External debt, liabilities down by $1.3 billion in first half fiscal year 2015

[Finer]

But certainly you don't develop either with having a team of corrupt businessmen and money launderers running your country.

I think you are naive to the reality.

In idealistic world, no, but in real world, they do thrive despite of corruption, money laundering, tax evasion. In fact, the world also has the same problems. But as long as investments continue, and so will the world.

In realistic world:

A) Corrupt leaders don't wanna invest on Pakistan to build economical progressive society

B) Corrupter leaders [marginal or extreme] invests on Pakistan to build economical progressive society and has long-term vision to build

C) Non-Corrupt leader is yet to be discovered, although some claim to be non-corrupt judging by advertising in social media having been exposed to public on lack of economical visions for Pakistan while desperately trying to paint Pakistan as chaos nation through many tactics including issuing civil disobedience to derail the hard work progress built by people with hard-earned money to improvise the already-struggling economy of Pakistan. A self-claimed Non-Corrupt with empty rhetoric dialogues with nothing practical solution to offer except to get married

D) Non-Corrupt leader with long-term economical visions for Pakistan aka awaiting prophesied Danday Wali Sarkar in according many people in the past.

Pakistan has already dealt with A, but now replaced by B as we can witness numerous billion dollars projects involving energy, highways and more. Not to mention, Zarb-e-Azb mission against TTP and MQM Headquarter mission within in five years of PMLN government while apologetic party wanted to legalize TTP by encouraging governments, Zardari/Gillani in 2010 back then, to open the offices for TTP and sought the support of MQM for dharna recently.
I am less confident about C judging by progression in Peshawar, but that being said, i have faith on option D and B than C.

 

[WishLivePak]

But certainly you don't develop either with having a team of corrupt businessmen and money launderers running your country.

Dude accept you're wrong instead of stretching the argument.

You said no countries develop on external debt. Well, I gave you proof that MANY nations have.

So now you should admit your mistake and apologize for using abusive language.

 

[Orakzai]

Dude accept you're wrong instead of stretching the argument.

You said no countries develop on external debt. Well, I gave you proof that MANY nations have.

So now you should admit your mistake and apologize for using abusive language.

Where is the freaking proof???
Seriously???
Giving me links of countries borrowing how the hell does that makes it a proof of their development??
And can you show me a single project worth mentioning where all those $15 billion went???

 

[Orakzai]

I think you are naive to the reality.

In idealistic world, no, but in real world, they do thrive despite of corruption, money laundering, tax evasion. In fact, the world also has the same problems. But as long as investments continue, and so will the world.

In realistic world:

A) Corrupt leaders don't wanna invest on Pakistan to build economical progressive society

B) Corrupter leaders [marginal or extreme] invests on Pakistan to build economical progressive society and has long-term vision to build

C) Non-Corrupt leader is yet to be discovered, although some claim to be non-corrupt judging by advertising in social media having been exposed to public on lack of economical visions for Pakistan while desperately trying to paint Pakistan as chaos nation through many tactics including issuing civil disobedience to derail the hard work progress built by people with hard-earned money to improvise the already-struggling economy of Pakistan. A self-claimed Non-Corrupt with empty rhetoric dialogues with nothing practical solution to offer except to get married

D) Non-Corrupt leader with long-term economical visions for Pakistan aka awaiting prophesied Danday Wali Sarkar in according many people in the past.

Pakistan has already dealt with A, but now replaced by B as we can witness numerous billion dollars projects involving energy, highways and more. Not to mention, Zarb-e-Azb mission against TTP and MQM Headquarter mission within in five years of PMLN government while apologetic party wanted to legalize TTP by encouraging governments, Zardari/Gillani in 2010 back then, to open the offices for TTP and sought the support of MQM for dharna recently.
I am less confident about C judging by progression in Peshawar, but that being said, i have faith on option D and B than C.

B) Corrupter leaders [marginal or extreme] invests on Pakistan to build economical progressive society and has long-term vision to build
waowww waowwww waoowww man no wonder we are in this mess.

naive to the reality? by calling corrupt a corrupt and saying that they are the reasons of our downfall???
mate you are as naive as your leader and i can see that in your post. no wonder why we are in this mess that we have people like you and this other fellow who would blindly support their leaders and would even endorse their corruption.
let me tell you, we will be in the same shit even after 50 years if you don't cure corruption and don't stop endorsing and defending corrupt people.
i give you a simple example of south korea who copied our economic plan but look at them now and look at us. did it ever strike you as a surprise to find out the reason why they got developed and we on the other hand???

Pakistan has already dealt with A, but now replaced by B as we can witness numerous billion dollars projects involving energy, highways and more. Not to mention, Zarb-e-Azb mission against TTP and MQM Headquarter mission within in five years of PMLN government while apologetic party wanted to legalize TTP by encouraging governments, Zardari/Gillani in 2010 back then, to open the offices for TTP and sought the support of MQM for dharna recently.
I am less confident about C judging by progression in Peshawar, but that being said, i have faith on option D and B than C


now here what you have said i don't know if i should laugh at you or what??
i wouldn't want to start this debate of who is supporting TTP and who is supporting MQM and ringing them coz that would be another long discussion but i would really like to tap you on your forehead about kpk and peshawar.

if people of kpk wanted roads and flyovers we would have voted PMLN but no we wanted reforms in the rotten system of our province and the best option we had was PTI. they are not perfect but they were the best option among all others. Now if you haven't been to peshawar then i might ask you to before you say anything you should visit it and compare the governance of last 2 years to that of last 50 years before that. not saying everything has become perfect they aren't and they can never be in 2 years but they have changed a lot in a good way. Reforms in hospitals, police, education, patwari system has changed things a lot i would ask you to go there and witness them by urself.

 

[WishLivePak]

Where is the freaking proof???
Seriously???
Giving me links of countries borrowing how the hell does that makes it a proof of their development??
And can you show me a single project worth mentioning where all those $15 billion went???

You want a link as a proof where countries have developed through external debt? I have given to you already about US, UK and Europe.

I will give one again. In this, USA alone (ignoring other nations), gave loans of $160 billion for development of countries. It gave it for four years, so $40 billion loan a year. The proof is look at how developed UK, Germany, France and many countries have become. 1948-1952 is termed as fastest growth in history for Europe.

Marshall Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Read this for effects: Marshall Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now apologize.

 

[Finer]

B) Corrupter leaders [marginal or extreme] invests on Pakistan to build economical progressive society and has long-term vision to build
waowww waowwww waoowww man no wonder we are in this mess.

naive to the reality? by calling corrupt a corrupt and saying that they are the reasons of our downfall???
mate you are as naive as your leader and i can see that in your post. no wonder why we are in this mess that we have people like you and this other fellow who would blindly support their leaders and would even endorse their corruption.
let me tell you, we will be in the same shit even after 50 years if you don't cure corruption and don't stop endorsing and defending corrupt people.
i give you a simple example of south korea who copied our economic plan but look at them now and look at us. did it ever strike you as a surprise to find out the reason why they got developed and we on the other hand???

Pakistan has already dealt with A, but now replaced by B as we can witness numerous billion dollars projects involving energy, highways and more. Not to mention, Zarb-e-Azb mission against TTP and MQM Headquarter mission within in five years of PMLN government while apologetic party wanted to legalize TTP by encouraging governments, Zardari/Gillani in 2010 back then, to open the offices for TTP and sought the support of MQM for dharna recently.
I am less confident about C judging by progression in Peshawar, but that being said, i have faith on option D and B than C


now here what you have said i don't know if i should laugh at you or what??
i wouldn't want to start this debate of who is supporting TTP and who is supporting MQM and ringing them coz that would be another long discussion but i would really like to tap you on your forehead about kpk and peshawar.

if people of kpk wanted roads and flyovers we would have voted PMLN but no we wanted reforms in the rotten system of our province and the best option we had was PTI. they are not perfect but they were the best option among all others. Now if you haven't been to peshawar then i might ask you to before you say anything you should visit it and compare the governance of last 2 years to that of last 50 years before that. not saying everything has become perfect they aren't and they can never be in 2 years but they have changed a lot in a good way. Reforms in hospitals, police, education, patwari system has changed things a lot i would ask you to go there and witness them by urself.

Before you continue to embarrass yourself, let me give you short version why Pakistan is in turmoil.

Pakistan situation was stable during PMLN before Pervaiz Musharraf overtook him through illegal tactics and brought Marshall Law along with his controversial tactics/policies changed the fate of Pakistan forever. Not to mention, resigning from leadership in 2008 after having created a lot of messes with more aforemented messes for Pakistan to deal with; freeing Zardari only to leave Pakistan at the mercy of Zardari which only regressed Pakistan furthermore.

The mess Pakistan is in gonna take much while for its to recover, and it cannot be done overnight. We should appreciate some long-term investments that had never been done since the era of Pervaiz Musharraf, and here is the hoping his long-term investments and his economical policy yields fruitful for Pakistan as many cannot understand now probably lack of foresight which is understandable. The economical of Pakistan is slowly recovering, but Pakistan still has a lot more to do.

Holding major cities as hostage through dharna, issuing civil disobedience, almost provoking race war, having pro-stance of terrorist group like TTP, forcibly locking down the cities against their wills and blackmailing federal government to resign are not gonna help Pakistan, rather these are the signs of traitor undermining the progression of Pakistan, the stability of Pakistan, peace of Pakistan and most importantly, equality of Pakistan which the ideology of TTP contradicts the ideology of Pakistan big time, and guess which party has soft-corner for TTP?

Put your hatred aside, and support Pakistan for the sake of Pakistan. We don't need good looking leader, rather we need a leader with long-term economical vision plans for Pakistan, and we just got it now already seeing several positive signs in the short matter of time which was never witnessed during the era of Pervaiz Musharraf and Zardari, not even current era of Imran Khan in Peshawar.

Right now, Pakistan is in debt while already tangled with more debts, but in the future, those invested projects, once get started will start to stabilize the economy of Pakistan means more money for Pakistan in the future as well as sorting the loans they borrowed.

 

[I FLY HIGH]

so you are telling me that they got developed coz they borrowed money?
seriously???
and plus before PPP and PMLN in more then 50 years we had less then $36 billion of debt which has been almost doubled now in 7 years thanks to these incompetent masters/leaders of yours.

Musharraf era debt rose from 30billion to 45 billion $ while in Zardari regime it grew 45 to 61 billion $ during the last two years it is stagnant and varies from 61 to 63 billion USD . Basically no real increase in current govt , Pmln is not responsible for what Zardari or Musharraf did to our country , basically people voted for PPP in 2008 elections and they got the reward of it . Taste of the pudding is in eating .

 

[Shah01]

I am not sure why some people are arguing about this. I have looked at some figures but not sure how credible they are. By looking at the following chart I don't see an increase of $15bn over the last two years. It rose from about $61bn to $64bn. That is an increase of about $3bn.

Below I have copied the Foreign exchange reserves for the same period: I see the reserves rose from about $11bn to $13bn(maybe not up-to-date as I have heard it is gone up to $16bn).

Now if you net both of these figures then the Debt increase will almost be canceled out.

It will probably help to understand why government took out circa $15bn of loans. These loans were to pay back the loans already taken, in other words loans were rolled forward. People should look at these figures rationally rather then bash each others party/sect/race etc.

Furthermore there is no denying about the corruption but we are all part of this. Don't just blame the PM.... There is a great need for reforms but why not start at an individual level?

 

[Orakzai]

You want a link as a proof where countries have developed through external debt? I have given to you already about US, UK and Europe.

I will give one again. In this, USA alone (ignoring other nations), gave loans of $160 billion for development of countries. It gave it for four years, so $40 billion loan a year. The proof is look at how developed UK, Germany, France and many countries have become. 1948-1952 is termed as fastest growth in history for Europe.

Marshall Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Read this for effects: Marshall Plan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now apologize.

EVEN IF YOU HAVE A LITTLE BIT SENSE LEFT IN YOU READ THIS WHOLE ARTICLE AND GO TO SOME MOUNTAIN AND JUMP OFF THE CLIFF IF YOU STILL THINK THAT BORROWING MORE MONEY IS GOING TO HELP US.

Breaking debt prison | TNS - The News on Sunday

 

[WishLivePak]

EVEN IF YOU HAVE A LITTLE BIT SENSE LEFT IN YOU READ THIS WHOLE ARTICLE AND GO TO SOME MOUNTAIN AND JUMP OFF THE CLIFF IF YOU STILL THINK THAT BORROWING MORE MONEY IS GOING TO HELP US.

Breaking debt prison | TNS - The News on Sunday

So you won't admit your mistake.


You're one tough nut.

You said which country built on external debt and I told you Europe and USA. whine as much as you want, you were wrong. Now you just gonna cry more and more and not admit your guilt.

 

[Orakzai]

So you won't admit your mistake.


You're one tough nut.

You said which country built on external debt and I told you Europe and USA. whine as much as you want, you were wrong. Now you just gonna cry more and more and not admit your guilt.

mate did you even read this article?
i say it again NO COUNTRY HAS EVER been built on external debt. it might help a little bit in short term but debt does not built countries. we are bloody borrowing more money to pay off the interest only on the borrowed money not bloody for the big projects. this year alone were are bloody paying $5 billions in debt services and huge part of it will go in the interests which means we are paying off very little of the actually debt. our bloody Exports contracted 4.9 per cent in July-February period of current fiscal year, totalling $16.01 billion as per figures released by the Pakistan Bureau of Statistics (PBS) on March 10, 2015.
Our tax potential at federal level alone is about Rs7 trillion. According to Household Integrated Economic Survey (HIES) 2011-12 conducted by Pakistan Bureau of Statistics, 5 million individuals have annual taxable income of Rs1.5 million. If all of them file tax returns, income tax collection from them at the prevalent tax rates will be Rs1650 billion. If income tax collected from corporate bodies, other than non-individual taxpayers and individuals having income between Rs400,000 to Rs1,000,000 is added, the gross figure would not be less than Rs4500 billion — the FBR collected only Rs850 billion in 2013-2014.and you know why coz most of these big tycoons are either them or their mates.

if you have even a little bit of sanity and self esteem left in you then read this article which i doubt you have or you will coz you have sold your self esteem to the person who runs away like a rat whenever the country is in a mess. same as you if you think country is running perfect and everything is good then why the hell are you sitting outside the country?

 

[fjavaid]

Pak Govt. should focus on privatizing as soon as possible.

i agree ,.... all progressing countries hv privatized railways, air lines & all major industrial factions ......

 

[black-hawk_101]

i agree ,.... all progressing countries hv privatized railways, air lines & all major industrial factions ......

I don't know why Govt. is so much corrupt. They have to privatized all of the financial sector. And just keep State Bank of Pakistan and National Bank and privatize all. Privatize all of the industrial sector to local business men and also privatize PIA, Railways and PNSC 100% but don't privatize Port, Railway Stations and Air ports.

 

[WishLivePak]

mate did you even read this article?
i say it again NO COUNTRY HAS EVER been built on external debt. it might help a little bit in short term but debt does not built countries. we are bloody borrowing more money to pay off the interest only on the borrowed money not bloody for the big projects. this year alone were are bloody paying $5 billions in debt services and huge part of it will go in the interests which means we are paying off very little of the actually debt. our bloody Exports contracted 4.9 per cent in July-February period of current fiscal year, totalling $16.01 billion as per figures released by the Pakistan Bureau of Statistics (PBS) on March 10, 2015.
Our tax potential at federal level alone is about Rs7 trillion. According to Household Integrated Economic Survey (HIES) 2011-12 conducted by Pakistan Bureau of Statistics, 5 million individuals have annual taxable income of Rs1.5 million. If all of them file tax returns, income tax collection from them at the prevalent tax rates will be Rs1650 billion. If income tax collected from corporate bodies, other than non-individual taxpayers and individuals having income between Rs400,000 to Rs1,000,000 is added, the gross figure would not be less than Rs4500 billion — the FBR collected only Rs850 billion in 2013-2014.and you know why coz most of these big tycoons are either them or their mates.

if you have even a little bit of sanity and self esteem left in you then read this article which i doubt you have or you will coz you have sold your self esteem to the person who runs away like a rat whenever the country is in a mess. same as you if you think country is running perfect and everything is good then why the hell are you sitting outside the country?

Again, you're denying that European countries built on debt. It helped kick start their economy after WW2. They just paid their debt off recently too.

I'm gonna ignore rest of your nonsense considering they've been addressed multiple times, but you have poor reading skills.

Also learn to use commas. Reading your post was like reading class 1 student essay. Not sure how you possibly ended up in Australia. Even above Pakistani poster makes use of commas.

@Icewolf what an idiot I wasted my time with. 4 bloody times i gave him proof that Europe built on external debt in 100s of billions of dollars. He keeps denying it and goes on with his blab.

Sigh.

 

[Great Sachin]

If you take loan to buy food and to survive....you are poor and going be more poor

If you take loan to buy BMW or a House.....you are rich