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DSA 2018: Pakistan in ‘primary level’ talks with Malaysia on JF-17

So what if it Mahathir is back?

Mahathir mentioned that Malaysia is currently 1 trillion Ringgit in debt.

The new government is going to go away with 6% percent consumption tax which will result in a lost of 40 Billion Ringgit in government revenue per year.

The new government promises to increase welfare spending, buying up privatized highway and not forgetting the 1mdb scandal which has to be cleaned up.

So tell me, how did u managed to rationalized the thought of Malaysia getting new jets when first they are already flying capable jets just as F18, SU30 and secondly, the Malaysia government is deep in debt.

Every Country has its debt, Even Saudi Arabia and China have debt of Hundreds of Billion Dollars and offcourse Pakistan also has its debts of more than 100 trillion Rupees.

The thing is that Debt is not an issue but its management is the issue. and the former Prime Minister of Malaysia was corrupt to its core and probably has more than $2 billion in offshore accounts.

it is being said that former Attorney General who was trying to investigate 1mdb and was sacked by Razak Najib met with Mahathir Muhammad before elections and it is being said that former premiership will be investigated for corruptions.

Su-30 and F-18 are expensive to run and maintain, and in coming years Malaysia's relationship with west will be affected because of investigation against najib and there are chances that it might effect the defence cooperation with west.

Most important thing is that even if JF-17 deal is signed today Malaysia does not need to pay all of the money today, from signature of deal to delivery of JF-17 will take 3-5 years. So Money can be arranged in that time frame.
 
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To the posters who think Malaysia will buy something - you understand nothing.

Comparing Iraq and Syria is strawman at best. Unlike previous Iraq and Syria, Malaysia government is a democratically elected government, although they have oil its production is capacity is meager as compared with Iraq. Lastly, Malaysia has no interest in making nuclear or biological weapons.

Malaysia military is small its located in SEA which is relatively safe with no war or conflict or even skirmish with its neighbor except for a small scale insurgency in recent year by the Sulu militants.

So i really wonder why would anyone compare Malaysia with Syria/Iraq. The naivety of this particular person is clear or his a troll.

I strongly believe so.
 
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Every Country has its debt, Even Saudi Arabia and China have debt of Hundreds of Billion Dollars and offcourse Pakistan also has its debts of more than 100 trillion Rupees.

The thing is that Debt is not an issue but its management is the issue. and the former Prime Minister of Malaysia was corrupt to its core and probably has more than $2 billion in offshore accounts.

it is being said that former Attorney General who was trying to investigate 1mdb and was sacked by Razak Najib met with Mahathir Muhammad before elections and it is being said that former premiership will be investigated for corruptions.

Su-30 and F-18 are expensive to run and maintain, and in coming years Malaysia's relationship with west will be affected because of investigation against najib and there are chances that it might effect the defence cooperation with west.

Most important thing is that even if JF-17 deal is signed today Malaysia does not need to pay all of the money today, from signature of deal to delivery of JF-17 will take 3-5 years. So Money can be arranged in that time frame.

Sigh, again no useful information. Doesnt read original post. Fixated with chest thumping.

Mahathir mentioned that Malaysia is currently 1 trillion Ringgit in debt.

The new government is going to go away with 6% percent consumption tax which will result in a lost of 40 Billion Ringgit in government revenue per year.

The new government promises to increase welfare spending, buying up privatized highway and not forgetting the 1mdb scandal which has to be cleaned up.

As mentioned, Malaysia is in huge amount of debt. Its debt structured is completely different from China. So dont lump everything together. Its quite obvious you have zero knowledge on this issue.

Whether or not Mahathir was corrupted or not is irrelevant.

Yes we all know Najib is being investigated. You dont have tell us things we all already know.

Why would Malaysia relationship with the west deteriorate especially when the new government is in? All the more the new government will work with the west to get all its money back. Your logic is inherently flawed.

The french and british are offering loans to Malaysia but Malaysia isnt biting.
 
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Sigh, again no useful information. Doesnt read original post. Fixated with chest thumping.



As mentioned, Malaysia is in huge amount of debt. Its debt structured is completely different from China. So dont lump everything together. Its quite obvious you have zero knowledge on this issue.

Whether or not Mahathir was corrupted or not is irrelevant.

Yes we all know Najib is being investigated. You dont have tell us things we all already know.

Why would Malaysia relationship with the west deteriorate especially when the new government is in? All the more the new government will work with the west to get all its money back. Your logic is inherently flawed.

The french and british are offering loans to Malaysia but Malaysia isnt biting.
Ok, if you think so..

we will see in 2 years..
 
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The below article pretty much says what Pakistani Posters are saying however Mr. Seesonic is hell bent to put childish claims forward claiming to know more than anybody. Article mentions similarity of engine being used in Mig-29 and JF-17 however Mr. Expert keep throwing SU30s and F18s.

https://thediplomat.com/2018/04/will-malaysia-buy-pakistans-jf-17-fighter-jet/
thediplomat_2015-11-13_14-52-06-386x257.jpg

Image Credit: Wikimedia Commons/Ramirez
Will Malaysia Buy Pakistan’s JF-17 Fighter Jet?
Pakistan has been in “primary talks” with Malaysia over the procurement of the JF-17 fighter jet.

thediplomat_2015-01-06_12-04-00-36x36.jpg

By Franz-Stefan Gady
April 17, 2018


Pakistan and Malaysia are purportedly engaged in preliminary talks over the possible procurement of an unknown number of Pakistan Aeronautical Complex/Chengdu Aerospace Corporation (PAC/CAC) JF-17 “Thunder” multirole fighter jets, a PAC official told IHS Jane’s at the Defense Services Asia (DSA) 2018 exhibition in Kuala Lumpur on April 16.

“We are aware of the potential requirements in Malaysia for cost-effective fighter aircraft,” the PAC official said. “There have been no serious talks but through government-to-government channels there have been what we can describe as primary level talks about the JF-17 program.”

Malaysia purportedly expressed interested in the JF-17 in 2015. However, reports that the Royal Malaysian Air Force (RMAF) was considering purchasing the aircraft were quickly publicly denied by the Malaysian defense ministry at the time.

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The RMAF initially intended to procure 18 new fighter jets to replace aging Mig-29 combat aircraft and supplement its fleet of twin-engine F/A-18D and Su-30MKM fighter jets. However, the acquisition program was shelved due to budgetary constraints in 2017.

Instead, the RMAF has reportedly been considering cheaper lightweight multirole fighters with a number of countries already positioning themselves for a future competitive bidding process. Next to Sweden’s JAS-39C/D Gripen, China’s J-10, and Russia’s Mig-35, the JF-17 would likely be the cheapest option for the RMAF.

The production of the JF-17 has been split up into three blocks: Block I, Block II, and Block III. Malaysia would receive the Block III variant of the aircraft with production slated to kick off in 2019. (50 Block I and 50 Block II aircraft have been produced so far with 12 more of the latter to be rolled out in 2018.)

The JF-17’s most advanced variant will feature various upgrades in comparison to the earlier versions “including Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar, which will replace the older Nanjing Research Institute of Electronic Technologies’ (NRIET) KLJ-7 X-band fire control radar, and a new electronic warfare system, among other things,” I summarized in 2017.

“Powered by a Russian designed but Chinese license-built Klimov RD-93 (a RD-33 derivative) turbofan engine, [the JF-17] can reportedly reach a top speed of up to Mach 1.6 and has an operational range of up to 1,200 kilometers without refueling,” I explained in previously. The fighter jet, featuring seven hardpoints, can be armed with a variety of weapons including air-to-air, air-to-surface, and anti-ship missiles.

What perhaps could make the JF-17 particularly attractive to the RMAF is that its engine is also in use in the Mig-29 and for which the service already has repair and maintenance facilities in place. This would further reduce overall operational cost of the new aircraft for the cash-strapped Malaysian military.
 
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The below article pretty much says what Pakistani Posters are saying however Mr. Seesonic is hell bent to put childish claims forward claiming to know more than anybody. Article mentions similarity of engine being used in Mig-29 and JF-17 however Mr. Expert keep throwing SU30s and F18s.

First my angle of attack has always been the economic aspect of the Malaysia government.

If you would had spent time reading my comments and have some sort of real understanding of the very economic situation of the government you wouldnt have said that.

Its quite obvious you have no understanding of the issue Malaysia government is facing and quoting article that doesnt addresses my concern, what you are doing is just mindless chest stumping.

In short your input is uneventful and i urge you to stop pretending like you know something by quoting some articles on why RMAF should get JF17. Just like the Indian government wants more Rafale but for the time being can they afford more? Or the Pakistan Naval definitely needs more modern frigate like 054A, can they afford?

You are the one that is childishly bringing in articles that brings no meaningful knowledge onto the discussion. Yes we all know RMAF needs new jet to replace the old ones dont tell us things we all already know.
 
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First my angle of attack has always been the economic aspect of the Malaysia government.

If you would had spent time reading my comments and have some sort of real understanding of the very economic situation of the government you wouldnt have said that.

Its quite obvious you have no understanding of the issue Malaysia government is facing and quoting article that doesnt addresses my concern, what you are doing is just mindless chest stumping.

In short your input is uneventful and i urge you to stop pretending like you know something by quoting some articles on why RMAF should get JF17. Just like the Indian government wants more Rafale but for the time being can they afford more? Or the Pakistan Naval definitely needs more modern frigate like 054A, can they afford?

You are the one that is childishly bringing in articles that brings no meaningful knowledge onto the discussion. Yes we all know RMAF needs new jet to replace the old ones dont tell us things we all already know.
1 - I didn't do any chest thumping, only pointed out what is the possibility IF Malaysian Govt wants to buy an aircraft
2 - Where did i deny the problem Malaysia is facing?
3 - Posting the articles from expert was only to tell you that why technically it makes sense to buy JF-17
4 - Nowhere i claimed that Malaysia will definitely buy JF-17, only the possibility because it makes sense

You can give yourself a self fellatio for all i care but do not speak as if you are Malaysian state minister !
 
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1 - I didn't do any chest thumping, only pointed out what is the possibility IF Malaysian Govt wants to buy an aircraft
2 - Where did i deny the problem Malaysia is facing?
3 - Posting the articles from expert was only to tell you that why technically it makes sense to buy JF-17
4 - Nowhere i claimed that Malaysia will definitely buy JF-17, only the possibility because it makes sense

You can give yourself a self fellatio for all i care but do not speak as if you are Malaysian state minister !

None of your points addresses the concern with the economic aspect of the country.

You seriously need to stop your childish rhetoric and come with our pointers on how should the Malaysia government fund this very purchase when the country is already deep in debt.

My argument can be seen with my previous posts.

YES WE ALL KNOW RMAF WANTS TO BUY NEW JETS.
I did not say you deny the problems Malaysia is facing.
Your articles are pointless because it doesnt addresses the economic aspect which is what i am doing.
I did not say you claimed that Malaysia will definitely acquire JF17.

So unless you have something new, something meaningful/insight. I urge you to stop repeating yourself like a broken record. gosh.
 
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First my angle of attack has always been the economic aspect of the Malaysia government.

If you would had spent time reading my comments and have some sort of real understanding of the very economic situation of the government you wouldnt have said that.

Its quite obvious you have no understanding of the issue Malaysia government is facing and quoting article that doesnt addresses my concern, what you are doing is just mindless chest stumping.

In short your input is uneventful and i urge you to stop pretending like you know something by quoting some articles on why RMAF should get JF17. Just like the Indian government wants more Rafale but for the time being can they afford more? Or the Pakistan Naval definitely needs more modern frigate like 054A, can they afford?

You are the one that is childishly bringing in articles that brings no meaningful knowledge onto the discussion. Yes we all know RMAF needs new jet to replace the old ones dont tell us things we all already know.
The news is premature and a lot can happen between now and signing of a contract. Malaysia is an island nation reliant on its natural resources and oil. However its environment has generally been peaceful so defence spending has been a low priority. I do think something might happen on the JFT front but it is still 2/3yrs away. So it is currently something worth keeping an eye on.
A
 
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The news is premature and a lot can happen between now and signing of a contract. Malaysia is an island nation reliant on its natural resources and oil. However its environment has generally been peaceful so defence spending has been a low priority. I do think something might happen on the JFT front but it is still 2/3yrs away. So it is currently something worth keeping an eye on.
A

Agree. Nothing concrete.
 
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The news is premature and a lot can happen between now and signing of a contract. Malaysia is an island nation reliant on its natural resources and oil. However its environment has generally been peaceful so defence spending has been a low priority. I do think something might happen on the JFT front but it is still 2/3yrs away. So it is currently something worth keeping an eye on.
A
They are currently trying to upgrade their existing fleets- the JF-17 will have to actually prove its value as either a potential replacement for their now obsolescent Mig-29 fleet versus an upgrade for them, then prove its value against any replacement aircraft that may be pitched that provides the military ETOPS equivalent assurance with twin engines that cater to the island nature of Malaysia.

Finally, it has to fighter off already active political and diplomatic lobbies. Rest(uneasy) assured that includes our venomous neighbors and our frenemy too.
 
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They are currently trying to upgrade their existing fleets- the JF-17 will have to actually prove its value as either a potential replacement for their now obsolescent Mig-29 fleet versus an upgrade for them, then prove its value against any replacement aircraft that may be pitched that provides the military ETOPS equivalent assurance with twin engines that cater to the island nature of Malaysia.

Finally, it has to fighter off already active political and diplomatic lobbies. Rest(uneasy) assured that includes our venomous neighbors and our frenemy too.
Yep! As I said the news is premature. But the good thing is it is being considered. I think it certainly has potential as an economical work horse although it is single engined which might be perceived as a problem for an island nation. That is all one can say at this moment.
A
 
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Their main threats are Singapore and Thailand in Western Malaysia, which is mainly not an island topography. Eastern Malaysia is highly underdeveloped, and unlike Western Malaysia. Even then, Sabah and Sarawak are part of among the largest islands in the world, Borneo. No MiG-29s or F-18s can fly from eastern to Western Malaysia. The minor area where maritime questions can arise are in Eastern Malaysia's issues with the Spratly islands.

So this issue of "twin engines" is really a fake one. But probably one being used by the US lobby.
 
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