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M. Sarmad said:
Saqifah to Fadak
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saqifah isnt mistreatment. the guy who was chosen to lead muslims in prayers, by the Prophet SAW himself, as Imam, was chosen to lead it politically as well.

nor is fadak, the saying of the Prophet SAW cited by Caliph Abu Bakr RA is also mentioned in shia hadith books, lol. it was just ijtehad.

again, all from ahadith.

but you can keep on crying.
 
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Areesh said:
Same Imam Shafi has a fatwa for people who abuse or criticize companions of the Prophet (SAW)

All your issues are historic in nature and not theological. I don't agree with your conclusion based on those historical events and it is because of your conclusion I call you a Rafzi. You can take it as name calling but it is what it is

If Prophet (SAW) asked us not to abuse Sahaba then we won't do it no matter what. You can call me names for it but it is exactly the position of AhleSunnah
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Abusing the Sahaba is an abhorrent act, universally condemned, and no rational individual would endorse such behavior. Mirza says (a sentiment I share) that abusing the Sahaba is an inexcusable offense. And those who, for five decades, openly disparaged Ali and the prophet's progeny from mosque pulpits should not be revered either!! the inconsistencies we were talking about.

Regarding criticism, history is not sacred, and engaging in a critical analysis is not a sin.
 
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M. Sarmad said:
Abusing the Sahaba is an abhorrent act, universally condemned, and no rational individual would endorse such behavior. Mirza says (a sentiment I share) that abusing the Sahaba is an inexcusable offense. And those who, for five decades, openly disparaged Ali and the prophet's progeny from mosque pulpits should not be revered either!! the inconsistencies we were talking about.

Regarding criticism, history is not sacred, and engaging in a critical analysis is not a sin.
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I don't care what Mirza says. I am just sharing the aqeeda of Ahle Sunnah

Also we believe that Muavia (RZ) used to curse murderers of Uthman (RZ) and if there are narrations that say Muaviah (RZ) used abused Ali (RZ) are weak and have rawafiz among their narrators

We don't need to do critical analysis on issues that are not related to our akihrah. This is the belief of all Sunnis in case you call me Wahabi again :)

M. Sarmad said:
For starters:

,.......

sunnah.com

Sahih Muslim 2404d - The Book of the Merits of the Companions - كتاب فضائل الصحابة رضى الله تعالى عنهم - Sunnah.com - Sayings and Teachings of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه و سلم)

Hadith of the Prophet Muhammad (saws) in English and Arabic
sunnah.com sunnah.com
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The narration that you quoted from Sahih Muslim is mistranslated as per Ulema of AhleSunnah. The correct translation here is "criticize" and not "abuse"

I would try to find more on this narration and get back to you
 
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Areesh said:
The narration that you quoted from Sahih Muslim is mistranslated as per Ulema of AhleSunnah. The correct translation here is "criticize" and not "abuse"

I would try to find more on this narration and get back to you
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No, there's no mistranslation involved. In fact 5924 in Sahih Muslim clearly elaborates that "sab-o-shitam" refers to abusing/cursing and not criticism.

Unless of course you are trying to imply that there are weak Ahadith in Sahih Muslim, you don't have an argument here

And there are several Sahi Hadith graded so by Albani in other Hadith collections confirming that Muaviyah used to curse Ali from pulpits of mosques and had ordered his governors to do the same

Then there are multiple historical accounts, both Islamic and orientalist, confirming the same.
 
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M. Sarmad said:
No, there's no mistranslation involved. In fact 5924 in Sahih Muslim clearly elaborates that "sab-o-shitam" refers to abusing/cursing and not criticism.

Unless of course you are trying to imply that there are weak Ahadith in Sahih Muslim, you don't have an argument here
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Have patience buddy. I had a very detailed reply right from Sahih Muslim itself about this narration. Trying to find that document and then I would get back to you

And nope I am not saying it is a weak narration so don't put words in my mouth

;
And there are several Sahi Hadith graded so by Albani in other Hadith collections confirming that Muaviyah used to curse Ali from pulpits of mosques and had ordered his governors to do the same
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We would get to those narrations later
 
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Areesh said:
Have patience buddy. I had a very detailed reply right from Sahih Muslim itself about this narration. Trying to find that document and then I would get back to you

And nope I am not saying it is a weak narration so don't put words in my mouth

;

We would get to those narrations later
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Take your time, my friend. I'll await your response, and I hope it won't be the typical copy-paste of tons of irrelevant content from substandard blogs. Feel free to share the link directly.
 
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M. Sarmad said:
Take your time, my friend. I'll await your response, and I hope it won't be the typical copy-paste of tons of irrelevant content from substandard blogs. Feel free to share the link directly.
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The reply was in PDF form and from a Barelvi source in case you again say that it is from Wahabis :lol:

Anyways hopefully I would find it
 
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Screenshot_2023-11-16-09-57-33-91_40deb401b9ffe8e1df2f1cc5ba480b12~2.jpg
 
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Areesh said:
Guy can't even recite Quran in Arabic properly and you think he is some expert of Islam now :lol:

He shares a few Hadith with you guys with Urdu translation and you gullible fools think those 4-5 Hadith are enough to understand the whole religion while there are many other Hadiths that need to be studied to get to a final conclusion

But 4-5 Hadith from Islam 360 app with Urdu translation and you guys think that you have learned all of Islam

Scholars have asked this clown engineer to come and have debate in a sensible manner. This clown even accepted their invitation and then ran away when it was time to debate. This guy has been exposed multiple times for his mistakes or blunders but still you fools think he is some big expert on theology

Guy is a bhagora like Nawaz Sharif and it is a shame that you guys follow him and take him seriously




The rafziyat or neem rafziyat that we can see in these posts is what your bhagora engineer has served and not Islam

@Zarvan Get it in your head
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He can fully recite the Quran in fact better than most of Mullahs. He recites the way it should be recited. Everyone can get stuck once in a while with recitation I can also show dozens of other Mullahs even Qaris getting stuck. Secondly, he doesn't show just few Hadees. Every Hadees he talks about he gives reference first. He even when he exposes books of various Firqas he shows what is written in them on screen and I have checked and verified every reference he has given, and they have proven to be right. You again proved me you basically have completely no argument against him from Quran and Sunnah and you just want to accuse with no bases. You need to first open your mind and check each reference he gives and also the books he shows of the different firqas.

 
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Areesh said:
Guy can't even recite Quran in Arabic properly and you think he is some expert of Islam now :lol:

He shares a few Hadith with you guys with Urdu translation and you gullible fools think those 4-5 Hadith are enough to understand the whole religion while there are many other Hadiths that need to be studied to get to a final conclusion

But 4-5 Hadith from Islam 360 app with Urdu translation and you guys think that you have learned all of Islam

Scholars have asked this clown engineer to come and have debate in a sensible manner. This clown even accepted their invitation and then ran away when it was time to debate. This guy has been exposed multiple times for his mistakes or blunders but still you fools think he is some big expert on theology

Guy is a bhagora like Nawaz Sharif and it is a shame that you guys follow him and take him seriously




The rafziyat or neem rafziyat that we can see in these posts is what your bhagora engineer has served and not Islam

@Zarvan Get it in your head
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Bhai, I apologize if I offended you. I humbly request you not to resort to name calling quoting me as a “rafizi” as I have nothing but respect for you. That being said if what I said hurt anybody here or offended anybody again, I apologize. It is my opinion and not something I had the intention of forcing down anybody’s throat.
 
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Zarvan said:
He can fully recite the Quran in fact better than most of Mullahs. He recites the way it should be recited. Everyone can get stuck once in a while with recitation I can also show dozens of other Mullahs even Qaris getting stuck. Secondly, he doesn't show just few Hadees. Every Hadees he talks about he gives reference first. He even when he exposes books of various Firqas he shows what is written in them on screen and I have checked and verified every reference he has given, and they have proven to be right. You again proved me you basically have completely no argument against him from Quran and Sunnah and you just want to accuse with no bases. You need to first open your mind and check each reference he gives and also the books he shows of the different firqas.

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@Areesh and @S.Y.A laughing without bringing any counter argument. Just some old fashion gustakhi fatwas. So you people just want to stay ignorant and in denial. So next time if you have time to debate properly here are my accounts of social media, debate me here

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