Does Pakistan need whole Indian occupied Jammu and Kashmir region?

[PakhtunGuy]

We just want wishes of Kashmiries rather then any region. In1999 & 2001 two Pakistani government proposed 5 plans, to finish this issue. But problem is India is not interested in Peace.

First atleast start discussion, some solution will appear automatically, and something good for Kashmiri people will come up. You want to keep issue open, how exactly problem is going to resolve?

Yes every Pakistani wishes peace for Kashmiris and a solution for that unnecessary war.
In my opinion no military operation is needed but rather elections are needed.

Pakistani, Chinese and Indians soldiers have to leave Kashmir region and people of Kashmir region have to make elections with 4 possibilities:

1. Join Pakistan
2. Join China
3. Join India
4. Independence

Since Kashmir region is a multi ethnic state, elections would lead to Kashmir region's partition.

I look ahead as these results:

1. Azad Kashmir will become part of Pakistan
2. Gilgit Baltistan will become part of Pakistan
3. Kashmir Valley will either become part of Pakistan or an independent state
4. Aksai Chin will become part of China or an independent state
5. Ladakh will become part of China or an independent state.
6. Jammu will become part of India or an independent state.

Clearly need more of occupied Kashmir than what OP's suggested.

The Western Rivers traverse a large portion of Jammu, after originating from Himachal in India and Tibet in China, before entering into Pakistan. Integrating occupied Jammu and Kashmir into Pakistan is less of a political exercise and more of a battle for existence. Although India has, to some extent thusfar, observed its part of the Indus Water Treaty, it has intermittently threatened to choke Pakistan of its water supply and, therefore, the issue of Kashmir will remain a perennial flashpoint unless and until the large majority of it is handed over to Pakistan, particularly the valleys which the Indus and the Jhelum run through.

So does the Indus River start in Tibet or does the Indus river start in Sindh?

But yes water issues could be one reason for claiming whole Kashmir region.

 

[Bang Galore]

Pakistanis should ideally be worried about saving the territory that they have right now. But no point telling them that.

Funny isn't it that in a crazy thread like this, you are the one who got a negative rating.

 

[PakhtunGuy]

The problem right now, is that a majority of Kashmiris don't want to join Pakistan. The Kashmir valley wants freedom but Jammu and Ladakh want to stay with India. So, at least for now, it doesn't seem like Pakistan is going to end up with any more of Kashmir than it already has.

Well free elections are needed to prove that.

Only one solution of Kashmir is possible currently ie. conversion of LOC in International border...may be in Future by looking at current path of Pakistan as a country,India will claim the so called Azad Kashmir to establish Akhand Kashmir.

Wishful thinking.

 

[TheFlyingPretzel]

So does the Indus River start in Tibet or does the Indus river start in Sindh?

But yes water issues could be one reason for claiming whole Kashmir region.

The Indus river originates in Ngari on the Tibetan Plateau after which it flows through occupied northern Kashmir before finally finding its way into Pakistan. Here's a simple map to help illustrate the foregoing.

 

[PakhtunGuy]

The Indus river originates in Ngari on the Tibetan Plateau after which it flows through occupied northern Kashmir before finally finding its way into Pakistan. Here's a simple map to help illustrate the foregoing.

This looks like Indus river flows from tibet to Ladakh and then to Gilgit Baltistan.

 

[queerbait]

What Pakistan needs and what Pakistan gets are two very different things.

 

[illusion8]

 

[Fracker]

The Indus river originates in Ngari on the Tibetan Plateau after which it flows through occupied northern Kashmir before finally finding its way into Pakistan. Here's a simple map to help illustrate the foregoing.

Water based separation, then Chanab Formula can get into effect, proposed 1962 by UN..

Religious groups: Indian-administered Kashmir

REGION
Buddhist Hindu Muslim Other
Kashmir Valley - 4% 95% -
Jammu - 66% 30% 4%
Ladakh 50% - 46% 3%

Religious groups: Pakistani-administered Kashmir

REGION
Buddhist Hindu Muslim Other
Northern Areas - - 99% -
Azad Jammu & Kashmir- - 99% -


PS: But again, any solution can't come up without dialogues

 

[TheFlyingPretzel]

This looks like Indus river flows from tibet to Ladakh and then to Gilgit Baltistan.

Yes. Therefore Ladakh is an important part of Kashmir for Pakistan. While on the subject allow me to bring our attention to the river Jhelum which originates from Verinag in occupied Jammu and Kashmir. The river Chenab originates in Himachal Pradesh, India and it, too, then passes through Jammu before snaking its way into Punjab. It is evident that occupied Kashmir in its entirety is sacrosanct for Pakistan's water security

 

[Shahmir]

In Ladakh there live the Ladakh people who are Sino Tibetan and are mainly buddhists.
In Jammu there live the Dogras, who are some kind of punjabi/mongolian mixture, who are mainly hindus.

This is a big lie from india and indians, Ladakh is 50 % muslim majority (areas of Kargil and Dras) and 50 % Bhuddist (Leh area).

 

[TheFlyingPretzel]

Water based separation, then Chanab Formula can get into effect, proposed 1962 by UN..

Easier said than done - Considering India's already started damming the Western Rivers on its side. Case in point: Kishanganga.

The more dams it builds the more difficult any lasting river-based solution becomes.

 

[Shahmir]

Jammu and Kashmir is a multi ethnic state.

In Jammu there live the Dogras, who are some kind of punjabi/mongolian mixture, who are mainly hindus.

This is also wrong, "Jammu division" is 65 % hindu (jammu, udhampur, kathua) and 35 % muslim (kishtwar, poonch, rajauri).

 

[PakhtunGuy]

This is a big lie from india and indians, Ladakh is 50 % muslim majority (areas of Kargil and Dras) and 50 % Bhuddist (Leh area).

Thats possible. Are the muslims of Ladakh also Sino Tibetan people or something else?
Maybe Ladakh can become independent country to secure water from indus river.

This is also wrong, "Jammu division" is 65 % hindu (jammu, udhampur, kathua) and 35 % muslim (kishtwar, poonch, rajauri).

I said "mainly" not "all of them". 35% Muslim is a minority.

 

[Joeblow]

Well free elections are needed to prove that.

I based my comment on a very comprehensive poll conducted by Peace Polls. The results are still available on their website. Every area you mentioned except gilgit-baltistan was included in the polls. Take a look at it. The polls reflect almost exactly what you wrote in your original post except Kashmir valley wants independence, followed by autonomy, followed by Indian administration and lastly Pakistani administration. Overall, 74% of Kashmiri and 69% of the Kashmiri valley residents don't want to join Pakistan.

 

[Shahmir]

Thats possible. Are the muslims of Ladakh also Sino Tibetan people or something else?
Maybe Ladakh can become independent country to secure water from indus river.



I said "mainly" not "all of them". 35% Muslim is a minority.

They are mix of tibetan, kashmiris and gilgitis.