Egyptian Armed Forces

[SipahSalar]

Don't try to justify your nonsense comment..you said yourself that the US can arm up to 50 Egyptian F-16s with the AMRAAM..What are you trying to justify now.. that you comment was intelligent or made any sense..

"That could be anywhere from 300-500 missiles"
Why didn't you tell this to yourself before making any irrelevant comment..?

There seems to be a lack of comprehension on your part. 200 F-16's armed with AMRAAMS > 50 F-16's armed with AMRAAMs. US cannot provide enough for 50 F-16's because EAF does not have 50, it has 200+.

Which part did you not understand? I can use google translate to translate it to arabic.

 

[The SC]

There seems to be a lack of comprehension on your part. 200 F-16's armed with AMRAAMS > 50 F-16's armed with AMRAAMs. US cannot provide enough for 50 F-16's because EAF does not have 50, it has 200+.

Which part did you not understand? I can use google translate to translate it to arabic.

Don't project you comprehension problems on others..Egypt can get Amraams for 50 fighter jets..and not for 200.. the US knows what is enough for 50 and what is enough for 200.. Stupid comments one after the other.. please leave this thread..or contribute with something relevant.. even just a picture is better than unthought of comments..

 

[Nahid]

HOW about buying SOME SLAMRAAM..........of course only for peachfull perposes only.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

But.... When Israel receive all of it's F-35s, it should be acceptable for USA to let us get the AMRAAM, RIGHT ???
I mean, to will help keep the strategic balance in the Middle East, which is what America actually wants, in addition to the most important goal of keeping the superiority of Israel. I mean, they probably won't let the gape between Israel and Egypt's Ari forces increase so much, I think.

But, generally... Why not get another big number of MIG-29M and MIG-35, may be SU-30 and SU-35, in addition also to more Rafale and going back to buying Mirage 2000 (May be the Emirate version)... Getting the JF-17 Block 3 (And may be investing in the program with China and Pakistan... I think we should probably be doing this already).

With a big number of F-16 (Some of them, or a lot of them are older blocks), Rafale, Mirage 2000, MIG-29M/35, SU-30 and SU/35, and may be an affordable fighter jet like the JF-17 or another Chinese jet fighter... we will be doing fine, not as good as we wish, but a very acceptable rate of introducing new jets to our Air Force.

I don't know, though.... Would the high price be our only problem if we wanted to buy, say only 12 or 16, Euro Fighter Typhoon ? Or, will we face another biased decision from the UK, deciding not to sell to us, to keep our Air Force power restricted ???

JF-17 Block III wouldnt be much affordable.
Even Block II is now at 35+ million a pop (minus spares n infra)... if we look at its export deals.

 

[SipahSalar]

Don't project you comprehension problems on others..Egypt can get Amraams for 50 fighter jets..and not for 200.. the US knows what is enough for 50 and what is enough for 200.. Stupid comments one after the other.. please leave this thread..or contribute with something relevant.. even just a picture is better than unthought of comments..

Hold on a sec ... Do you disagree that 200 F-16's with AMRAAMs would be more dangerous than 50?

the US knows what is enough for 50 and what is enough for 200

Sure they do. Is it a strange thing for you that military know how much ammunition their platforms need? Do you think EAF does not know how many MICA's it would need for its 36 Rafales? Why is it a strange concept for you?

 

[The SC]

Hold on a sec ... Do you disagree that 200 F-16's with AMRAAMs would be more dangerous than 50?


Sure they do. Is it a strange thing for you that military know how much ammunition their platforms need? Do you think EAF does not know how many MICA's it would need for its 36 Rafales? Why is it a strange concept for you?

Sorry buddy, you just seem to try turning everything upside down.. everything seems strange to you not to me..
I just told you..what you are trying to tell me.. just leave it at that please.. it seems like a vicious circle where you are trying to understand but with no avail..

HOW about buying SOME SLAMRAAM..........of course only for peachfull perposes only. View attachment 461010 View attachment 461011
View attachment 461012

That can be modified to work as the original air to air Amraam ..but that might be a good trick to get it..

 

[The SC]

 

[Ceylal]

A great parade...needs more colorful flags..and balloons...

 

[Gomig-21]

Would have made sense if EAF had 30-50 F-16's. But with 200+ F-16's, there's no way they would release the AMRAAMs. It would increase the capability of EAF threefold overnight.

That's actually a good point except they would probably fit them on a certain number of F-16s only because none of them are set up to fire the missile. They need software integration and probably in the older blk 32s that were upgraded to blk 40 would need hardware integration as well that was purposefully kept out of them.

This is the entire list that was delivered since 1982. They would probably only select the 20 blk 52s (there are actually 19 of them now since one of them crashed near the Libyan border) that were delivered in 2013 and maybe the 24 blck 40 that were delivered in 2000 for a total of 43. If they're in a good mood and add the previous 21 blk 40s then there would be 63 F-16s that can fire the AIM-120 provided all of those serial production platforms exist and none have crashed.

So either 43 or 63 F-16s to fire the AIM-120 would be perfectly sufficient.


Program Model Block Qty. Serials Delivered
Peace Vector I F-16A Block 15 34 9301/9334 1982-1983
F-16B Block 15 8 9201/9208 1982-1985
Peace Vector II F-16C Block 32 34 9501/9534 1986-1988
F-16D Block 32 6 9401/9406 1986-1987
Peace Vector III F-16C Block 40 35 9901/9935 1991-1995
F-16D Block 40 12 9801/9812 1991-1993
Peace Vector IV F-16C Block 40 34 9951/9984 1994-1995
F-16D Block 40 12 9851/9862 1994-1995
Peace Vector V F-16C Block 40 21 9711/9731 1999-2000
Peace Vector VI F-16C Block 40 12 9732/9743 2001-2002
F-16D Block 40 12 9863/9874 2001-2002
Peace Vector VII F-16C Block 52 16 9751/9766 2012-2013
F-16D Block 52 4 9821/9824 2012-2013

Consider what Pakistan got with the MLU upgrade of the 10 Jordanian F-16s and the 26 new F-16blck 52s, if I'm not mistaken (and certainly feel free to correct me if I'm wrong), the MLU and new delivery was for 500 AIM-120s for a total batch of 36 aircraft only. Am I right?

https://www.defenseindustrydaily.co...es-upgrades-weapons-for-pakistans-f16s-02396/

So if I'm not mistaken, 500 AMRAAMs for 36 Pakistani jets would be ideal for the EAF but I do believe the inventory in the EAF has additional units that are fit for the upgrade than Pakistan (this is hardly a penis measuring contest my friend, just laying out facts for discussion points) so the option to provide more is probably available to the EAF. Even if they limit the count to 500 missiles but allowed 60 jets to be able to fire them, that's perfectly fine.

Heck the first batch of 24 Rafales came with only 150 MICAs total. Not sure they'll be adding any more with the 2nd batch of 12, but for 36 Rafales I would want at least 300 MICAs. So even with those birds we're short-handed.

Let's hope the Russian will shower us with R-77s and eventually the EAF adds the R-27EP and that's why the EAF really has no choice but to go Chinese mode in developing something even at the risk of pissing off whomever. They need to be a lot more aggressive about acquiring the decent level of A2A threat at any cost than they already have.

BTW, they just singed a contract with CZ to co-manufacture those in Egypt. Sounds like they're really happy with them and we should see more in circulation. Even the EVO is getting more common.

They will hasten the AMRAAM delivery.. and Trump will fire anyone who said no before..

Trump just requested congress to pass the $1.3B aid package for fiscal year 2018 and huge news according to US embassy in Egypt that the Egyptian Military has signed the CISMOA in January of 2018! So why not pressure the US for that Viper upgrade on even just the 19 blk 52s for now?

@Frogman That would be a good way to slide in and if all goes well, add an additional 40 jets to the upgrade package the following year. There really is no reason now at all for the US to keep the missiles out of the EAF.

Oh and Bright Star has been scheduled again for this summer which is wild that they're having it in consecutive years. Usually it's every 2 years at the earliest.

 

[SipahSalar]

Consider what Pakistan got with the MLU upgrade of the 10 Jordanian F-16s and the 26 new F-16blck 52s, if I'm not mistaken (and certainly feel free to correct me if I'm wrong), the MLU and new delivery was for 500 AIM-120s for a total batch of 36 aircraft only. Am I right?

Pakistan ordered 60 MLUs. So the order of 500 AIM-120s was for our entire fleet of F-16s.

 

[Harpcore_lover]

That's actually a good point except they would probably fit them on a certain number of F-16s only because none of them are set up to fire the missile. They need software integration and probably in the older blk 32s that were upgraded to blk 40 would need hardware integration as well that was purposefully kept out of them.

This is the entire list that was delivered since 1982. They would probably only select the 20 blk 52s (there are actually 19 of them now since one of them crashed near the Libyan border) that were delivered in 2013 and maybe the 24 blck 40 that were delivered in 2000 for a total of 43. If they're in a good mood and add the previous 21 blk 40s then there would be 63 F-16s that can fire the AIM-120 provided all of those serial production platforms exist and none have crashed.

So either 43 or 63 F-16s to fire the AIM-120 would be perfectly sufficient.


Program Model Block Qty. Serials Delivered
Peace Vector I F-16A Block 15 34 9301/9334 1982-1983
F-16B Block 15 8 9201/9208 1982-1985
Peace Vector II F-16C Block 32 34 9501/9534 1986-1988
F-16D Block 32 6 9401/9406 1986-1987
Peace Vector III F-16C Block 40 35 9901/9935 1991-1995
F-16D Block 40 12 9801/9812 1991-1993
Peace Vector IV F-16C Block 40 34 9951/9984 1994-1995
F-16D Block 40 12 9851/9862 1994-1995
Peace Vector V F-16C Block 40 21 9711/9731 1999-2000
Peace Vector VI F-16C Block 40 12 9732/9743 2001-2002
F-16D Block 40 12 9863/9874 2001-2002
Peace Vector VII F-16C Block 52 16 9751/9766 2012-2013
F-16D Block 52 4 9821/9824 2012-2013

Consider what Pakistan got with the MLU upgrade of the 10 Jordanian F-16s and the 26 new F-16blck 52s, if I'm not mistaken (and certainly feel free to correct me if I'm wrong), the MLU and new delivery was for 500 AIM-120s for a total batch of 36 aircraft only. Am I right?

https://www.defenseindustrydaily.co...es-upgrades-weapons-for-pakistans-f16s-02396/

So if I'm not mistaken, 500 AMRAAMs for 36 Pakistani jets would be ideal for the EAF but I do believe the inventory in the EAF has additional units that are fit for the upgrade than Pakistan (this is hardly a penis measuring contest my friend, just laying out facts for discussion points) so the option to provide more is probably available to the EAF. Even if they limit the count to 500 missiles but allowed 60 jets to be able to fire them, that's perfectly fine.

Heck the first batch of 24 Rafales came with only 150 MICAs total. Not sure they'll be adding any more with the 2nd batch of 12, but for 36 Rafales I would want at least 300 MICAs. So even with those birds we're short-handed.

Let's hope the Russian will shower us with R-77s and eventually the EAF adds the R-27EP and that's why the EAF really has no choice but to go Chinese mode in developing something even at the risk of pissing off whomever. They need to be a lot more aggressive about acquiring the decent level of A2A threat at any cost than they already have.



BTW, they just singed a contract with CZ to co-manufacture those in Egypt. Sounds like they're really happy with them and we should see more in circulation. Even the EVO is getting more common.



Trump just requested congress to pass the $1.3B aid package for fiscal year 2018 and huge news according to US embassy in Egypt that the Egyptian Military has signed the CISMOA in January of 2018! So why not pressure the US for that Viper upgrade on even just the 19 blk 52s for now?

@Frogman That would be a good way to slide in and if all goes well, add an additional 40 jets to the upgrade package the following year. There really is no reason now at all for the US to keep the missiles out of the EAF.

Oh and Bright Star has been scheduled again for this summer which is wild that they're having it in consecutive years. Usually it's every 2 years at the earliest.

Egypt just signed CISMOA, I don't know what to say whether to support such a decision made by our command.

https://twitter.com/x/status/976567878735618050

 

[The SC]

BTW, they just singed a contract with CZ to co-manufacture those in Egypt. Sounds like they're really happy with them and we should see more in circulation. Even the EVO is getting more common.



Trump just requested congress to pass the $1.3B aid package for fiscal year 2018 and huge news according to US embassy in Egypt that the Egyptian Military has signed the CISMOA in January of 2018! So why not pressure the US for that Viper upgrade on even just the 19 blk 52s for now?

@Frogman That would be a good way to slide in and if all goes well, add an additional 40 jets to the upgrade package the following year. There really is no reason now at all for the US to keep the missiles out of the EAF.

Oh and Bright Star has been scheduled again for this summer which is wild that they're having it in consecutive years. Usually it's every 2 years at the earliest.

I had this feeling since Sisi's visit to Washington that everything will be alright in due time.. and luckily it was not that long.. I still remember Sisi and Air-force chief talking about the viper upgrade and the whole weapon package..like it was yesterday.. I was just convinced by instinct and mostly by insight..
As for the CISMOA, I think its time came, and whatever has to be kept confidential has been secured.. and the US will only have access to what it provides.. not a big price versus a 100 or so Viper upgrades with their AESA radars, the most recent electronic suites and avionics and obviously the AMRAAM..(but then the Meteor was coming anyway.. still both are better than just one).. and this is only a start to the opening of the US Ali Baba cave for Egypt.. with all what that might entail..ToT, Joint Ventures, R&D and more..

 

[Harpcore_lover]

I had this feeling since the Sisi's visit to Washington that everything will be alright in due time.. and luckily it was not that long.. I still remember Sisi and Air-force chief talking about the viper upgrade and the whole weapon package..like it was yesterday.. I was just convinced by instinct and mostly by insight..
As for the CISMOA, I think its time came, and whatever has to be kept confidential has been secured.. and the US will only have access to what it provides.. not a big price versus a 100 or so Viper upgrades with their AESA radars, the most recent electronic suites and avionics and obviously the AMRAAM..(but then the Meteor was coming anyway.. still both are better than just one).. and this is only a start to the opening of the US Ali Baba cave for Egypt.. with all what that might entail..ToT, Joint Ventures, R&D and more..

Is it gonna limit our capabilities or sovereignty or our ability to retaliate against isreal in a case of war, is it gonna harm our ability to respond or like regarding the Americans are they gonna know when we are going to conduct any operations?

 

[The SC]

Is it gonna limit our capabilities or sovereignty or our ability to retaliate against isreal in a case of war, is it gonna harm our ability to respond or like regarding the Americans are they gonna know when we are going to conduct any operations?

That won't be the case.. The communication cooperation can have its own channels and shared data links.. and those can be shut or set on different frequencies in case of an imminent threat.. and this concerns only the US made weapons..There are other agreements that infringe on sovereignty but Egypt did not sign them..
The main ones are:

- CISMOA
- BECA
- LSA


LSA refers to Logistics Support Agreement. This agreement would enable mutual exchange of logistics support, supplies and services (LSSS) between the defense forces of both countries


BECA refers to Basic Exchange and Cooperation Agreement for Geo-spatial Cooperation. This agreement would facilitate exchange of geospatial information between India and United States for both military and civilian use. Advantages for India United States calls these agreements as “foundational” in terms of cooperation of defense or sensitive technologies. US argues that these would enable technology transfer, logistics and seamless communication between military systems of the two countries

 

[Gomig-21]

The culprit to all the jamming in Sinai that has extended into Israel. South African built mobile jamming stations built by GEW Technologies of which apparently the Egyptian military has bought dozens of these units. These are different from the stations that were effectively jamming Al Jazeera signals in 2013 lol. Those are on a whole other level.

The really interesting part is how heavily invested the armed forces are in EW and jamming with a host of different platforms.

Egypt just signed CISMOA, I don't know what to say whether to support such a decision made by our command.

Only if the benefits outweigh the risks which should be the case.

Pakistan ordered 60 MLUs. So the order of 500 AIM-120s was for our entire fleet of F-16s.

Ah, ok. I thought the Falcon Star MLU package didn't include the AIM-120 weapons package and that was only with the order of the 36 the Blk 52's.