eating people. jains dont give flats to even marathi brahmins because of diet. Even i wouldnt rent to non veg person. so whats wrong.. If the person decided not to cook and eat non-veg or garlic in the house i am ok.. does anyone have any issue?
Every society has strange customs. As an outsider, I dont understand this vegetarian/non-vegetarian issue. Can you help us explain this? THanks :) :)
 
People rejecting prospective home seekers on the bases of dietary preferences,that's messed up :frown:
 
This article contains only half.. and highlighted only the negative aspects... It also showed the positive aspects that the situation is better in many other parts of the nation...
Dietary practises are the main reason...
 
So its that almost all landowners are vegetarians in Delhi & Banglore
 
An article dated Nov 27 ,2008..Pls check the significance of the date wrt to Indian history
From the same article:



Now the whole world knows who were this "WE".

LOL the dum lankan needed this pawnage.

Of course, having anti-conversion laws that target Christians is not discrimination is it?

No it's not. And as far as I know only few states have Anti-conversion laws.

Anti-conversion laws are designed to counter illegal conversions or market conversions - conversions that happen by paying money or by coercion (for example giving medical care only if the patient converts to xtianty) and such acts.

If a person wants to convert for genuine spiritual reasons he can give a week's notice to the district magistrate and convert lawfully.

Ofcourse people like the lankans in whose country you have to convert to Buddhism to move forward in your life must not talk **** about others. So either talk when you know the full facts or just stfu !
 
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