Flatten Gaza: Gilad Sharon

[Mercenary]

Quran
3:67 Abraham was not a Jew nor a Christian, but he was (an) upright (man), a Muslim; and he was not one of the polytheists.

3:65 O People of the Book, why do you dispute about Abraham, when the Torah and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Do you not understand?

Your clever uneducated mind, but you never read the Quran through in through or you take for granted that I haven't.

How exactly was Abraham a Muslim when Islam was revealed to Muhammad?

Islam is older then its title, all the Prophets were Muslims, remember? those who submit willingly got the title Muslim, weather they Prophets or not.

Please not this argument again.

Islam started with Prophet Muhammed.

All the Prophets were not Muslim.

They didn't pray 5 times a day, nor Hajj, and nor did they say the Kalma.

 

[(Bilal)]

How exactly was Abraham a Muslim when Islam was revealed to Muhammad?

Please not this argument again.

Islam started with Prophet Muhammed.

All the Prophets were not Muslim.

They didn't pray 5 times a day, nor Hajj, and nor did they say the Kalma.

The Quran refers to a element of Islam before the Torah and the Gospel was revealed, the goodness in human nature of course is older causing people to be just with other life forms in submission to Allah, having the meaning before the title.

30:30 So set thy face for religion, being upright, the nature made by Allah in which He has created men. There is no altering Allah’s creation. That is the right religion — but most people know not —

Your trying to prove the Quran wrong, thats your belief, I thought you were Muslim because your profile say you live in Pakistan, I gave you the Surah and verse, its up to you to believe or not.

 

[brahmin]

Yeah there army kills 11 months kids. No I don't want my army doing this sh!t.

You seem to be coward and eunuch of the same kind. Volunteer yourself for the IDF.

Just one or few kids that too in an air attack . In Pakistan the terrorists kill children and your army is not doing anything .

 

[500]

You expect sky scrapers in 1915? You intentionally put bad pictures

Tel Aviv in 1909:

Here what Mark Twain wrote in 1869 after a trip in Holy Land:

Nazareth is forlorn; about that ford of Jordan where the hosts of Israel entered the Promised Land with songs of rejoicing, one finds only a squalid camp of fantastic Bedouins of the desert; Jericho the accursed, lies a moldering ruin, to-day, even as Joshua's miracle left it more than three thousand years ago; Bethlehem and Bethany, in their poverty and their humiliation, have nothing about them now to remind one that they once knew the high honor of the Saviour's presence; the hallowed spot where the shepherds watched their flocks by night, and where the angels sang Peace on earth, good will to men, is untenanted by any living creature, and unblessed by any feature that is pleasant to the eye. Renowned Jerusalem itself, the stateliest name in history, has lost all its ancient grandeur, and is become a pauper village;

The noted Sea of Galilee, where Roman fleets once rode at anchor and the disciples of the Saviour sailed in their ships, was long ago deserted by the devotees of war and commerce, and its borders are a silent wilderness; Capernaum is a shapeless ruin; Magdala is the home of beggared Arabs; Bethsaida and Chorazin have vanished from the earth, and the "desert places" round about them where thousands of men once listened to the Saviour's voice and ate the miraculous bread, sleep in the hush of a solitude that is inhabited only by birds of prey and skulking foxes.

Palestine is desolate and unlovely. And why should it be otherwise? Can the curse of the Deity beautify a land? Palestine is no more of this work-day world. It is sacred to poetry and tradition--it is dream-land.

 

[RazPaK]

Islam started with Prophet Muhammed.

This guy is so stupid, it is worth the entertainment,

 

[500]

I'm an atheist too.

I was just curious, since I read somewhere that Jewish people were the founders of monotheism.

Most "native" religions around the world were originally polytheist. Nowadays of course, the majority of the world's population has become monotheist.

Well most of the Israelis are secular and dont care about religion. As for Judaism, according to it most important is actions and not beliefs.

@500:
You are a self-confessed 'atheist'?

I am just an atheist.

If you really are then you should know that in your above post #100 you are essentially saying that: 'Yes, there may have been people there but it was a backward area and we came and make it into a vibrant society'.

That is not the right way to move forward! I wish I had a time machine for us to go back to the mid 18-19th centuries and show similar kinds of arguments presented to justify actions against American Indians.

Since the beginning of Zionism in 1880, number of Arabs in Palestine grew over 13 times. For comparison, population of England grew only 2 times during the same period. Life standards also drastically improved and Palestinians live better than their neighbours around. Especially 1.6 million of Israeli Arabs.

My point that talking about history and stealing land is quite stupid thing, because if you dig history deeper u will fond someone else there.

I have a lot of admiration of Jews. I have a lot sympathy for their plight--mostly hurt by EUROPEAN CHRISTIANS

Jews in Arab countries also suffered a lot and were third class citizens.

but they need to either pull back to the 1967 borders or do an equitable land-swap for a Palestinian state. You don't do that then you are on notice.

I basically agree with that. Israel pulled out from entire Gaza and later in 2005 Israelis for withdrawal from 90+% of West Bank. But this plan was foiled because of increased rocket attacks from Gaza and Lebanon.

 

[JonAsad]

How exactly was Abraham a Muslim when Islam was revealed to Muhammad?



Please not this argument again.

Islam started with Prophet Muhammed.

All the Prophets were not Muslim.

They didn't pray 5 times a day, nor Hajj, and nor did they say the Kalma.

Hi-

Amantu comprises of the fundamentals of belief that every Muslim must believe, accept and approve.



There are 6 fundamentals of belief in Islam; they are as follows:



1. To believe in Allah, 2. To believe in His angels, 3. To believe in His books, 4. To believe in His prophets, 5. To believe the Day of Judgment (life after death), 6. To believe in destiny (qadar), that the good and the evil are from Allah.



The oral expression of Amantu is as follows:



Amantu billahi wa malaikatihi wa kutubihi wa rusulihi wal-yawmil-akhiri wa bil-qadari khayrihi wa sharrihi minallahi taala wal-ba’thu ba’dal-mawti haqqun ashhadu an la ilaha illallah wa ashhadu anna Muhammadan abduhu wa rasuluh.



Its meaning is as follows:



Amantu billahi: I believed in the existence and oneness of Allah, that He has no partners or counterparts, that He has all kinds of loftiness and that He is free of all kinds of deficiency.



Wa malaikatihi: I also believed in the angels of Allah.



Wa kutubihi: I also believed in the books of Allah.



Wa rusulihi: I also believed in the prophets of Allah.



Wal-yawmil-akhiri: I also believed in the Day of Judgment.



Wa bil-qadari khayrihi wa sharrihi minallahi taala: I also believed in the destiny, that everything that seems as good or evil to us take place through the knowledge, law and creation of Allah.



Wal-ba’thu ba’dal-mawti haqqun: I also heartily believed in life after death (and resurrection). All of them are true and right.



Ashhadu an la ilaha illallah wa ashhadu anna Muhammadan abduhu wa rasuluh: I witness that there is no god but Allah and I witness that Hazrat Muhammad is his slave and messenger.



The last sentence is called the word of Shahadah, that is, the sentence of witnessing.

If you are muslim- sorry to say you dont know even the very basics of Islams- and the guy who doesnt know the basics is a fool to argue with- tells alot about you-

and if you are not- then whats the point?-

 

[A1Kaid]

I honestly believe that if the Pakistan army, airforce and special forces unleash overwhelming firepower, violence and force against this bunch of deluded farmers dreaming of virgins, we can get rid of them once and for all.

This combined with a strong nationalistic (not religious) attitude with a Kemal Mustafa like revolution can turn this country around.

PA can flatten Waziristan, problem is not as simple as you think. The TTP are embedded in some areas of the tribal areas, unlike Gaza were Israel had a clear demarcated line and isolated area where they know where the attackers are; the case with the TTP is they are also difficult to identify sometimes. It's not like they are constantly firing rockets onto Pakistani cities.

Though I do agree with you PA has failed to eliminate the TTP, PA needs to level enemies in tribal areas. Tribal areas need to be properly governed and policed with the tribal structure disbanded. It would cost PA less money had they just finished the job in months not drag this thing on for years with the TTP. I understand NATO is still fighting Taliban for years too so destroying the TTP will require education of locals as well.

 

[(Bilal)]

This guy is so stupid, it is worth the entertainment,

Asalamualaikum brother