France seals $8.1 billion deal with Indonesia to sell 42 Rafale jets

[A.P. Richelieu]

France seals $8.1 billion deal with Indonesia to sell 42 Rafale jets

Indonesia will order 42 Rafale fighter jets in a $8.1 billion deal, France's defence ministry said on Thursday, as part of a series of agreements also including submarine development and ammunition, making Jakarta the biggest French arms client in the region.

www.reuters.com

JAKARTA, Feb 10 (Reuters) - Indonesia will order 42 Rafale fighter jets in a $8.1 billion deal, France's defence ministry said on Thursday, as part of a series of agreements also including submarine development and ammunition, making Jakarta the biggest French arms client in the region.

The deal comes as Paris, which views itself as a global maritime power, seeks to expand geopolitical ties in the Indo-Pacific after the United States, Britain and Australia created a new strategic alliance last year called AUKUS.

"We're planning to acquire 42 Rafale," said Indonesian Defence Minister Prabowo Subianto as he met with his French counterpart, Florence Parly.

"Our strategic partnership will benefit from the deepening of our defence relations," said France's Minister of the Armed Forces Parly.

The order would make Indonesia the second state in the Indo-Pacific region after India to rely on the jet produced by Dassault Aviation , Parly said.

A French defence ministry official told journalists in a briefing that the jet deal, which will boost production at Dassault Aviation, Safran (SAF.PA) and Thales , is worth $8.1 billion.

A first phase of the deal, over six Rafale jets, will be executed over the next months, while the remaining 36 will be delivered at a later stage, either late this year or next year, he added.

Dassault Aviation said the deal marked the start of a long-term partnership and would allow it to rapidly step up its presence in Indonesia. Its shares climbed around 4% on news of the agreement.

Thursday's agreement will make Indonesia -- currently ranking second after Singapore -- France's biggest military procurement client in the Southeast Asia region, the defence ministry official said.

In addition to the fighter jets, Indonesia has also signed a memorandum to cooperate on the development of submarines which is set to result in an order of two Scorpene vessels, produced by Naval Group, the French defence ministry said.

The issue is sensitive for France following Australia's cancellation of a multi-billion dollar submarine deal last year with Paris, which accused its allies of backstabbing.

Asked by journalists whether the developments surrounding the AUKUS alliance and the failed Australian submarine purchase influenced negotiations with Indonesia, a French defence ministry spokesperson said: "I don't think so, neither in one way nor the other."

"We have an Indo-Pacific strategy, we have the determination to maintain our defence industry and thus to export," he said.

Indonesia too has expressed concern about AUKUS, wary the use of the nuclear-powered submarines could add to geopolitical tensions in Southeast Asia, a region where China has considerable clout. Indonesia's defence minister, however, has said he understood why the alliance was formed.

The country has been seeking to overhaul its ageing air fleet for a while, which up until today includes U.S.-made F-16 and Russian Sukhoi Su-27 and Su-30 jets.

 

[GriffinsRule]

So heat about their investment in the Korean jet? @Indos
Are they still buying the F-16 block 72s? And what happens to their token Su-30s?

 

[blain2]

Indonesians are going in big. In addition to the 42 Rafales, they have also got approvals for 36 F-15 IDs as part of a $13B deal.

Indonesia wins U.S. approval to buy F-15s after Rafale jet deal

French, Indonesian defense ministers also agree to cooperate on submarines

asia.nikkei.com

Their defense budget is equal or less than Pakistan's but they are essentially borrowing against their 25 year military modernization plan which will allow them to leverage $125B in funds to get this modernization done.

Our idiots cannot think outside of $30B in exports, Indonesia (with similar population numbers as our useless, underperforming population) put out $231B in exports and have $35B in surplus. Food for thought!

 

[HttpError]

Indonesians are going in big. In addition to the 42 Rafales, they have also got approvals for 36 F-15 IDs as part of a $13B deal.

Indonesia wins U.S. approval to buy F-15s after Rafale jet deal

French, Indonesian defense ministers also agree to cooperate on submarines

asia.nikkei.com

Their defense budget is equal or less than Pakistan's but they are essentially borrowing against their 25 year military modernization plan which will allow them to leverage $125B in funds to get this modernization done.

Our idiots cannot think outside of $30B in exports, Indonesia (with similar population numbers as our useless, underperforming population) put out $231B in exports and have $35B in surplus. Food for thought!

Perhaps unlike our awam who only want to be selected as a government official (because there will be no work) or fantasize serving in defense sector because that will raise their stature in society and they'll be set for life. What more can you expect from people who have this mentality?

 

[UKBengali]

I have to hand it to the French in that after a slow start in export sales, the Rafale is turning into the same kind of export success like the Mirage-series aircraft were before it.

Current export orders stand at nearly 300 and so the Rafale may end up being produced in similar numbers to the Eurofighter.

This is a good thing as it will help France stay competitive in the world's arms markets and so give more choice to customers for defence products.

 

[TigerOfMysore]

I have to hand it to the French in that after a slow start in export sales, the Rafale is turning into the same kind of export success like the Mirage-series aircraft were before it.

Current export orders stand at nearly 300 and so the Rafale may end up being produced in similar numbers to the Eurofighter.

This is a good thing as it will help France stay competitive in the world's arms markets and so give more choice to customers for defence products.

This is all about AUKUS crumbs to calm the French. The AUKUS team is enabling and allowing the French to makeup the losses through such deals by making their products either not available or financially not competitive. This gravy train will end when the bill is fully paid. Also Rafale is a great plane and covers the old Mirage market which was sizable.

 

[Indos]

So heat about their investment in the Korean jet? @Indos
Are they still buying the F-16 block 72s? And what happens to their token Su-30s?

All fighters, F16, Su30/27, and even Hawk are still being operated, for Hawk and Sukhoi I believe at least until 2035 or more, for F 16 it could be until 2040 since refurbished and upgrade have been done. We have plan to refurbish and upgrade our Hawk squadron

Contrary to so many hype, the real contract for Rafale is just 6 planes, and it is actually similar with SU35 acquisition program that has been approved during Jokowi first administration. We let go SU35 acquisition which is also for 1.1 billion USD

KF21/IFX is still going on as we speak, KF21/IFX head program from South Korea is in Jakarta now.

 

[Indos]

Indonesians are going in big. In addition to the 42 Rafales, they have also got approvals for 36 F-15 IDs as part of a $13B deal.

Indonesia wins U.S. approval to buy F-15s after Rafale jet deal

French, Indonesian defense ministers also agree to cooperate on submarines

asia.nikkei.com

Their defense budget is equal or less than Pakistan's but they are essentially borrowing against their 25 year military modernization plan which will allow them to leverage $125B in funds to get this modernization done.

Our idiots cannot think outside of $30B in exports, Indonesia (with similar population numbers as our useless, underperforming population) put out $231B in exports and have $35B in surplus. Food for thought!

125 billion USD procurement plan by Prabowo which is leak and become hot issue is not going ahead. We only have 20 billion USD procurement budget for defense for 2020-2024 period

This is the break down for foreign loan back program (2020-2024)

AirForce : 8 billion USD
Navy: 7 billion USD
Army: 4 billion USD

 

[Aslan]

125 billion USD procurement plan by Prabowo which is leak and become hot issue is not going ahead. We only have 20 billion USD procurement budget for defense for 2020-2024 period

This is the break down for foreign loan back program (2020-2024)

AirForce : 8 billion USD
Navy: 7 billion USD
Army: 4 billion USD

I have a question, how does this deal effect the fighter jet program that is in works between South Korea, and Indonesia?

 

[Indos]

I have a question, how does this deal effect the fighter jet program that is in works between South Korea, and Indonesia?

Contrary to so many hype, the real contract for Rafale is just 6 planes, and it is actually similar with SU35 acquisition program that has been approved during Jokowi first administration. We let go SU35 acquisition which is also for 1.1 billion USD, so basically there is nothing new here and Jokowi needs to do his previous plan to fill our F 5 squadron with 6-16 planes since all of the fighters have been grounded

KF21/IFX is still going on as we speak, KF21/IFX head program from South Korea is in Jakarta now. I think getting Rafale will help also Indonesian Aerospace as it gets MRO engine OFSET from Safran. This also will make sure KF21/IFX ammunition for Indonesia since KF21/IFX also uses meteor.

The deal is part of big deal, like submarine building program in Indonesia, Rafale ammunition production in Pindad, and 120 mm and 105 mm MBT and Medium Tank ammunition production in Pindad Indonesia.

Others including cooperation between Thales and Indonesian company, PT LEN Industry in building Military Satellite.

In broad perspective it has geopolitical factor as Indonesia and French has become strategic partner, same like between Indonesia and South Korea where sensitive technology can be transferred.

 

[.King.]

Actually, now it seems likely that the rafale assembly line will have to be set up in India in partnership with reliance, if we go for rafales in the 144 MRFA contract.

Will be faster and cheaper than getting from france.

 

[UKBengali]

Contrary to so many hype, the real contract for Rafale is just 6 planes, and it is actually similar with SU35 acquisition program that has been approved during Jokowi first administration. We let go SU35 acquisition which is also for 1.1 billion USD, so basically there is nothing new here and Jokowi needs to do his previous plan to fill our F 5 squadron with 6-16 planes since all of the fighters have been grounded

KF21/IFX is still going on as we speak, KF21/IFX head program from South Korea is in Jakarta now. I think getting Rafale will help also Indonesian Aerospace as it gets MRO engine OFSET from Safran. This also will make sure KF21/IFX ammunition for Indonesia since KF21/IFX also uses meteor.

The deal is part of big deal, like submarine building program in Indonesia, Rafale ammunition production in Pindad, and 120 mm and 105 mm MBT and Medium Tank ammunition production in Pindad Indonesia.

Others including cooperation between Thales and Indonesian company, PT LEN Industry in building Military Satellite.

In broad perspective it has geopolitical factor as Indonesia and French has become strategic partner, same like between Indonesia and South Korea where sensitive technology can be transferred.

There is no logic to Indonesia acquiring just 6 Rafales as the cost of infrastructure and maintenance will be enormous for such a small number of planes.

It may not go up to 42 but certainly a number of 18 is the minimum we are looking at here.

 

[satyamev]

There is no logic to Indonesia acquiring just 6 Rafales as the cost of infrastructure and maintenance will be enormous for such a small number of planes.

It may not go up to 42 but certainly a number of 18 is the minimum we are looking at here.

what real threats do the Indonesians have in their neighborhood ?
Are all these acquisitions for the Chinese or some other countries ? Never heard of any serious conflicts involving Indonesia.

 

[Indos]

There is no logic to Indonesia acquiring just 6 Rafales as the cost of infrastructure and maintenance will be enormous for such a small number of planes.

It may not go up to 42 but certainly a number of 18 is the minimum we are looking at here.

Yup, I am agree, repeat order is possible in next administration to complete the squadron until it has 16-18 planes. Current financial for 2020-2024 only enough for 6 planes order. The plane will come in next administration, Jokowi cannot run again and possibly our next President will not be Prabowo Subianto

 

[GriffinsRule]

Contrary to so many hype, the real contract for Rafale is just 6 planes, and it is actually similar with SU35 acquisition program that has been approved during Jokowi first administration. We let go SU35 acquisition which is also for 1.1 billion USD, so basically there is nothing new here and Jokowi needs to do his previous plan to fill our F 5 squadron with 6-16 planes since all of the fighters have been grounded

KF21/IFX is still going on as we speak, KF21/IFX head program from South Korea is in Jakarta now. I think getting Rafale will help also Indonesian Aerospace as it gets MRO engine OFSET from Safran. This also will make sure KF21/IFX ammunition for Indonesia since KF21/IFX also uses meteor.

The deal is part of big deal, like submarine building program in Indonesia, Rafale ammunition production in Pindad, and 120 mm and 105 mm MBT and Medium Tank ammunition production in Pindad Indonesia.

Others including cooperation between Thales and Indonesian company, PT LEN Industry in building Military Satellite.

In broad perspective it has geopolitical factor as Indonesia and French has become strategic partner, same like between Indonesia and South Korea where sensitive technology can be transferred.

You keep saying 6 planes but that makes even less sense. Which country buys half a dozen of one type, then another 10 of a different and then same for a third. Doesn't make any procurement sense and points to basically corruption. Why couldn't the handful of F-5s be replaced by F-26s already in service? And what's the future of Sukhois in Indonesia?