What's new

HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions

Status
Not open for further replies.
MCA is totally different from LCA. MCA will be twin engine and will stealthy and its capacity will be 20 Ton rather then 10 Ton.

So, one cannot say that we need butter but not bread. We need both.
I didn't mean it in comparison to LCA, but imo there is no need anymore for a special manned strike aircraft after 2020 (and MCA won't come before). With the high number and types of manned aircrafts IAF is inducting in the next decade (LCA, MKI, MMRCA, FGFA = over 500 fighters), there is no real need to develop another twin engine 5. gen fighter specialised mainly for strikes.
UCAVS like the NG X47, Mig Skat, Dassault nEUROn are the future, because they are way cheaper, can be made smaller and stealthier, and are better in strike missions that normally are too risky for normal pilots.
But that's a different issue that belongs to another thread.
 
.
I didn't mean it in comparison to LCA, but imo there is no need anymore for a special manned strike aircraft after 2020 (and MCA won't come before). With the high number and types of manned aircrafts IAF is inducting in the next decade (LCA, MKI, MMRCA, FGFA = over 500 fighters), there is no real need to develop another twin engine 5. gen fighter specialised mainly for strikes.
UCAVS like the NG X47, Mig Skat, Dassault nEUROn are the future, because they are way cheaper, can be made smaller and stealthier, and are better in strike missions that normally are too risky for normal pilots.
But that's a different issue that belongs to another thread.

India wish to develop weapons self. This will help him to become self reliance and also, will increase chance of export to friendly countries.
 
.
Built for air force, Kaveri engine chosen by navy


Built for air force, Kaveri engine chosen by navyAjai Shukla / Bangalore September 08, 2009, 1:01 IST

The indigenous Kaveri aircraft engine, soon to make its debut flight, lacks the muscle needed by India’s Tejas light combat aircraft, which the engine was designed to power. In its present form, the Kaveri will never power a modern fighter.


But the engine’s technology — developed by the Defence R&D Organisation, over two decades, at a cost of Rs 3000 crore — will not be wasted. The Indian Navy is snapping up the Kaveri for powering its growing fleet of warships.:bounce:


Business Standard has learnt that the navy has officially informed the Gas Turbine and Research Establishment (the DRDO laboratory that developed the Kaveri) that naval warships will needs 40 Kaveri Marine Gas Turbines (KMGTs) over the next 15 years.:mps:


In an important signal of its support, the navy has agreed to fund 25 per cent of the cost of the KMGT project.
GTRE has developed the marine Kaveri by modifying the aero engine with a shaft, through which power can be delivered to a propeller. The navy has extensively tested these engines at Visakhapatnam and found that the marine Kaveri can deliver 12 Megawatts (16,000 Horsepower) of propulsion power.


Typically warships run on regular diesel engines; gas turbines (such as the Kaveri) are added on to provide “boost power”, needed for manoeuvring in battle. Contemporary gas turbines, such as the General Electric LM2500, provide India’s latest 5000-tonne Shivalik class frigates with 22 Mw of boost. The Kaveri’s more modest 12 Mw is sufficient only for smaller warships.

While the marine Kaveri’s basic performance has been established (even the PM has seen a demonstration in Visakhapatnam), the GTRE Director, Dr Mohana Rao, is not yet satisfied with the basic design.


“So far, the KMGT is just a spin-off from the aero version”, Rao told Business Standard in Bangalore. “I want to give the navy an engine with far greater endurance. An aero engine’s life is just 3000 hours; a marine engine’s life should be 30,000 hours. I must physically test the KMGT for at least 15,000 hours.”


GTRE is going ahead with developing 3-4 test engines and beginning trials within three years. The trials will be conducted in a marine environment, which will include high humidity, and prolonged exposure to salt.

“We plan to begin delivery in about 6 years”, says the GTRE Director, “We hope to keep the cost below Rs 25-30 crores, which is considerably cheaper than buying imported gas turbines.”


Earlier this year, the US State Department had stopped General Electric from fitting its LM-2500 turbines on the INS Shivalik, apparently because GE had not obtained proper permissions from the US government.

Other than the 40 KMGTs, the Indian Navy has also issued a letter, on 6 th April 09, laying out a requirement for 42 Gas Turbine Generators, or GTGs.

These are de-rated versions of the marine Kaveri, which will be used for generating electrical power on warships. Each GTG generates 1.2 Megawatts of power.


The Indian Navy, an enthusiastic proponent of indigenisation, proposes to replace the diesel generators fitted on older warships with the Kaveri GTG. If it performs well over a period of time, the new-generation warships will also get electrical power from the Kaveri GTG. Currently, only the Rajput and Delhi class of destroyers use gas turbines for power generation.
 
.
Nice article.....mant thanks
 
.
LCA-Tejas has completed total 1168 test flights successfully
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-214,PV2-128,PV3-152,LSP1-54,LSP2-82)
 
.
ADA WebSite - Home

LCA-Tejas has completed 1173 Test Flights successfully. (11-Sep-09).

* LCA has completed 1173 Test Flights successfully
(TD1-233,TD2-305,PV1-218,PV2-128,PV3-153,LSP1-54,LSP2-82).
* 218th flight of Tejas PV1 occurred on 11th Sep 09.
 
.
Which enginewill power Tejas
Late next month, a critical competition process kicks off for the selection of an alternate power source for the Indian Light Combat Aircraft (LCA Tejas). After pre-bid feasibility studies that were conducted through much of 2008, the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) -- the umbrella body of agencies involved in the LCA's development -- sent out Requests for Proposal (RfP) to Ohio-based GE Aviation for the F-414-400 and Hallbergmoos (Germany) based Eurojet Turbo GmbH for the EJ200. Both companies are required to submit their technical proposals by October 12. Technical evaluations of the engines will be complete by the end of the year, though these are planned to be truncated since a lot of technical work has been pre-completed during the feasibility studies. The technical evaluation will be followed by a full schedule of trials. As you might remember, it was the Defence Ministry's Aeronautics R&D Board Propulsion Panel, headed by ADA Project Director (Propulsion Systems) Dr KVL Rao, which recommended in July last year that the LCA programme rapidly begin a process to choose between the two mentioned engines to power upto 100 fighters (with an option to power 60 more). It was after his recommendations were submitted to the ADA that feasibility studies were begun with both GE and Eurojet for their respective turbofans.

Modifications are a non-issue as of now, with both GE and Eurojet declaring that their engines can fit in the LCA's fuselage. A limited number of engines will be bought direct from the winning contender, while the rest will be license-built at HAL's engine factory in Koraput, Orissa. With all options exercised, the deal could be worth close to $600-million.

The obvious tie-in with the medium multirole combat aircraft (MMRCA) competition is the lifeblood of the Tejas new engine bid. While the EJ200 powers the Eurofighter Typhoon, the F404 powers Boeing's F/A-18E/F Super Hornet as well as the JAS-39 Gripen IN.

According to IAF sources embedded with ADA, on paper, both engines "just about" meet what the air force wants and needs from the LCA in terms of thrust. Having established that, what are the possible criteria of selection, if one were to put aside political and/or other considerations?

Point 1, virtually everyone I've spoken to at the ADA and air force believe that the engine that meets the new thrust compliance bar and fits the Tejas with the least amount of engineering, fabrication or modification will be selected. Both engines say they meet the maximum thrust requirements demanded by the IAF. The American F-414-400 is physically similar, if not identical, to the F-404 that currently powers the Tejas, and is, remember, a technological derivative of the same. Therefore, it stands to reason that ADA believes the people at GE when they say the F-414 is a spot-on fit without any tinkering. Similarly, based on information gleaned from the feasibility study, Eurojet boss Hartmut Tenter told Flightglobal earlier this year that "the EJ200 fits perfectly into the same hole." Ok.

Point 2, weight issues, which won't be taken, um, lightly. The F-414-400, at 1,109-kgs is approximately 120-kgs heavier than the EJ200.

Point 3, the F-414-400 has a stated maximum thrust of 98kN, more than the EJ200's 90kN, even though both technically meet the IAF's requirement for a 90kN turbofan. Will the extra thrust that the American engine apparently offers be enough reason to ignore the 120-kgs of additional weight that it brings to the competition? Maybe.

Point 4, the folks at ADA have had a great amount of experience working with GE on the LCA programme, so the American firm is well-versed with the rough and tumble of the IAF's qualitative requirements. Working with a firm that is already "in the picture" about your requirements is an intangible consideration, but a consideration nevertheless.

Point 4, if the IAF's mantra for lowering inventory type is taken even a bit seriously, then the outcome of this competition could bring a great amount of influence to bear on the far more lucrative MMRCA competition. This alone could give the government a huge amount of leverage either way, though it could also slow things down significantly to the detriment of the LCA programme.

The selection process begins next month.

General Electric's F414-GE-400 for the Tejas LCA Mk2 and General Electric's F110-132A for the F-16IN Super Viper. GE will sweep it all...game, set and match! GE also gets to set up an engine MRO workshop for CFM56 and GE90 turbofans at Nagpur, thereby overshooting--in dollar terms--the MoD-mandated industrial offsets requirements. Just prior to announcing the M-MRCA competition's winner, the MoD will announce that the the DPP is being 'modified' to recognise the strength and value of 'strategic' indirect aviation-related industrial offsets.
 
.
General Electric's F414-GE-400 for the Tejas LCA Mk2 and General Electric's F110-132A for the F-16IN Super Viper. GE will sweep it all...game, set and match! GE also gets to set up an engine MRO workshop for CFM56 and GE90 turbofans at Nagpur, thereby overshooting--in dollar terms--the MoD-mandated industrial offsets requirements. Just prior to announcing the M-MRCA competition's winner, the MoD will announce that the the DPP is being 'modified' to recognise the strength and value of 'strategic' indirect aviation-related industrial offsets.
If commonality is the key to MMRCA, don't you think F18SH with the same GE 414 engine is way more likely than F16IN?
What the report is missing is that Eurojet has offered TVC with the engine and a lot of ToT that the GE can't offer. TVC and ToT that could help to improve Kaveri is imo a big point, especially if you keep in mind that the engine is lighter and EADS already assists to reduce LCAs weight.
 
.
Defunct Humanity: Indian delegation visited RD-33MK production plant

The Indian military delegation has visited in September, 15 a Russian 'Chernyshev' plant, where RD-33/RD-33MK engines for MiG-29K/MiG-35 are manufactured. The deputy Minister of Defense R.K.Singh and HAL's chief Ashok Nayak headed the delegation, 'Interfax-AVN' news agency reports. Two years ago India and Russia signed agreement for RD-33 ser. 3 engine license production in India and ToT. Only the first 20-40 aircrafts will be produced with imported of the shelf GE404 engines. The current delays in development fully indigenous 'Kavery' engine for HAL's LCA fighter and the new IAF ambitions for better payload pushes Indian tops for seeking more powerful engine for upgrading LCA. The currently installed GE404 doesn't fulfill the IAF specification and isn't powerful enough for Navy LCA variant. According to the new request they need minimum 90 kN wet thrust for the strengthened LCA airframe and increased load.


There are only three engines on the market fit this request: the American GE414, British-EU EJ200 and Russian RD-33MK. Between them only GE414 can be installed instead of previously used engine without big airframe rework, but US proved their political unreliability in the past when put embargo on India. Then India seemingly is careful to not repeat its mistake, two other engines have a chance to be chosen as the LCA mark 2 engine solution till 'Kaveri' is ready.


The strong side of RD-33MK engine is its unique in fly reliability: unlike other contenders it works well on any AoA. Thus non AoA limitation is needed. The options for thrust vectoring and the single engine configuration (RD-93) are ready too, - something what EJ200 have no yet. Also, if India chooses RD-33MK, it has a chance to achieve the long wished unification: the LCA fleet will have common engine logistic with MiG-29, MiG-29MK and possibly MiG-35s, while the serial production line for RD-33 class is already under construction in India. After paying ToT money for RD-33 ser. 3 there is no need for paying double sum for RD-33MK.
 
.
^^^^ the above article is just the interpretation of the author that the RD-33MK MAY be used for the lca

the ej-2000 and the f-414 ALONE are being evaluated presently , RD engine was never in contention ,the prouction facility for the engines will be for the upgraded mig-29s and for mig-29k of the navy- which presumably will be the long term carrier aircraft with the indian navy hence the entire line will be brought to india ..other than that it definitely wont be used on the LCA for sure .....

:cheers:
 
.
hence the entire line will be brought to india ..other than that it definitely wont be used on the LCA for sure .....
that right i think also the fact is western engine is supirier then russian and weight problem ej200 & ge414 is lighter then rd-33

LCA
engine KAVERI
L 137.4
D 35.8
W 1100/950
D/T 52
FULL A/b 90

JF-17
engine RD-33
L 167.3
D 40.9
W 1055
D/T 50
FULL A/B 81.3

G-39/LCA
engine GE404
L 154
D 35
W 1036
D/T 55
FULL A/B 85

EF
engine EJ200
L 157
D 29
W 989/1035
D/T 60
FULL A/B 90

F/A-18E/F
engine GE414
L 154
D 35
W 1110
D/T 62
FULL A/B 98
 
. . .
So guys! Which one is final engine... Too many news there i am kind of confused about this engine thing.
 
.
So guys! Which one is final engine... Too many news there i am kind of confused about this engine thing.
I think iaf goes for ef-200. RFP issue at june-july this yr for 2 company ge & eurojet rfp submition date is oct. 2009
 
.
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom