temujin
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Ahh, a rare breed you are!
Lol
![Cheesy :cheesy: :cheesy:](/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/cute/cheesy.gif)
2008 didn't do it but hopefully the current Eurozone crisis will hopefully start the process..
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Ahh, a rare breed you are!
what a silly comment.
it's not only wrong, it's another example of the superduper delusions Indians hold about their economy.
First off, Jamaica is at SD level. Pakistan is around B-. Greece is around CCC. Greece still is just above Jamaica and just below Pakistan. India is not much ahead at BBB and only avoided a recent downgrade because it made some changes. Pakistan is not doing too badly. That too with the instability by wot.
it'll default or devalue. More or less the same thing. Germany will control which is does probably.
Greece's debt is $380 billion and it's population is only 11 million, so the Greeks have a per-head debt of $44000. I don't think Germany can save Greece from economic disintegration.
Greece's troubles have been a long time in the making. Too much leftism, too much socialism. I had a Greek engineering professor 20+ years back. He left for the U.S. when students at his U. went on strike for the right to stay in tourist hotels rather than student housing. Demonstrations were timed to coincide with finals, of course...this professor took his serious students to the U.S. with him. Friends with the Papendreous...said that the Greeks would take everyone for all they were worth but eventually would give in under external pressure and make the necessary adjustments since it isn't the politicians that are corrupt, but the people.It is important to closely watch what's happening in Greece--the implications are beyond Greece.
I have a Greek lady friend here. Very charming. But is utterly dejected by 'corruption' inside Greece. According to her, Greece does not have much of economy except tourism.
@Temujin,
There was recently an article in NY Times about Greece's problems. About half of the 'recommended' Comments were of the opinion that Greece's problems are due to its corrupt, cronyism culture of 'Fiesta and Siesta'. Basically, lazy and corrupt. And the other half of the recommended comments were that Greece has been preyed up by the big global banks, especially by the Wall Street ones.
What is your opinion?
Greece's troubles have been a long time in the making. Too much leftism, too much socialism. I had a Greek engineering professor 20+ years back. He left for the U.S. when students at his U. went on strike for the right to stay in tourist hotels rather than student housing. Demonstrations were timed to coincide with finals, of course...this professor took his serious students to the U.S. with him. Friends with the Papendreous...said that the Greeks would take everyone for all they were worth but eventually would give in under external pressure and make the necessary adjustments since it isn't the politicians that are corrupt, but the people.
Although its true Greeks generally work fewer hours and retire earlier than the rest of Europe,I think its unfair to pick on Greece as its economic problems are not unique but shared by much of Southern Europe. Many club med countries have historically been heavily indebted, with huge grey economies/high levels of tax evasion and have routinely resorted to default and devaluation in the past to reduce debt, trade deficits and stimulate growth.
At the EU level, I think the whole 'Euro project' was itself fundamentally flawed in seeking a politically and commercially motivated monetary union between the more prosperous, industrious and prudent Northern European nations and the poorer,feckless Southerners, in the absence of a broader fiscal union. It is well known that Greece cooked its books to meet the qualifying requirements for entry into the Euro but managed to keep the act going as long as it was able to borrow cheaply from the markets, thanks to surpluses from China and 'funny money' created by financial institutions through 'exotic' financial machinations.
The flip side of joining the Euro for Greece was that its interest rates were now set by the ECB, which tends to take its orders from Germany. So throughout the noughties, the ECB kept interest rates consistently low as inflation remained dampened due falling prices of Chinese goods. This suited Germany but created a negative interest rate environment in real terms for countries like Portugal/Ireland/Greece/Spain (PIGS) causing massive asset bubbles and an explosion in public and private sector borrowing. This would have been ok had interest rates remained low enough for these countries to continue borrowing ever increasing amounts in order to service their mounting debts but the crash of 2008 put paid to that plan.
Following the crash of 2008, the PIGS would have chosen to devalue and restructure their debts in normal circumstances but EU rules and membership of the Euro do not allow them to do that. Faced with the prospect of debt deflation and default, these countries have had to instead accept severe austerity measures and expensive bailouts from the EU (which in itself is a breach of EU legislation), which only seem to have pushed these countries deeper into recession....
... I hope I've answered your question without getting too technical![]()
Although its true Greeks generally work fewer hours and retire earlier than the rest of Europe,I think its unfair to pick on Greece as its economic problems are not unique but shared by much of Southern Europe. Many club med countries have historically been heavily indebted, with huge grey economies/high levels of tax evasion and have routinely resorted to default and devaluation in the past to reduce debt, trade deficits and stimulate growth.
I hope I've answered your question without getting too technical![]()