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Gaza-Israel Conflict | October 2023

I am not a Turk nor Kemalist but couple of things are clear. Ottoman Empire had 13 million pool to recruit in 1914. Mustafa Kemal. Enver and others since 1911 fought it out with Italians, Serbs ,Bulgarians, Albanians,Greeks, British, Australians New Zealanders, Canadians, French Russians, Kurds, Yezidis. Armenians ,Arabs and Asyrians. At the end Mustafa Kemal won and stopped Lloyd George dreams of the annihilation of the Turkish nation ( I can quote here).
At that time there were 100s of millions of you, controlled by 100k Brits.

I agree with you that we shouldn’t be cursing Mustafa Kamal. He played a role in saving Turkey from occupation and helped modernize it.

It’s also a reality that 100 years ago most of the Muslim world was colonized. There were less than 100,000 British ruling over 350 million Indians for 150 years. It’s not like others have a right to criticize Turks.

Ataturk had to modernize Turkey quickly, which he tried to do. In doing so he went overboard in his suppression of Islamic and Ottoman culture and tradition. He left Turkey stuck in between Europe and the Muslim world, belonging to neither side or the other.

I prefer the Islamist side in Turkey of Erdogan but as a sign of respect for all people of Turkey I would not curse Ataturk.
 
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They hate him because he represents civilization and there's nothing savages hate more than civilization.


Today they celebrate as hamas is parading around the corpses of dead civilians, tomorrow they will be crying when hamas is cut down like the rabid dogs they are and they will blame us for not helping.
I already explained that thought process. You might remember that on Defence Hub , I wrote that in the reality the majority of this people aren't islamists. How and why is long story. Do you know what helps to understand many of these things? Don't look much into who said that and this or so called political views. Look the characters, habits, history, mentally, instincts. I remember, years ago on bbc , they showed a little old Benghali man who took all his family to Syria to Daesh. He was saying that he wanted to be the part if the Islamic State. The old man with the family in war zone??? To be a good Muslim? No, never. He was a man who wanted to feel non servant for the first time in his life, who finally wanted to be somebody etc. Totally irresponsible ant Totally unislamic.
Others went there that people can be afraid of them for once in their lives, sex adventures, pathetic romanticism, attention, position etc. All those reasons have nothing to do with Islam. You can see the way , they do Dawa in London. Literally the started to resemble Stop The Oil . If they reread Qur'an then they would see that such way of preaching is not recommended.
It is not surprising really that many people split with Islam or have certain issues. When they see such charade and if they don't particular knowledge, then it is easy to develop general apprehension towards Islam. Etc etc. There are very very few genuine Islamists hence I am more concentrated on the nationalism.
After all what's is in their story substantial. While in their countries, they are not Patriots but in London and Paris, they are ( obviously for the sake of individualsm). They have no understanding of the Religion nor they can implement what Allah SWT orders them. It is always the case that someone else is to blame ( lack of responsibility). Clichés are the norms. In reality &70 of thinking is woke based.
You and me have to be reminded about the destiny of Andalusian Muslims, 550 years ago, not for all the sacrifices which we have given in the last 200 years. They don't know that nor do they care. Because in reality, they don't want God's Low or system. They want victimocracy, where the more jin glasses you washed for British officers, the higher rank you should have, the wiser you are hence you can feel entitled to philosofie. We have completely different story and instead to learn from that and gain the experience, they choose to antagonise that, just out if Nefs. So it is not surprising that many Turks get annoyed with that. Out of their narcissism, they make enemies out of friends. What's paradoxes, all of this is truly contradictory to Islam
 
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I didn't say this either. I simply responded to your incorrect statement that Iran cannot supply Hamas and Russia at the same time.

So then why bring up that topic to begin with when I am talking about how the Israel response are?
Dude, your perception of Iranian exports to Russia is totally wrong. Selling a few thousand Shahed-136 drones produced in a few facilities is a tiny fraction of the Iranian MIC. Iran is making huge profits with these exports.

This is like me saying Israel cannot supply the IDF with enough equipment to fight Palestinian militants in Gaza because it exports drones and missiles to Azerbaijan. It makes no sense.

I actually never said that. The issue here is not providing Russia with Shahed drone, but that's the best thing you can provide with Russia. That mean that is the "export" item for Iran, and if that is the category that Iran depends on, how exactly can you out build Israeli when their MIC made enough Aircraft, Radar, Artillery, IFV, Tanks for export. You always look at one on one, you cannot say "since we supply Russia with a lot of drones and then we will supply Hamas rifle, rocket and ATGM and etc and that could make a difference."

I mean are you going to give Hamas Nuke? how about fighter plane? How about warship that can stop Israeli warship from bombarding Gaza strip

If not, how do you think Iran support can make a different? In Essent, what Iran gave Hamas does not have already? And then we start talking about the quality of those product.

Iran is a much larger country with a much larger population for starters, and has embarked on a policy of self-sufficiency since the end of the war with Iraq in the 80s. We can go into more detail elsewhere, this thread isn't the suitable forum to debate Iran MIC vs Israel MIC.
Congrats on the Iran achievement for self sufficient and self independent, that did not answer the question of how they can out build the Israeli and make a different in this war like you claim?
 
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When Erdogan supported Palestine, the Arab world, led by Saudi, Egypt and the UAE, saw this as a threat of "neo-Ottomanism" and reacted much more harshly than Israel, and as a thank you to Erdogan, they formed an alliance with Greece/Cyprus in the Eastern Mediterranean against Turkey... That forced us to balance our relations with İsrael..
He should have never expected anything else.

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@LeGenD Can I say something here? There is a manga/anime which is my most favorite one and one of my most favorite works of art generally.

In the story,at some point,the small isolated nation that has been considered and blamed as devils by the world,staged a very strong strong surprise attack at the enemy's capital. They killed a lot of soldiers,a lot of civilians,wiped out the biggest part of the top brass and officials,all in front of journalists and ambassadors from all over the world. Their attack was surprising and devastating.

The biggest authorities who ruled behind the scenes,knew there was a "rat infestation",they knew an attack was coming but they went on with it and insisted the world's biggest newspapers and ambassadors had to see it.

So...while the small nation's common soldiers and people were celebrating and thinking it was the first of many victories to come,the most experienced and wiser ones were like:

"Until the whole world gathers and attacks us" and scenes like this:

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They thought they had gained time,they had gained a big victory against a massive enemy. But instead of proving that they were the good guys,they united the whole world against them (previously the nation that was dealt the blow was at war with various other countries).


So...you see some parallels here,right?

Many cheer and think they just won a big battle. But they had no idea what that would cause. They managed to save Netanyahu's government and unite the Israelis. Which Israeli will trust a Palestinian now? Hamas abducted anyone they found. Even Nepalis.
 
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If Hezbollah "enters" the war - then "if" Syria was "stronger" they could take advantage of this opportunity and reclaim their Golan Heights. Timing is not on Syria's side as they are weak from the on going war in Syria ...

Question is, if you tie together the Abraham Accords, Saudia-Israeli normalisation, the Syrian War, Iraq War, the overthrow of Imran Khan, is there a coherent multi-stage stategy at play here ? Has Al Aqsa-Flood put a pause on this strategy ? Is that why the Americans have green light he genocide of Gaza because they are upset their strategy may be falling apart and a decades worth of work may go up in smoke ?

What are all the dots ? Are there indeed, descrete dots, which on their own look random - but are somehow are joined up ?? Am i suggesting a conspiracy where there is none ?
Syria will get massive support from fighters in Iraq. Iran proxies are way stronger than they were ever before.
 
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They are always in war with their own citizens, that is nothing new, if they want to increase intensity and resources let them do it but outcome is unpredictable, at least recent wars tought us that lesson.

Well, I just have one question for you.

What do you think Hamas are going to get out from this war with Israeli? First, do you really think there is an aspect Hamas is winning this? Or you think this is going to change the dynamic of Palestinian independence in favor of them?

Because if you ask me the same question, I would say no to both question, in fact, I don't think anything short of re-occupying Gaza is acceptable for me if I am Netanyahu, and I am in the majority claim after reading quite a few thinks tank analysis (Not PDF think tank, but actual think tank like CSIS and so on)
 
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An analyst trying to explain it to an Indian audience. (… maybe some will get the parallels with Kashmir)


Btw, knowing this war will probably go on for the next month or two :( the slogan should be End the Apartheid, End the war

Palestinians need to engage the Global South, especially South Africans (and older African Americans from the Jim Crow south), nowadays to vocally support of their cause by telling how they lived under apartheid and defacto apartheid in the American south respectively.

The other side is spread disinformation like there is no tomorrow because the eyes of the world are on them.

 
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