General Hameed Gul and patriotic passion of Hameed Gul never die

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Such a brilliant asset but was let go early? Why?

For the same reason General Eisenhower was made into a President, not General MacArthur…..

Marshal Rommel had to swallow the poison pill…..

Khalid bin Walid (RA) was asked to resign….

 

[Taimoor Khan]

I still remember this Zionist rat Michael Kugelman mocking the death of Hameed Gul, on how he died on India Independence Day.

Where are you now, b!tch.

 

[VCheng]

For the same reason General Eisenhower was made into a President, not General MacArthur…..

Marshal Rommel had to swallow the poison pill…..

Khalid bin Walid (RA) was asked to resign….

Except that those examples were military generals bowing to civilian authority, not what Pakistani Generals are known for, mostly.

Not a good standard to go by —

Exactly my point, specially where obeying the Constitution is concerned. Very different!

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Except that those examples were military generals bowing to civilian authority, not what Pakistani Generals are known for, mostly.

Another "pearl of wisdom". Khalid bin Waleed (RA) bowing to Umer (RA) , a civilian?
Do you even know what you are talking about?

 

[VCheng]

Another "pearl of wisdom". Khalid bin Waleed (RA) bowing to Umer (RA) , a civilian?
Do you even know what you are talking about?

Back to the 7th century!

Yes, I know what I am talking about. It also applies to Bin Qasim too. Imagine that!

 

[Taimoor Khan]

Back to the 7th century!

Yes, I know what I am talking about. It also applies to Bin Qasim too. Imagine that!

Umer (RA) was a general himself, a soldier, infact supreme commander of Muslim armies, a Khalifa, a dictator according to all western ideologies, to label him as "civilian" under your western ideas and indoctrination of "civilian supremacy" under the overall context of so called "democracy", is what I mentioned earlier, "pearl of wisdom".

 

[jamahir]

Please enlighten us all, how Gen Gul became the crusader of Afghanistan, when Afghanistan was occupied by non muslims nations like soviet first, then yanks. He bloody fought the soviets to free Afghanistan from forigen occupation.

1. Afghanistan in the 1980s was governed by progressive Muslim Afghans. The Soviets came in to to assist a brotherly government against the invasion by hundreds or thousands of foreign criminals who were created, trained, armed and assisted by the Crusader West, China, Saudia and Zia's Pakistan. So if anyone was the foreigner here it was those those five.

2. The Soviet Union had Muslim SSR republics in it and Muslims from non-Muslim-majority SSR republics.

3. See the picture in post# 67 of Gen. Gul standing happily with a so-called Afghan Mujhaideen ( Al Qaeda basically ).

4. So part of the blame for two million civilian deaths in the Afghan war lies on the head of Gen. Gul. This cannot be ignored. You may ask Afghans about this. I think many of them will agree with me.

You Indians have really, pardon my french, fked up matter in your upper chambers.

Please read the above and update your own upper chamber.

 

[Raja Porus]

@VCheng another reason can be that Asif Nawaz was a bit pro-west/US and pro-democracy while everyone knows about Hameed Gul's views, thus it may be more of a clash of ideologies than a clash of personalities.

 

[VCheng]

@VCheng another reason can be that Asif Nawaz was a bit pro-west/US and pro-democracy while everyone knows about Hameed Gul's views, thus it may be more of a clash of ideologies than a clash of personalities.

Possibly. My guess is that he was right person for a specific task. When the task was completed, his zealousness became a liability instead of being an asset. A usual strategy.

 

[VCheng]

Umer (RA) was a general himself, a soldier, infact supreme commander of Muslim armies, a Khalifa, a dictator according to all western ideologies, to label him as "civilian" under your western ideas and indoctrination of "civilian supremacy" under the overall context of so called "democracy", is what I mentioned earlier, "pearl of wisdom".

The titles, posts, and responsibilities of an era so long ago are not directly comparable to today, for starters. He was a Caliph, perhaps the modern equivalent that could be close to that is MBS in Saudi Arabia. A Caliph is not a dictator in my view. He was not a serving General but the Commander of Forces as a Caliph.

 

[TsAr]

Possibly. My guess is that he was right person for a specific task. When the task was completed, his zealousness became a liability instead of being an asset. A usual strategy.

After Gen Aslam Beg retired Nawaz Sharif appointed Asif Nawaz as new COAS as he was the senior most, below is the seniority list
Gen Asif Nawaz
Gen Shamim Alam
Gen Naz
Gen Hameed Gul

 

[Taimoor Khan]

1. Afghanistan in the 1980s was governed by progressive Muslim Afghans. The Soviets came in to to assist a brotherly government against the invasion by hundreds or thousands of foreign criminals who were created, trained, armed and assisted by the Crusader West, China, Saudia and Zia's Pakistan. So if anyone was the foreigner here it was those those five.

2. The Soviet Union had Muslim SSR republics in it and Muslims from non-Muslim-majority SSR republics.

3. See the picture in post# 67 of Gen. Gul standing happily with a so-called Afghan Mujhaideen ( Al Qaeda basically ).

4. So part of the blame for two million civilian deaths in the Afghan war lies on the head of Gen. Gul. This cannot be ignored. You may ask Afghans about this. I think many of them will agree with me.



Please read the above and update your own upper chamber.

1. Soviets were the main reason and force behind the events of 1971 and for them to enter into western flanks of Pakistan with their Indian ally on eastern flanks, sandwiching Pakistan, their next target was the warm waters of Arabian sea, and I dont have to educate you what it would have meant for Pakistan. Soviets had to no business to camp in a sovereign country and occupy it, and the fact that Afghan citizens started their resistance against their occupation of their soil and sustained it, shouldn't make indiots like you understand that no outside support can work unless there is a genuine grevience on grassroots level. Both the citizens of Afghanistan and Pakistan interets aligned on that occasion. Rest is just irrelevant noise which you Indians are known to make.

2. Non sense. It was just USSR. you are not old enough to know I suppose. Find old maps , google it.

3. Non sense again, there was no Al Qaeeda back then. You are clearly pissing in the air aimlessly.

4. Bullshit. All blame lies with invading forces who trampled the sovereignty of a country and occupied it. And also the countries who FULLY supported the occupation like India, on both occasions.



You are a waste of space.

The titles, posts, and responsibilities of an era so long ago are not directly comparable to today, for starters. He was a Caliph, perhaps the modern equivalent that could be close to that is MBS in Saudi Arabia. A Caliph is not a dictator in my view. He was not a serving General but the Commander of Forces as a Caliph.

Go back to your own post #78 and read back. Enjoy

 

[VCheng]

Go back to your own post #78 and read back. Enjoy

Yes, I read it again, and thoroughly enjoyed your profound ignorance and mental bankruptcy once again. Thank you for adding such levity to my evening. You may now slither back to the century where you clearly belong.

 

[Whitefalcon90]

What a great man. May he be rewarded highest of highest places in Jannat for safe guarding the Muslims.

 

[jamahir]

1. Soviets were the main reason and force behind the events of 1971 and for them to enter into western flanks of Pakistan with their Indian ally on eastern flanks, sandwiching Pakistan, their next target was the warm waters of Arabian sea, and I dont have to educate you what it would have meant for Pakistan.

That "warm waters" theory may be factual but it is only part of the truth and has become boring.

Why couldn't Pakistan have made friends with India after mutually ignoring the events of 1971 ? Why in 1980 did it have to be in NATO camp ? If in Pakistan the leftist coup by Faiz Ahmed Faiz and comrades had succeeded, that so-called Rawalpindi Conspiracy, it is definite that by the 1980s Pakistan too would have been friends with the USSR and either balanced with NATO like India or have been more opposed to NATO like Cuba and Libya. And such a situation would have led to solving of the problems between Pakistan and India.

Soviets had to no business to camp in a sovereign country and occupy it, and the fact that Afghan citizens started their resistance against their occupation of their soil and sustained it, shouldn't make indiots like you understand that no outside support can work unless there is a genuine grevience on grassroots level.

Indiots like me will again tell "sensible" Pakistani Abduls like you that the Soviets came in to Afghanistan to help a brotherly government against transnational criminals and local criminals and regressives.

Under the leftists Afghanistan was making progress in multiple spheres and the Soviets were contributing to this change. It was a progressive Afghan citizen, Abdul Ahad Mohmand, who in 1988 launched to space aboard the Soviet spaceship Soyuz and stayed for some days in the Soviet space station Mir. Mr. Mohmand wasn't part of this criminal "Afghan citizens' resistance" that you are talking of but lived in the space station of those same "occupiers" you mention.

2. Non sense. It was just USSR. you are not old enough to know I suppose. Find old maps , google it.

No, you google and tell me :

1. What is the full form of "USSR".

2. What was the Uzbek SSR and what is the Republic of Dagestan.

3. Non sense again, there was no Al Qaeeda back then. You are clearly pissing in the air aimlessly.

From Wikipedia page about Al Qaeda :

Al-Qaeda (/ælˈkaɪdə, ˌælkɑːˈiːdə/; Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-Qāʿidah, IPA: [ælqɑːʕɪdɐ], translation: "The Base", "The Foundation", alternatively spelled al-Qaida and al-Qa'ida) is a militant Sunni Islamist multi-national organization, which is widely regarded as terrorist. It was founded in 1988 by Osama bin Laden, Abdullah Azzam, and several other Arab volunteers during the Soviet–Afghan War.

From this article :

Guerrillas who protect US terror attack suspect Osama bin Laden were trained in Scotland, it has been alleged.

A former member of the SAS told the Sunday Mail newspaper that he helped train Mujahedin fighters at two secret camps in Scotland and another in northern England during the 1980s.

Ken Connor said the training helped to transform the Afghan men into a "fighting unit" that inflicted heavy casualties on Russian forces occupying their country.

But the newspaper says that some of the same men may now be used to kill western troops who attempt to capture or destroy bin Laden.

Mr Connor said one of the training camps was located in mountains surrounding the Criffel in Dumfries while the other was in the remote Applecross peninsula in the West Highlands.


He said: "The Mujahedin fighters were already excellent soldiers committed to their cause.

"The main thing they lacked was tactical knowledge and battle planning, so we worked constantly on that.

"Some helicopter training was also arranged for them and they were taught how to attack airfields.

"But the main achievement was to turn them from a disorganised mob into a fighting unit."

Soviet invasion

Mr Connor said that the Afghan rebels were trained in Scotland in 1983 - four years after the former Soviet Union invaded their country.

He said the year after they returned to fight the occupying forces they killed 2343 Soviet troops.

The former SAS member also said that if some of the same men were now protecting bin Laden then they would make a "fearsome enemy" for any western forces sent to capture the Saudi dissident.

He added: "It's a landlocked country and the terrain is such that a couple of dozen soldiers could fight off thousands.

"And this is the scary bit. I don't think there's a way of getting bin Laden out.

"Unless the Taleban lock him up and present him to the US, he's not coming."

Many of the so-called Afghan Mujahideen were the same people who formed Al Qaeda in 1988 in Afghanistan. So when is that photo from ?

This article has that photo :

General Gul is certainly one of the most talkative former intelligence directors in the world, constantly seeking the spotlight through provocative remarks presented in a seemingly endless series of television and print interviews. While the United States has regularly claimed Gul is a supporter of al-Qaeda and Taliban forces, Gul counters that his activities are strictly based on morality, Pakistani sovereignty and the struggle of Muslims to free themselves from foreign occupation and manipulation:

The Americans sent my name to the UN Security Council to put me on a sanctions list and declare me an international terrorist. But they failed because the Chinese knew the truth well and blocked that move. Basically, the Americans have nothing against me. I saw the charges and I replied to them in the English-language press in Pakistan. I said if they have anything against me to bring it forward, put me on trial. Tell me what wrong I have done. I have been taking moral stands. The Americans talk of freedom of speech, but apparently my speech hurts them because it counters their excesses… I do not support terror at all, but jihad is our right when a nation is oppressed. According to the United Nations Charter, national resistance for liberation is a right. We call this a jihad (al-Jazeera, February 17, 2010).

Wikileaks Controversy

General Gul’s name appears in 92,000 of the U.S. diplomatic cables leaked to Wikileaks, most often in connection to his alleged ties with the Taliban, the Haqqani Network and al-Qaeda operatives.

He even made a funny statement :

Despite his alleged connections to Afghanistan’s Taliban, Gul sees a different motivation behind the activities of Pakistan’s own Taliban: “The Pakistani Taliban are being sponsored by the Indian intelligence and the Mossad, by the way, to carry out their attacks in Pakistan. Mossad is very active in Pakistan and they are providing all the guidance and technical support to the Indian intelligence.

4. Bullshit. All blame lies with invading forces who trampled the sovereignty of a country and occupied it. And also the countries who FULLY supported the occupation like India, on both occasions.

Ask the Afghans who are now fleeing or fear oppression what they think about Gen. Gul.

You are a waste of space.

You may be older than me but you are quite misinformed about things.