Fresh clashes erupt between Azerbaijan, Armenia

[Trango Towers]

Armenia has mutual security treaty with Belarus, Kazakhstan.

Collective Security Treaty Organization - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

No one will fight for you

 

[dBSPL]

From what I know,it was Azerbaijan that attacked the other day. Are you saying that weak Armenia started a fuss?

No need for word games. Every state in the world can suffer losses through attacks by asymmetrical elements, bombings and guerrilla operations. Azerbaijan is not a bigger power than Russia or the USA, is just a country that want to protect its territorial integrity despite embargoes. Moreover, geography is very suitable for such asymmetric operations. And there is both a signed peace treaty and Russia's peacekeeping force.

Especially French politicians and US senators, only publish messages condemning Azerbaijan and want the scope of sanctions to be expanded rapidly. They reflect the event only one-sidedly, because there are some basic issues related to the lobbies and elections in these countries, but more broadly, Armenia's relations with Russia. Anyway, for whatever reason, none of them write that the ongoing border clashes are attacks on Azerbaijani outposts. There are very grave videos that I do not want to share here, at least 50 soldiers of Azerbaijan were martyred. There are also civilian buildings hit by mortars and bombs. Since the other side of the coin is carefully ignored, it is naturally marketed as an Azerbaijani aggression in the western public.

However, the party that does not fulfill the conditions of the signed agreement is Armenia. Armenia is closer than ever to a new path to lasting peace and the country's rapid prosperity. However, as always, some other factors use the Armenians as an apparatus for their own interests.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

No one will fight for you

True, just like no one fights for Ukraine.

 

[Foinikas]

No need for word games. Every state in the world can suffer losses through attacks by asymmetrical elements, bombings and guerrilla operations. Azerbaijan is not a bigger power than Russia or the USA. Moreover, geography is very suitable for such asymmetric operations. And there is both a signed peace treaty and Russia's peacekeeping force.

What's that got to do with what I just asked? Did Azerbaijan start this the other day or not?

 

[thetutle]

From what I know,it was Azerbaijan that attacked the other day. Are you saying that weak Armenia started a fuss?


He's not brave,he's got an agenda. He's soldout. Armenia was already a tiny State and he's doing everything to make it even smaller. This guy basically wants to make Yerevan a big City-State. As long as him and his friends profit from it,he's ok with it. So what if NKR gets destroyed and they give a corridor to the Azeris and parts of Eastern Armenia,he doesn't live there,he doesn't care. A few days after the war ended,he mocked Shushi,calling it an undeveloped town not worth dying for etc. etc.

Armenia is not honouring the ceasefire agreement. Its not provided Azerbaijan with a corridor.

He has an agenda, its probably an agenda of taking what he can get, and building his coutry and realising that the dram of territorial expansion at the expense of Azerbaijan is just not worth it.

Armenia was great and powerful country once, So was Rome and Greece, Those days are over.

Imagine how Greece would live if it devoted all it energy to taking back Istanbul. Its not practical and wont happen. Armenia is better turning its country into a Dubai with Turkish and Iranian help than gain a few extra square kilometres of land.

 

[dBSPL]

What's that got to do with what I just asked? Did Azerbaijan start this the other day or not?

In the early hours of the morning of September 13, clashes broke out as Azerbaijani troops prevented Armenian guerrilla units from attempting to mine the border areas under Azerbaijani control, close to Azerbaijani army positions. In response to the large-scale Armenian provocation, local countermeasures were taken and the offensive positions on the Border that had brought the Azerbaijani troops under fire were neutralized. It was later declared that these dead were members of the Armenian army.

 

[Foinikas]

In the early hours of the morning of September 13, clashes broke out as Azerbaijani troops prevented Armenian guerrilla units from attempting to mine the border areas under Azerbaijani control, close to Azerbaijani army positions. In response to the large-scale Armenian provocation, local countermeasures were taken and the offensive positions on the Border that had brought the Azerbaijani troops under fire were neutralized. It was later declared that these dead were members of the Armenian army.

You do know that last year the Azeris marched inside Armenia proper and captured about 41 square km of Armenian land,right? In Syunik and Gegarkunik. All the fighting is at these parts. This is Armenia,not NKR.

 

[dBSPL]

Armenia has mutual security treaty with Belarus, Kazakhstan.

Collective Security Treaty Organization - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Kazakhstan announced that they would definitely not accept sending troops to Karabakh within the scope of the CSTO.

Edit: Putin rejected Armenia's request for military assistance.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1570084335386243072

If this news is true, Russia is of the opinion that Armenia is on the side that broke the agreement.

Pashinyan is on the verge of a decision that will affect next decades of the country.

 

[Tornado23]

True, just like no one fights for Ukraine.

No nation is willing to fight for another nation unless there is a big advantage on their side when fighting this war.

 

[Foinikas]

Armenia is not honouring the ceasefire agreement. Its not provided Azerbaijan with a corridor.

He has an agenda, its probably an agenda of taking what he can get, and building his coutry and realising that the dram of territorial expansion at the expense of Azerbaijan is just not worth it.

Azerbaijan hasn't honored parts of the agreement too. A lot of POWs have still not been returned,Azeris marched inside Armenia and grabbed territory,they bullied villagers,they ignored the Minsk group calls to withdraw from occupied territory etc.

Not to mention they even tried POWs as common criminals which is against the Geneva Convention.

 

[thetutle]

You do know that last year the Azeris marched inside Armenia proper and captured about 41 square km of Armenian land,right? In Syunik and Gegarkunik. All the fighting is at these parts. This is Armenia,not NKR.

Armenia occupies internationally recognised Azeri land and now Azerbaijan occupies some internationally recognised Armenian land. Maybe its a good time to swap and call it even? The truth is, its no ones land and taking land by force seems to be the thing to do now.

Azerbaijan hasn't honored parts of the agreement too. A lot of POWs have still not been returned,Azeris marched inside Armenia and grabbed territory,they bullied villagers,they ignored the Minsk group calls to withdraw from occupied territory etc.

Not to mention they even tried POWs as common criminals which is against the Geneva Convention.

Yeah, youre probably right. I didnt know about that. If Armenia is claiming Azerbaijan is not honouring the agreement the best thing it can do is fully honour it themselves and lead by example. What other options does it have? This situation now? is this better?

The Armenians were saved in the last war, and they think they can get away with it again. I know Armenians are convinced of their inherent superiority over Azerbaijan and will not easily give op on territorial expansion. even though pashinyan seems to be the only adult in the room.

 

[Trango Towers]

True, just like no one fights for Ukraine.

But with Ukraine every western country has special forces operating there

 

[Foinikas]

Armenia occupies internationally recognised Azeri land and now Azerbaijan occupies some internationally recognised Armenian land. Maybe its a good time to swap and call it even? The truth is, its no ones land and taking land by force seems to be the thing to do now.

It's not that easy when you have disputed lands. Israel can occupy Palestinian land and have dozens of countries recognise it as Israeli. Would that make it right? Legal?

If Serbs marched to Sarajevo and the world community recognised it as Serbian land,would you consider it occupied or rightly part of Serbia?

The Armenians were saved in the last war, and they think they can get away with it again. I know Armenians are convinced of their inherent superiority over Azerbaijan and will not easily give op on territorial expansion. even though pashinyan seems to be the only adult in the room

Azeris are convinced of their own inherent superiority. All they did was take part of their homeland in the last war. Pashinyan is not an adult,he is a guy who used to say the opposite things before he became president and now he is selling everything out.

 

[thetutle]

It's not that easy when you have disputed lands. Israel can occupy Palestinian land and have dozens of countries recognise it as Israeli. Would that make it right? Legal?

If Serbs marched to Sarajevo and the world community recognised it as Serbian land,would you consider it occupied or rightly part of Serbia?

If the world community recognised Serbian conquest of our lands as legitimate, I would probably accept it. Not because its right, but because the cost of fighting the world over it is not worth it. Serbia currently occupies Bosnian land. the whole Southern part of Serbia is Bosnian land. Its called sandžak. We all recognise it as Serbian land. We have no choice. Bosnians live there. they are fine with it. In 10 or 15 years we will probably not have a manned border with Serbia. We can already cross with ID cards. The cost to trade and general life quality is much better if we accept this loss of land. Serbia also lost land to Kosovo, and many places. They lost Yugoslavia. they dont have coastline. They have to live with it. They haven't accepted Kosovo loss yet but they will sooner to later. Its just not worth it.

same with Armenia. Its just not worth it. Take your 39,000 sq km and move on.

Some countries dont have to accept the loss. like ukraine, It is being armed and funded to get the land back. they can keep fighting. to them its probably worth it.

 

[Foinikas]

same with Armenia. Its just not worth it. Take your 39,000 sq km and move on.

Armenians can't do anything,but it doesn't mean Azeris are right.

From what I'm reading,Armenians are gathering outside the parliament now.