Delegation to Morocco to promote JF-17 & participate in Air Show

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Thunder in Morocco

Sexy beast

Guess the order

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• 36

 

[MastanKhan]

retarded efforts will start from the east to block the sale through crying, bribes and blackmail.


trying wont hurt. at least we wont bicker over missing the chance to present our product.
on other part, it will provide cheap laughs to our neighbours who suffer acute lack of self confidence & obsession against us

Hi,

Make the deal so good---that they cannot refuse it----. You have to give something to take back.

 

[Zarvan]

Hi,

Make the deal so good---that they cannot refuse it----. You have to give something to take back.

For that to happen we need to integrate AESA in JF-17 fast and also may be increase hard points in upcoming JF-17

 

[MastanKhan]

For that to happen we need to integrate AESA in JF-17 fast and also may be increase hard points in upcoming JF-17

Hi,

Hard points is not an issue with this size of aircraft---the aesa will be eye popping for many a nations.

 

[optimisticlad]

Hi,

Hard points is not an issue with this size of aircraft---the aesa will be eye popping for many a nations.

we are not good deal negotiator.......
To make things happen at global arena, you need to be smart in negotiations..

 

[Irfan Baloch]

Hi,

Hard points is not an issue with this size of aircraft---the aesa will be eye popping for many a nations.

Zarvan wants the best there is that money can buy for everything that is defence related for Pakistan.
in principle I admire such thinking but looking at the JF-17 program.. it goes against its mission statement which was to build an affordable but capable plane.. point being AESA alone will be the biggest outlay and bump the price of the aircraft by significant amount?(an average ASEA may carry round about 1500 or more modules each costing upwards of 2000.. meaning the entire system maybe 3 or 4 million) .. unless if we work with china to come with a budget version of an AESA .. this should be taken off the list.

 

[Shabi1]

Zarvan wants the best there is that money can buy for everything that is defence related for Pakistan.
in principle I admire such thinking but looking at the JF-17 program.. it goes against its mission statement which was to build an affordable but capable plane.. point being AESA alone will be the biggest outlay and bump the price of the aircraft by significant amount?(an average ASEA may carry round about 1500 or more modules each costing upwards of 2000.. meaning the entire system maybe 3 or 4 million) .. unless if we work with china to come with a budget version of an AESA .. this should be taken off the list.

Even with the price hike from AESA and other enhancements the JF-17 will still be very economical compared to the competitors. Also no rule that you can not buy Block-2 configuration even when Block-3 is out, depends on customer budget and requirement, can be tailored.

The JF-17 is not a low tech fighter, marketing should change mindset and instead of emphasizing cheaper should highlight how high tech it is. It doesn't compromise on technology despite the lower price tag.

PAF buysJF-17s because its pride of Pakistan since its a home grown fighter, cant be replicated for other operators. JF-17 marketing teams need to learn from SAAB and create awareness on feature, capabilities and what it can do. Look at Grippen ads, the aircraft is similar to JF-17, yet perception is so much different..

 

[Cool_Soldier]

Difficult to enter in a new market but we have to make a way in .Sooner or later more orders are waiting for JF 17 specially after J17 B (Twin seat) which is coming in a year as production has been started.

 

[MastanKhan]

Zarvan wants the best there is that money can buy for everything that is defence related for Pakistan.
in principle I admire such thinking but looking at the JF-17 program.. it goes against its mission statement which was to build an affordable but capable plane.. point being AESA alone will be the biggest outlay and bump the price of the aircraft by significant amount?(an average ASEA may carry round about 1500 or more modules each costing upwards of 2000.. meaning the entire system maybe 3 or 4 million) .. unless if we work with china to come with a budget version of an AESA .. this should be taken off the list.

Irfan,

That low cost thing by the Paf----was just for show---. They wanted something that they could rely on---and a promise of low cost made the people happy.

Now that they have achieved that goal----the target is to increase the potency of the aircraft by a multitude----which means Aesa---Irst---jammers and targetting pods---Off bore sight WVRs---and premium BVR's.

So---as long as the price stays under the 30 million a pop range---it is a wonderful addition.

The aesa that could fit into this aircraft maybe in the range of 750--950 T/R modules because of the size of the nose cone.

The thing is---that you have a HONDA CIVIC LX now----you can keep it that way---or you can make it into a CIVIC SI.

Also the thing is that you cannot keep the current format of electronics on the JF17---that will just defeat the total purpose of manufacturing this aircraft---.

Aesa and IRST are a force multiplier---these are basically STEROIDS for the aircraft.

What do you say @Indus Falcon @Khafee

 

[MastanKhan]

Hi,

The explosion in capturing electronics technology in a miniscule of a space ( 100th of a space in comparison ) has revolutionized each and every industry and every machine in the world.

The same has happened in the fighter aircraft / bomber industry---where an ordinary aircraft can be given the powers to be extraordinary by installing the appropriate electronics and related packages.

Just think about it this way----15 years ago---a 1000 yards rifle shot was extraordinary---25 years ago---it was an exception----35 years ago----there were hidden rumors of who could shoot a 1000 yard kill----.

Today---everyone can---you can buy off the shelf rifle with 600 yards MOA with the right ammo and scope----to make a 1000 yard hit----have an appropriate scope and the right ammo and you may have a 3 round hit at 1000 yards in a .308---unheard of 10 years ago.

Even a 59 years old like me is thinking of buying the Remington 700 VSF 26" fluted barrel in .308 caliber so that I can take a 1000 yards shot---.

The same thing has happened with the fighter aircraft industry.

Remember---it is the AK47 moment in the history of warfare---a time for another great equalizer---for those who understand what that means.

 

[Shabi1]

Going to post a google translate that I copied from another post, the Chinese text was provided by a Chinese member, just put through translate.

"It is generally believed that the JF-17 radar aperture of about 600 mm, can support about 800 T / R modules, domestic X-band T / R modules can provide about 10W of peak, 2W average power, that there is JF-17BLOCK3R phased array radar source average power can reach about 1.6KW, taking into account the active phased array can be achieved superimposed and synthesized in space, the actual power may be higher, compared to under the general mechanical scanning radar as AN / APG-68 the average power is only 300W, the Indian Air Force combat capability of the strongest Soviet -30MKI, its average power BARS radar only about 1KW, even BARS aperture radar antenna aperture is larger than the JF-17, but considering the latter active phased array win on power loss, so the JF-17BLOCK3 radar detection distance is still higher than the SU-30MKI.
It is noted that according to the Pakistan Air Force to say, in addition to SD-10A air missiles, they also plan to introduce more advanced SD-10B active radar guided air to air missiles, according to the Pakistan Air Force statement SD-10B uses "Active / Passive guidance system "and" the new rocket engine "- may be the latest Chinese PL-15 missile above double pulse rocket engine, compared with the SD-10A, its greater launch envelope, can suppress the Indian Air Force currently equipped R-77E and two MICA active radar guided air to air missiles, so the JF-17BLOCK3 who, by virtue of a combination of active phased array and SD-10B, and can suppress the existing three generations of Indian Air Force combat aircraft, and with the gust such a confrontation of three generations of combat aircraft capability.

Source: https://defence.pk/threads/major-changes-ahead-on-jf-17-block-3.394767/page-17#ixzz479Ilyovd"

 

[Khafee]

Irfan,

That low cost thing by the Paf----was just for show---. They wanted something that they could rely on---and a promise of low cost made the people happy.

Now that they have achieved that goal----the target is to increase the potency of the aircraft by a multitude----which means Aesa---Irst---jammers and targetting pods---Off bore sight WVRs---and premium BVR's.

So---as long as the price stays under the 30 million a pop range---it is a wonderful addition.

The aesa that could fit into this aircraft maybe in the range of 750--950 T/R modules because of the size of the nose cone.

The thing is---that you have a HONDA CIVIC LX now----you can keep it that way---or you can make it into a CIVIC SI.

Also the thing is that you cannot keep the current format of electronics on the JF17---that will just defeat the total purpose of manufacturing this aircraft---.

Aesa and IRST are a force multiplier---these are basically STEROIDS for the aircraft.

What do you say @Indus Falcon @Khafee

Absolutely. No two ways about it.

 

[Quwa]

Irfan,

That low cost thing by the Paf----was just for show---. They wanted something that they could rely on---and a promise of low cost made the people happy.

Now that they have achieved that goal----the target is to increase the potency of the aircraft by a multitude----which means Aesa---Irst---jammers and targetting pods---Off bore sight WVRs---and premium BVR's.

So---as long as the price stays under the 30 million a pop range---it is a wonderful addition.

The aesa that could fit into this aircraft maybe in the range of 750--950 T/R modules because of the size of the nose cone.

The thing is---that you have a HONDA CIVIC LX now----you can keep it that way---or you can make it into a CIVIC SI.

Also the thing is that you cannot keep the current format of electronics on the JF17---that will just defeat the total purpose of manufacturing this aircraft---.

Aesa and IRST are a force multiplier---these are basically STEROIDS for the aircraft.

What do you say @Indus Falcon @Khafee

If possible, it would be see some work with Aselsan to develop a rock-solid DRFM-based EW/ECM suite for the JF-17 Block-III. Aselsan clearly has the competency to pull it off, no? PAF might prefer a system from China (absolute security since China has zero incentive letting critical information leak to the U.S. or India), but for export, getting Aselsan involved might be a good idea.