Discussion: Is Pakistan's economy failing because it is not a secular nation?

[El Sidd]

14 vs 44.

Not even a contest.

Thus, God is punishing Pakistan for its hypocrisy in the hope that Pakistanis will repent. I pray for Pakistan that it will repent to Jesus and become followers of Christ so that you may have both spiritual and worldly success, but still waiting on you all.

If God is punishing Pakistan, why should they repent to Jesus? Shouldn't they repent to God?

 

[TheSolution]

seriously are you willing to enforce Islam as the law of the land ? I thought the Taliban was bad

Firstly, this conversation is not for Pajeets to interject, but I will entertain your question

Secondly, my stance is clear, I prefer the current system as is but ammendments of religious institutions with greater regulation and quality. And a strict policy against the preaching of pan-Islamism and extremism (Khawarij).

Thirdly, the majority of Pakistan is Muslim, if that was to be the case, there would be nothing wrong with it. We are an over 95% Muslim nation.

14 vs 44.

At least a third of those votes pro-secularism will be from Pajeets too lol

 

[El Sidd]

At least a third of those votes pro-secularism will be from Pajeets too lol

Is Pakistan's economy failing because it is not a secular country?​

• 
  

• Yes​

  Votes: 15 25.4%
  • hembo
  • Enigma SIG
  • jbond197
  • Menace2Society
  • Azadkashmir
  • uzbi aka viper
  • knightmare
  • migflug
  • TSA321
  • Farhan Bohra
  • kris
  • VkdIndian
  • Princeps Senatus
  • nope
  • Pranaayam

 

[TheSolution]

Is Pakistan's economy failing because it is not a secular country?​

• 
  

• Yes​

  Votes: 15 25.4%
  • hembo
  • Enigma SIG
  • jbond197
  • Menace2Society
  • Azadkashmir
  • uzbi aka viper
  • knightmare
  • migflug
  • TSA321
  • Farhan Bohra
  • kris
  • VkdIndian
  • Princeps Senatus
  • nope
  • Pranaayam

How did you check it?

LOL I was right, half of those guys or more are Indians

 

[El Sidd]

How did you check it?

LOL I was right, half of those guys or more are Indians

Click on the vote options. It will show up

 

[PanzerKiel]

@PanzerKiel will not indulge in politics or offer an opinion. He's pretty strict with this rule. Though he can change his mind, he's walked a straight line so far.

To put it simply, I don't know much about politics because that's not my area of interest. That's why I don't write on it. Moreover, I am paid to do something else, and ethics demand that I should be good at only that.... In my case, protecting the physical borders of my country.

But imo state ideology affects the soldier the most. After all, it’s the soldier who fights and dies for the state and to protect it and its ideology.

A little bit yes. Religion much more, in my case at least.

 

[Indos]

The real issue has also been Pakistani leaders, many in the past would make public speeches saying Pakistan is the protector of Islam, the home of Muslims, jihad etc, yada yada yada.

These idiots focused more on "Muslim" than "Pakistani" - no shit the next person that comes along who they perceive as more Muslim, they will be ready to fight against Pakistan on his orders.

Muslim is just a characteristic of what you are, not the primary thing. It should be Pakistani Muslim.

They made people suck up to every single country that was Muslim with their pan-Islamist rubbish to the point people were fighting against Pakistan for some goat fuckers in Afghanistan who had been blowing Pakistanis up for decades.

You don't see this in any other Islamic countries, they follow their religion and run the state - but these leaders installed extremism at a state level which was then preached at a societal level to uneducated kids and teens who were manipulated by terrorist.

They cared more about some pan-Islamist extremism than actually caring about Pakistan and living a good life as a Muslim, and this is partially due to the state and its leaders.

Let Islam be what Islam is, a lifestyle and values we follow, and let Pakistan be what it is, our country. Stop pushing this macho Pan-Islamist protector vibe down everyone's throats because it breeds inferiority complex slave mentality, and people will fight against Pakistan with the next person who comes along to brainwash them as being more "Muslim".

What Pakistan was doing during USSR occupation in Afghanistan as I said in my previous post is not something identic to Pakistan. To be clear here, Muslim nations and Christian majority nations (USA and NATO) are ally during cold war.

The bad policy only happened when Afghanistan were already free, they fought each other. Pakistan should stay away. The fact is many believe Pakistan ISI is helping Taliban which made what we see Today in Afghanistan

As I posted, Indonesia also lost many of his soldiers life during that period to fight Communism within our region. In East Timor we invaded the country and also helping Malaysia fight their Communist insurgence in Serawak.

Talking about self interest here, any good development happening on each Muslim majority country is something good for Muslim world. Nothing wrong with serving self interest, that is not against Islam at all as long as we dont become trouble maker like what Indonesia did to Malaysia during 1960's

Pakistani should focus on developing its own nation, if you gets stronger, all Muslim will be happy since you will be able to defend your country against India.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@Indos Bro

Pakistani should focus on developing its own nation, if you gets stronger, all Muslim will be happy since you will be able to defend your country against India.

Your country can help Pak in the process. Pak's main weakness is that it has a huge CAD- mainly because it is deficient in oil, gas, coal and cooking oil. If your country can supply Pak free of cost, Pak will become a mighty power. Surely, you wouldnt mind helping a brotherly Muslim nation out?

Regards

 

[TheSolution]

What Pakistan was doing during USSR occupation in Afghanistan as I said in my previous post is not something identic to Pakistan. To be clear here, Muslim nations and Christian majority nations (USA and NATO) are ally during cold war.

The bad policy only happened when Afghanistan were already free, they fought each other. Pakistan should stay away. The fact is many believe Pakistan ISI is helping Taliban which made what we see Today in Afghanistan

As I posted, Indonesia also lost many of his soldiers life during that period to fight Communism within our region. In East Timor we invaded the country and also helping Malaysia fight their Communist insurgence in Serawak.

Talking about self interest here, any good development happening on each Muslim majority country is something good for Muslim world. Nothing wrong with serving self interest, that is not against Islam at all as long as we dont become trouble maker like what Indonesia did to Malaysia during 1960's

Pakistani should focus on developing its own nation, if you gets stronger, all Muslim will be happy since you will be able to defend your country against India.

Pakistan took the pan-Islamism way too far which started leaning into extremism and Al-Q ideology where they would even fight against their own state.

Pakistan needs to stop entertaining the idea of pan-Islamism.

Religion should be spoken about in terms of society and our societal values only, the focus should be more on Pakistan as a nation and the national identity.

It is the constant pan-Islamist preaching by the national leaders and media which fostered extremism, alongside the unregulated madrassas.

Unfortunately we share a massive border with Afghanistan and we hosted the mujahideen camps and many Afghan fighters went on to preach at madrassas...

But I think the political system itself in terms of religion is fine. The line in the constitution which says we follow the Quran and Sunnah, and also naming it the Islamic Republic satisfies everyone. Because we can also democratically add or remove laws and there is no strict authoritarian enforcement of anything, just encouragement or discouragement.

It's just state narrative building and regulation of institutions which is failing here.

 

[Indos]

Pakistan took the pan-Islamism way too far which started leaning into extremism and Al-Q ideology where they would even fight against their own state.

Pakistan needs to stop entertaining the idea of pan-Islamism.

Religion should be spoken about in terms of society and our societal values only, the focus should be more on Pakistan as a nation and the national identity.

It is the constant pan-Islamist preaching by the national leaders and media which fostered extremism, alongside the unregulated madrassas.

Unfortunately we share a massive border with Afghanistan and we hosted the mujahideen camps and many Afghan fighters went on to preach at madrassas...

But I think the political system itself in terms of religion is fine. The line in the constitution which says we follow the Quran and Sunnah, and also naming it the Islamic Republic satisfies everyone. Because we can also democratically add or remove laws and there is no strict authoritarian enforcement of anything, just encouragement or discouragement.

It's just state narrative building and regulation of institutions which is failing here.

Muslim nations have already been working on in OIC and Islamic Development Bank. Rich Gulf countries are helping Pakistan as well during this difficult time by providing some loans as we know with Saudi and UAE soft loan to Pakistan.

Indonesia foreign aids will be focused on Afghanistan as stated by our foreign minister, this will help Pakistan as well indirectly.

Indonesia also has build International Islamic Universities and give many scholarships to many students from Muslim countries to fight against those ISIS/AQ/TTP version of Islam.

We are still pressuring Israel when we have the chance to do so. Muslim countries are helping Palestine in many ways which is mostly unreported by media.

Muslim countries are connected each other. As long as we act normally and supportive to each other, this is something that can strengthen ourselves, not liability for Pakistan or Indonesia. Like what we see during Ukraine-Russian war, Western countries are helping Ukraine. We also see similar thing in Afghan war and Bosnian war

 

[Menace2Society]

How did you check it?

LOL I was right, half of those guys or more are Indians

It is in India's interest to keep Pakistan radicalized. That's why they funneled money to TTP and I am sure many other extremist organisations across Pakistan.

Just like how RSS benefits Pakistan.

 

[VCheng]

it is an issue with people not Islam.

Any religion can only be what its followers can actually do, not what they can claim. That is why I would go as far as to suggest that religions that cannot adapt to changing times tend to have such issues. After all, Islam built into itself the mechanisms to keep it relevant despite such changes only highlights further the failures of its followers to adapt.

Relevant to this thread, I can trust the people of Pakistan to make an utter hash of anything that can be shown to have worked elsewhere, and destroy themselves as utter failures under any system they might care to get.

 

[villageidiot]

threat of jail is a good motivator.

Islam khatre me he.

Any govt attempting to do that must be wary of running afoul and being guilty of toheen-e-mullah, the worst form of blasphemy.

 

[Imran Khan]

lets make a mullah gov and economy will pass USA as its in afghanistan

 

[Menace2Society]

Islam khatre me he.

Any govt attempting to do that must be wary of running afoul and being guilty of toheen-e-mullah, the worst form of blasphemy.

The only reason political/radicalized Islam was introduced was to consolidate power after Jinnah died. Who took over Pakistan after his death? That should give the source of the perversion of our character.