‘Denying Holocaust Does Not Make Good Muslim Or Arab’ ‘The Quran Calls Muslims To Be Just’

[Indischer]

Why, when the Nazis committed real atrocities, whereas Zionists are baselessly accused of doing the same, why, when the Nazis envisioned racist domination, whereas Zionists envisioned a peaceful return to their homeland, would you claim, "there is no difference between Nazis and Zionists"?

For the simple fact that Zionists did not make a "peaceful return to their Homeland".

 

[Solomon2]

I think everybody here can understand that the insulting was first started by you -

There is a difference between a justifiable insult and an unjustifiable one, isn't there?

And this thread is not about me nor the Pakistanis, it is about you claiming nonsense.

Of course, it's about Pakistanis and their nonsense.

I will do a little mass here, 6000000 claimed death toll, that leads to a proximate 600000 per a chamber -

There were multiple camps and each had several gas chambers, and the "Final Solution" was carried out over several years.

Please don't play with numbers, and accept the inflated exaggeration in statistics, bro.

There aren't inflated statistics. The Germans kept records. You won't look, so for you the "exaggeration" is merely a matter of faith, not religion, and not consideration of the evidence.

 

[New]

There aren't inflated statistics. The Germans kept records. You won't look, so for you the "exaggeration" is merely a matter of faith, not religion, and not consideration of the evidence.

Ya ya, you are right, king Solomon.

 

[Solomon2]

For the simple fact that Zionists did not make a "peaceful return to their Homeland".

So the mere fact that the Jews were the victims of murderous violence seeking to defend themselves equates them with the perpetrators of murderous violence.

That's the sort of moral equivalence that many only apply to Jews and never themselves, isn't it? When these are your values you uphold, you know yourself to be an antisemite. If you truly apply them to all, then why don't you prove it by volunteering to switch places with a convicted violent felon in your local jail? After all, he's no worse than the society "outside" who defended themselves by incarcerating him, right?

 

[sur]

...

i think holocaust is highly exaggerated

...seriously 6 millions, seriously....Please don't play with numbers, and accept the inflated exaggeration in statistics, ....

It's habitual ...

:Q:5:41: ...And of the Jews are men who listen much to any fallacy- listen to others who have not come to you. They distort the words from their proper places; they say, "If you are given this, take it, but if you are not given this, then beware!"...

Isn't Quran amazing...

So they want you to believe 6 Million, and they want you to take it... Then "take it". Memorize it. Repeat it.
Otherwise "beware!", you can go to jail for denying it.

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No one is denying death of anyone's Grandparents, Aunts & uncles.
They are just saying numbers are falsified big time.
And they are saying that if Christians in Germany persecuted Jews, WHY Jews are taking it out on Muslims in Palestine.!


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So if someone engages in listening to fallacies and distortions then they are "Jews" in the Koranic sense. Those are the "Jews" you're supposed to be wary of, yes? Whereas someone who merely calls himself a Jew but doesn't deal in fallacies - this person isn't a Jew in the Koranic sense and what he says may be accepted.

Aaammmmm!!! NO!
You misunderstood. It doesn't say so.

It says there are people among them... implied: that's an overwhelming tendency...

...you just slaughtered the story described in 5:1-5:51 by simply quoting one verse.... So sorry to see Quran now in the hands of $hitholes.,... Ignore the rascals who quote holy books out of context.

Mind your language.

And instead of claiming that I slaughtered sth, prove what it is then.!

or should I quote ALL of Quran 5:1-to-51. How would that change the meaning of the verse that I quoted??? Elaborate...! or else your post was just a vomitus.

Enlighten ALL of us here with your correct understanding. I am very open-minded, really, and if you bring forth what I mis-understood or mis-quoted I would correct myself with a thanks. But don't just blabber. Bring it.
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And just to preserve specimen of your mother tongue, below I am quoting the whole post of yours. For future reference...

You can stand on either side of this debate.

But

I beg you not quote single verses from Quran. you just slaughtered the story described in 5:1-5:51 by simply quoting one verse.

This is the most despicable and Shaitani thing to do with any holy book.


This was the work of hypocrites to quote single verses from quran

And sadly Islamists are now worse than hypocrites when quoting Quran.


So sorry to see Quran now in the hands of $hitholes.,



Ignore the rascals who quote holy books out of context.

Thank you

 

[New]

Isn't Quran amazing...

Ya bro, it is really amazing, and I mean it.
And also thanks for the post, that was nice.

 

[Solomon2]

:Q:5:41: ...And of the Jews are men who listen much to any fallacy- listen to others who have not come to you. They distort the words from their proper places; they say, "If you are given this, take it, but if you are not given this, then beware!"...

So if someone engages in listening to fallacies and distortions then they are "Jews" in the Koranic sense. Those are the "Jews" you're supposed to be wary of, yes? Whereas someone who merely calls himself a Jew but doesn't deal in fallacies - this person isn't a Jew in the Koranic sense and what he says may be accepted.

Aaammmmm!!! NO!
You misunderstood. It doesn't say so.

Go on. Tell everyone what I misunderstood and how. After all, if the Koran stands alone, uncreated in time, it must, therefore, have necessary definitions within. Otherwise anyone can take any word to mean anything, and thus render the Koran useless.

 

[Solomon2]

It says there are people among them... implied: that's an overwhelming tendency...

“O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm for Allah, witnesses in justice, and do not let the hatred of a people prevent you from being just. Be just; that is nearer to righteousness. And fear Allah; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do” (Surat Al-Ma’idah 8).

Don't you get it? When all else failed, you resorted to invoking Jew-hatred, even though by your admission it isn't universal, and by Koranic injunction you're not supposed to let that happen.

"And fear Allah; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do”

There are no more prophets, yes? How, then, is the will of Allah to be made known to Muslims that they interpret the Koran in error, save by portents and disasters of the natural and man-made sort? Or do you hold such things haven't happened to Pakistan and all is well?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Also, if the number of Jews killed,after all those studies and researches end, proves to be less than the present assumed figure by half a million or even a million, that does not mitigate the brutal horror of the war crimes the Nazis committed by an inch.

Exactly right.

Quibbling over the exact number misses the point entirely, and doesn't mitigate the tragedy of what happened in any way.

This was the worst war crime possible inl human history and it will remain so till another bigot starts envisioning his own version of "Lebensraum".

Who knows. Even the Soviet Union at the peak of their power could not have mobilized the number of troops that a modernized China or India could.

Things could always get so much worse, which is why it is so important to study history, to avoid repeating the mistakes of the past.

 

[Guynextdoor2]

i think holocaust is highly exaggerated

No one asked you

 

[Mitro]

Did any Muslims help save the lives of Jews fleeing Nazi persecution?

Yes. The case of Albania is interesting to note. Albania is the sole European country with a Muslim-majority population. Albania was the only country in Europe in which there were more Jews after the war than there had been before the war. Before World War II, there were only 200 Jews in Albania, which had a total population of 800,000. After the war, there were many more Jews after Jewish refugees from some half dozen European countries fled the Nazi persecution and sought shelter in Albania.
Among the 70 Muslims officially recognized as Righteous Among the Nations, there are many stories of great courage and sacrifice. These include the Bosnian Dervis Korkut, who harbored a young Jewish woman resistance fighter named Mira Papo and saved the Sarajevo Haggadah, one of the most valuable Hebrew manuscripts in the world; the Turk Selahattin Ulkumen, whose rescue of fifty Jews from the ovens of Auschwitz led to the death of his wife Mihrinissa soon after she gave birth to their son Mehmet when the Nazis retaliated for his heroism; and the Albanian Refik Vesili who - at the age of 16 - saved eight Jews by hiding them in his family's mountain home.

 

[gambit]

So the mere fact that the Jews were the victims of murderous violence seeking to defend themselves equates them with the perpetrators of murderous violence.

That's the sort of moral equivalence that many only apply to Jews and never themselves, isn't it? When these are your values you uphold, you know yourself to be an antisemite. If you truly apply them to all, then why don't you prove it by volunteering to switch places with a convicted violent felon in your local jail? After all, he's no worse than the society "outside" who defended themselves by incarcerating him, right?

Do I need to do a 'Captain Renault' here?

I'm shocked, shocked...

 

[Commander T]

‘Denying Holocaust Does Not Make Good Muslim Or Arab’
‘The Quran Calls Muslims To Be Just’
There is a unique passage in the Holy Quran which talks about the need for all Muslims to be honest and just with all people: “O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm for Allah, witnesses in justice, and do not let the hatred of a people prevent you from being just. Be just; that is nearer to righteousness. And fear Allah; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do” (Surat Al-Ma’idah 8). Being tolerant of difference, and not being influenced by cultural, racial or religious prejudices, I do believe that a good Muslim should always be a just Muslim, especially toward non-Muslims. For example, one of the most controversial issues surrounding current day Muslim and Jewish relations revolves around how to deal with the horrific Holocaust; the large scale Nazi destruction of millions of innocent lives.


This mass murder of millions of Jews between 1941-45 represents one of the darkest periods in human history. In fact, Hitler, the Nazi dictator would have exterminated all Muslims if he was able to do so. To such mad Nazi all non-Germans were less human than the Aryan race. Therefore, denying the Holocaust or attempting to use anti-Semitic discourse similar to what the Nazis used during 1930s and 1940s is very unjust especially if such denial is committed by a Muslim.


We as Muslims, at least according to our holy book the Quran, are supposed to stand by the victims of injustice and racial discrimination. For instance, we as Muslims are not supposed to propagate similar anti-Semitic slogans like fascists or Nazis. Many of the Muslim-immigrants in Europe, who fall victims to racial attacks are usually abused, humiliated and killed by neo-Nazi groups. Therefore, it goes against common sense to feel elated or at least to feel indifferent when some nutcase neo-Nazi or fascist radicals commit horrendous crimes against Jews.


A good Muslim should always be a just Muslim, especially with non-Muslims. What happens today between the Palestinians and the Israelis does not justify commending Nazi murders of millions of innocent people.
As a Muslim, who continually searches for the truth, I find it necessary to acknowledge the following facts about the Holocaust: the Nazis were racists, extremists terrorists who destroyed millions of innocent lives-Hitler was a mad dictator and a dreadful leader who brought destruction to his country-the Nazis murdered millions of Jews just because they are different racially and in religion-it if would have been possible for the Nazis, they would have annihilated Muslims.


A just and a good Muslim does not deny the victims of racial and religious prejudice the right to be remembered. Denying the Holocaust does not make one a good Muslim or a good Arab. Those who do not sympathize with the plight of the innocent or who deny the Holocaust have renounced their humanity.

Khaledaljenfawi@yahoo.com

By Khaled Aljenfawi
‘Denying Holocaust does not make good Muslim or Arab’

according to nazi theory of aryan race.... current day pakistan also accompasses the area where aryan nation spread out..... so by defination we are aryan .... and indeed holocast was one of the darkest part of human history........but the question is are the numbers really correct

 

[gambit]

Ya ya, you are right, king Solomon.

So is IBM...

IBM and the Holocaust: The Strategic Alliance Between Nazi Germany and America's Most Powerful Corporation-Expanded Edition: Edwin Black: 9780914153276: Amazon.com: Books

 

[Pakistanisage]

I have not met anyone who denies Holocaust. Most people believe that a genocide took place but they disagree on the numbers. Most people I know believe that the 6 million number is highly inflated and exaggerated.

Let us do the math. Let us say the World War II with Germany lasted 5 years or 365 x 5 = 1825 days

If 6 million Jews were massacred that means 6,000,000 / 1825 days = 3288 jews were killed each day non stop every single day.

Or in other words 3288/24 = 137 Jews killed every hour for five years non stop every hour around the clock for 5 years.

The numbers don't add up.