Disapproval of Turkiye

[muse]

EU disapproval of Turkey
By Shada Islam | From the Newspaper
Yesterday

TURKISH Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan may be a hero in Egypt, Tunisia and other Arab nations desperate for a charismatic leader to steer a new democratic course for the region, but here in Brussels and other European capitals, policymakers are watching the Turkish leader with an anguished mixture of envy and anger.

The contrast in views is stark: Mr Erdogan received a rock star welcome in Cairo where activists, women and the media have been all praise for Turkey’s pro-Palestinian stand and the Turkish leader’s virulent criticism of Israel. In Brussels, there is no celebration of the ‘new’ Turkey or recognition that Ankara could play a much-needed constructive role in bringing stability to an increasingly volatile region.

Instead, there is a palpable air of disapproval as Turkey-watchers wrinkle their nose at what some describe as Ankara’s ‘upstart’ foreign policy, especially in the Middle East. Several German members of the European Parliament, in fact, have voiced scepticism of Turkey’s efforts to establish itself as a regional power, accusing Ankara of playing the ‘anti-Israel’ card to make friends in the Arab street. Petulant? Yes, certainly. Germany — along with France — remains adamantly against Turkish membership of the European Union. But many EU diplomats are equally wary of Mr Erdogan’s growing popularity in the Muslim world and Turkey’s regional clout.

The envy is not surprising. Even as Erdogan declared in Cairo, that recognition of a Palestinian state was “not an option but an obligation”, the 27 EU member states were, once again, divided over whether or not to accept Palestine as a non-voting UN member. Europe’s rift over Palestine — Germany, Poland and the Netherlands are against recognition, France, Spain and Britain will probably vote in favour — is another blow to the bloc’s credibility as a global player. As Europe’s reputation takes another hammering in the Middle East, Turkey is standing ever taller as a secular Muslim nation, committed to democracy and economic reform.

Wherever I am, the question is always the same: why is the EU so opposed to Turkish membership? Is it really about fear of Islam? The short answer is yes. The longer one is more complicated. The EU has for years looked down at Turkey as a poor, struggling nation, with a weakness for military coups, a tendency to repress its Kurdish minority, unable to find its way through the many obstacles standing in the way of its entry into the elite European club.

Europeans got accustomed to placing the membership barrier higher and higher. The EU’s annual report on Turkey has traditionally been an embarrassing compendium of criticism and complaints, with EU officials unable, or unwilling, to differentiate between Ankara’s serious deficits and its struggle to ensure change and reform. Turks are the first to recognise that their country still has a long way to go in meeting European standards in a number of areas, including human rights. But what they would like is public EU acknowledgment of how just how far their country has come in a short time. They are not going to get it. Most European leaders are reluctant to say publicly that there really isn’t room in Europe for a Muslim nation as big, as powerful and as proud as Turkey.

More reasonable people admit that Turkish membership would have a positive impact on Europe’s declining birth rate and speed up the bloc’s economic growth. With its large army, Turkey would also help boost Europe’s military clout. But even the most pro-Turkey Europeans say they are concerned about the rising power of conservative Islam in the country. Mr Erdogan, meanwhile, has made clear that while he will continue to try and meet EU membership criteria, he also sees Turkey as a role model for the rest of the Muslim world.

His much-reported North African tour during which he was greeted with rapturous enthusiasm, included a rallying call for recognition of a Palestinian state. Addressing Arab foreign ministers, Erdogan said the recognition of a Palestinian state is an ‘obligation’ and reiterated strained ties with Israel would not improve unless the Jewish state apologises over the death of nine Turks killed in a raid on an aid flotilla last year. “It is time for the flag of Palestine to be hoisted at the United Nations,” he said.

Erdogan “is a man who has leadership qualities, inspiring to those around him”, wrote columnist Moataz Abdel Fatah in the independent daily Al Shorouk. “We need someone like him … strong, with experience, trustworthy, honest and who respects laws and the constitution,” Abdel Fatah said. “Lend us Erdogan for a month!” wrote columnist Mohammed Amin in the liberal daily Al Wafd.

That’s definitely not the opinion in Europe. As Spiegel Online reported recently, among high-profile politicians in the European Parliament, criticism of Erdogan is growing. According to the website, Elmar Brok, the foreign policy spokesman for the parliamentary group of the conservative Christian Democrats in the European Parliament, said he is sceptical of Turkey’s efforts to establish itself as a regional power within the Arab world. Mr Erdogan was seeking to transform Turkey into a regional power similar to the status it held “earlier with the Ottoman Empire”, said Mr Brok.

Alexander Graf Lambsdorff, a member of the European Parliament with the business-friendly Free Democratic Party (FDP) said he also viewed the shift in foreign policy course by the Turkish government as a sign that Ankara’s EU ambitions are waning. “With a strident anti-Israel course, it isn’t making any friends in Europe” right now, Mr Lambsdorff said. Mr Erdogan, however, is unlikely to be paying attention to such Euro-sniping. The Arab Spring breezes are much warmer than the cold wind blowing through the EU’s corridors of power.

The writer is Dawn’s correspondent in Brussels.

 

[Leader]

good.......

 

[BordoEnes]

Couldnt care less.....

 

[RedBeard]

Good if Europeans arnt happy, that means Erdogan is doing a fine job and we are on the right path!

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

well so much for "European union"


a common currency and open borders and preferential trade didnt stop Greece, Portugal and Ireland from becoming bankrupt and being forced to enact austerity measures......


85% of the EU is Germany and France -- the 2 big daddies.

If i were Turk, i would welcome the news. Turkiye should exploit its strategic location on the map and form a seperate union; something along the lines of the ECO.

it will be important for Turks -- seculars, moderates and Islamists --to remain united at all times. They are a role model in my opinion for a country like Pakistan.


our future, our growth --- lies in looking EAST.


NOT WEST

 

[Developereo]

Most European leaders are reluctant to say publicly that there really isn’t room in Europe for a Muslim nation as big, as powerful and as proud as Turkey.

The Turks are finally realizing that the EU hes been stringing them along. They will NEVER admit Turkey into the EU, yet Serbia is almost a member!

We need to work for a strong Muslim/Asian power block. Make the Europeans understand their fatal mistake in letting themselves be controlled by a handful of fanatical Zionists in their media. Remember, in a democracy, the media is the real power, and Western media is completely dominated by hardcore anti-Muslim Zionists.

 

[ovarel]

The Turks are finally realizing that the EU hes been stringing them along. They will NEVER admit Turkey into the EU, yet Serbia is almost a member!

The term of finally realizing is not correct. Everyone knows that they wouldnt let a nearly 80m populated muslim country. Since countries are represented in the parliament in extent of their population,think about the possible power of Turkey in European Parliament. Would they let a muslim nation to run the EU? Of course,not.

But keeping this so called process going on helps us to put the army in its place. Meanwhile,we dont let the EU to go beyond our red lines,such as Cyprus and Aegean Sea.

Btw,i agree that the East is rising but lets not forget that western powers will still have a massive impact on the new world order. Categoric anti-westernism is not something i find logical.

A muslim bloc is inevitable and it is what im looking forward to see,but it will take time.

 

[Kompromat]

EU must not include Turkey , it would be an opportunity missed for Asia. Time to forget the hegemonic EU which was designed to benefit Germans and French.

EU is going to fall apart soon , now they look in shock and awe , Turkey becoming the 2nd fastest growing economy in the world , with the youngest population in Europe and its growing wings in the middle east and in the Muslim world.

Turkey doesn't need EU.

 

[VelocuR]

Then defence ties dependence with Europe (including T129 productions, U212 submarines, much more licenses) should be cut immediately, I am sure it will impact on Turkey. For Turkey, Europe is more important than Middle Easterns or Pakistan.

 

[Kompromat]

Then defence ties dependence with Europe (including T129 productions, U212 submarines, much more licenses) should be cut immediately, I am sure it will impact on Turkey. For Turkey, Europe is more important than Middle Easterns or Pakistan.

defense deals are business matters and can go ahead smoothly. Same applies to Pakistan i guess .

 

[Developereo]

Categoric anti-westernism is not something i find logical.

A muslim bloc is inevitable and it is what im looking forward to see,but it will take time.

I am not advocating anti-Westernism by any means. What I am saying is that a certain ideological group dominates key Western institutions. It is not a secret who is stoking Islamophobia in Europe and North America.

We need to counter that entrenched group -- not an easy task -- and appeal to the better instincts of ordinary Westerners. They have been brainwashed and manipulated, especially during recent decades. People are people, and what has been programmed can be deprogrammed.

I don't believe the concept of a Muslim bloc is viable, given the intense rivalries within, but I do believe that Muslim countries as a whole have a lot of potential. Hopefully, Turkey can provide a role model to inspire the Muslim masses in other countries. The one clear lesson from the Arab Spring is that global communications have changed the game forever. The brutal dictators can bribe and whip, but they are only delaying the inevitable.

 

[lonelyone]

The term of finally realizing is not correct. Everyone knows that they wouldnt let a nearly 80m populated muslim country. Since countries are represented in the parliament in extent of their population,think about the possible power of Turkey in European Parliament. Would they let a muslim nation to run the EU? Of course,not.

But keeping this so called process going on helps us to put the army in its place. Meanwhile,we dont let the EU to go beyond our red lines,such as Cyprus and Aegean Sea.

Btw,i agree that the East is rising but lets not forget that western powers will still have a massive impact on the new world order. Categoric anti-westernism is not something i find logical.

A muslim bloc is inevitable and it is what im looking forward to see,but it will take time.

A Muslim bloc is inevitable, but it must be rational and not like Saudi Arabia or Pakistan. All Muslim countries are coming under pressure from the Wahhabi ideology, in which it is more important to cut off hands than have good education, where all power is handed over to an illiterate "ulema" who just memorize the same book over and over, and expect these idiots to make national policy. It is no surprise that if they win, all Islamic countries will be destroyed. Sensible Muslims must come together to oppose this Wahhabi bloc. Maybe if Iran becomes a bit more moderate, Iran-Turkey can be the vanguard. Then BD, PK, Indonesia and Malaysia will join. But the union is inevitable.

 

[ovarel]

I am not advocating anti-Westernism by any means. What I am saying is that a certain ideological group dominates key Western institutions. It is not a secret who is stoking Islamophobia in Europe and North America.

We need to counter that entrenched group -- not an easy task -- and appeal to the better instincts of ordinary Westerners. They have been brainwashed and manipulated, especially during recent decades. People are people, and what has been programmed can be deprogrammed.

I was not particularly referring to you about the anti-westernism phenomenon. Anti-west rethoric sells in our region. Unfortunately,when i take a look at those guys,they have no progressive program but only complaining about the West. This is one of the problems of the region. Cheap rethoric will not bring any good,it never did. We all have to understand this since i observe this in Turkey too.

I dont think there will be strict blocs anymore like the cold war,even Russia has closer relations with Nato than we think.

Then the question comes in mind: Should/Can we counter them by isolating ourselves from those institutions or should/can we counter them by being a part of them and influencing them as much as we can?

I prefer the second. I think neither the west nor the east can isolate itself from the other. Why not turn this western institutions into universal ones? Is it possible? We will see,nothing is certain.

Jews didnt gain their priveleges by excluding themselves from the west,on the contrary,they looked so pro-west. In reality,all they care was manipulating them.
They definitely know what is "ilm-i siyaset".

@lonelyone
Wahhabism may be good for primitive tribes.

 

[Cerian]

where all power is handed over to an illiterate "ulema" who just memorize the same book over and over, and expect these idiots to make national policy. It is no surprise that if they win, all Islamic countries will be destroyed. Sensible Muslims must come together to oppose this Wahhabi bloc. Maybe if Iran becomes a bit more moderate, Iran-Turkey can be the vanguard. Then BD, PK, Indonesia and Malaysia will join. But the union is inevitable.

If only these Wahhabi thinkers can just look at great thinkers of Islamic tradition that would be their renaissance for sure.

I also don't believe viability of Islamic bloc as it would be, in my opinion, pretty unrealistic. Claims that Europe is a "Christian bloc", based on faith, is unfounded. True that Christian culture is Europe's identity but it doesn't have a dominant characteristic as it have before. But countries who have a majority religion as Islam would cooperate with each other more once their governance become more democratic and open to international community.

 

[Mehmet]

Europeans continue to have nightmares about the Ottoman empire & Greece in fear of the Turk militarized the Aegean in an attempt to reassure herself. Greece has also recently believing that Israel has strategically out maneuvered Turkey signed a mutual defense pact between Gr/Cyprus & Israel not yet realizing that Greece is for us a non threat.

Europeans also still refuse to believe that at our weakest during the Turkish War of Independence we defeated countries that were considered superpowers (Britain, France), middle powers (Italy) and their colonial subjects and allies (Greece, Armenia). We see that on Wikipedia British so called "historians" are practicing historical revisionism trying to remove the shame of Lloyd George's defeat by Ataturk who once famously stated "not a single Turk in Anatolia"; we not only defeated these nations but we destroyed the British myth of the invincible military who after 300 years of bloody conquests finally met it's match at Gallipoli then again 8 years later during our independence war.

Today the Franco-German bankers project known as the EU is fatally bankrupt, seen as snobs throughout the world & despite it's objective to create peace by providing a model of cooperation for all others nations on Earth has been unable to shake it's colonial image of a blood thirsty conqueror who steals resources of other nations to feed it's own voracious appetite. The military arm of the EU known as the Eurocorps is also a joke and toothless unable to coordinate in even basic military exercises requiring large numbers of translators & near impossible coordination.

Turkey who is the 16th largest economy in the world with a population of 75-80 million today is not only one of fastest growing economies in the world but has also started exporting "sound financial advice" to Europe a move that is difficult to digest for arrogant suits of the EU who's favorite past time only a decade ago was poking fun at Turkey and through double talk hide but display their islamaphobia & turkophobia. This proud Turkish nation also has a mighty military that is the only other power in NATO besides the USA who is actually growing it's military & in the words of George Friedman a former spy & now founder of STRATFOR geopolitical think tank "the Turks can defeat the French in an hour & the Germans in an afternoon, it would not be a contest", given the information mr George Friedman would have access to as a spy of the USA it is obvious that he knows something about the Turks that the average Tom, Dick & Harry as well as Turk does not know; a military this powerful is already unnerving for many European nations a new superpower in the form of a Arab-Turk union of some sort will no doubt cause European xenophobia to ramp up to version 2.0.

What many people do not know or simply prefer the current status is that a Muslim majority superpower is something that the entire world could benefit from, please remember that before the USA became accepted as a superpower the Christian world was busy hacking away at each other with constant warfare. The advent of the USA as a superpower gave Christians all over the world a powerful icon to look up to and try and emulate this sadly since the days of the Ottoman Empire does not exist in the Muslim world. The reality is that Muslims around the world feel discriminated against, are oppressed like the people of Palestine, are treated by world powers as 2nd class citizens when it comes to matters that interest non-Muslims (Israel vs Palestine, Israel vs Turkey), get food and/or economic aid that has unfair almost criminal conditions attached or have simply lost hope to such a degree that they feel & know that they have no future.

With no solid symbol to look up to where they can find refuge, voice their concern or organize themselves vulnerable Muslims who do not have or have limited education are easily falling into extremist ideology & becoming fundamentalists, a Muslim super power will remove the largest contributor to Islamic fundamentalism as Muslims would finally have a Earthly beacon of hope.

Turkey is making rapid gains & advancing to what I hope is an Islamic block union similar to that of the EU but with NATO conditions that if 1 gets attacked then all are considered under attack & a central government that recognizes individual member states sovereign borders but plans and coordinates everything else; however before Turkey can achieve this their is still a lot to be done.

The EU can be disappointed, angry & fearful as much as it wants because Europe a continent that lacks energy supplies of her own will one day without a doubt ask loans from the "new kids" on the world stage and the EU's capability to get such loans and at what price will be greatly affected by her attitudes today.