Def.pk op-ed: Mutual Blackmail, ETO for Afg, Pak and Ind

[VCheng]

Pakistan can always not accept. What can we blackmail India with anyway?

Of course Pakistan can do that. And please don't get hung up on the word "blackmail" as I tried to explain the context above.

Knee-jerk reactions aside, having a US-backed ECO will work to Pakistan's advantage in increasing its leverage in the region, thereby alleviating the present weakness to some extent, and more importantly, preventing a steady slide downwards of influence for Pakistan.

Yes, Pakistan's deteriorating economy is a huge issue, to quote that famous phrase, "It's the economy, stupid!" (no offense intended).

 

[Developereo]

@Developereo : But before 9/11 happened India & Pakistan were under US sanctions, we did not figure as a priority on their strategic agenda it was only after that the US made Pakistan a major non-nato ally and the 'war on terror' started.

The US has been concerned about China since the 60s. At some point, probably after the Soviet implosion, they decided to bet on India as the counterweight.

 

[VCheng]

The US has been concerned about China since the 60s. At some point, probably after the Soviet implosion, they decided to bet on India as the counterweight.

USA and China are each others' biggest trading partners. They have already elevated their "friendship" to the higher level of mutual blackmail!

India and China's level of "friendship" will soon exceed $100 billion annually.

Therein lie important lessons for Pakistan too, if anybody cares to take a real deep look.

 

[Developereo]

USA and China are each others' biggest trading partners. They have already elevated their "friendship" to the higher level of mutual blackmail!

India and China's level of "friendship" will soon exceed $100 billion annually.

Therein lie important lessons for Pakistan too, if anybody cares to take a real deep look.

None of which lessens their mutual animosity and political machinations. I am sure you haven't missed the American statements and actions to shore up military alliances around Australasia to contain China.

Similarly, when the US asked India to jump ("look east"), India said how high? (Vietnam oil drilling)

Bottom line: the US has decided that it's strategic interests lie with India. If Pakistan gets involved, it won't be as an equal partner, but as an expandable asset.

 

[lem34]

So what do you think those Chinese interests are, and how would they be affected by the ECO proposed above, if at all?

America wishes to contain china. America wishes to use certainly india against china and poss others in the region. No empire othen brits to US have ever changed hands without war. That was cos of germany. But americans in 1935 were making plans to fight brit empire. So i cant see america gracefully accepting a new order in the world

---------- Post added at 04:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:21 PM ----------

China will never let Pakistan and India to get close or dependent on each other.

why dont india make more of an effort and get closer with pakistan and china. I would encourage that if i was in a position to do so so that we could have peace to the benefit of entire neighbourhood. perhaps iran could be dragged in too. America has no right to dictate to our neighbourhood

 

[Roybot]

None of which lessens their mutual animosity and political machinations. I am sure you haven't missed the American statements and actions to shore up military alliances around Australasia to contain China.

Similarly, when the US asked India to jump ("look east"), India said how high? (Vietnam oil drilling)

Bottom line: the US has decided that it's strategic interests lie with India. If Pakistan gets involved, it won't be as an equal partner, but as an expandable asset.

ONGC videsh has been involved in Vietnam for over a decade now.

IOC-ONGC alliance in petchems likely| December 1998

Benefits by year-end on ONGC investment in Vietnam | February 2001

ONGC :: Archives |Consumers In Vietnam Receive ONGC Videsh Gas| December 2002

ONGC :: Archives | ONGC Videsh Realises US$ 100 Million from Vietnam Project| January 2005

 

[Rafi]

Our future lies with a strategic partnership with the PRC, militarily, economically, culturally, diplomatically - the indian establishments only wish is to subjugate us.

 

[VCheng]

Our future lies with a strategic partnership with the PRC, militarily, economically, culturally, diplomatically - the indian establishments only wish is to subjugate us.

So, in other words, subjugated to China?

 

[Rafi]

So, in other words, subjugated to China?

Of course not, we have received a lot more than we have given in the strategic relationship with the PRC, that is a fact - whereas india does not want a relationship based on sovereign equality.

 

[lem34]

So, in other words, subjugated to China?

better than being subjugated to america. would you say UK is subjugated to america? these things happen.

 

[VCheng]

Of course not, we have received a lot more than we have given in the strategic relationship with the PRC, that is a fact - whereas india does not want a relationship based on sovereign equality.

China is with Pakistan as long as its national interest mandate it to be so. Pakistan should be ready for that mandate to be compromised in due course.

better than being subjugated to america. would you say UK is subjugated to america? these things happen.

I wish to see Pakistan not be subjugated at all, no matter which country is doing the subjugating.

 

[Vimana]

The US has been concerned about China since the 60s. At some point, probably after the Soviet implosion, they decided to bet on India as the counterweight.

In the military sense many countries are concerned with the rise of China as they are spending $100bn a year on defence. Even the Russian's see a potential future China as a competitor for it's arm's market. It is no coincidence India has adopted the look East policy and engaged with the likes of Vietnam, Japan and Australia to maintain a balance with China.

 

[cyphercide]

The core area of disagreement between India and Pakistan was never Afghanistan to begin with,it's just more fuel to the fire.Unless the root areas of disputes gets resolved,no amount of economic guarantees are bound to work especially considering once the United States realizes it has no point of leverage on influencing India's posture.

Hence it can be summarized that the United States is going crawl back to Pakistan to at least ensure it's regional interests aren't pushed on the back-burner by China and India's corporate ambitions in Afghanistan.By the looks of it,It's already infuriated that the vast mineral reserves that were explored and discovered first by American entities are possibly going to go China,India and quite possibly to Russia and the UK.One can be assured that the Yanks aren't going to watch their "assets" are going to be given away to foreign powers.That's where Pakistan can offer it's regional presence for placating the United States.

 

[VCheng]

The core area of disagreement between India and Pakistan was never Afghanistan to begin with,it's just more fuel to the fire.Unless the root areas of disputes gets resolved,no amount of economic guarantees are bound to work especially considering once the United States realizes it has no point of leverage on influencing India's posture.

Hence it can be summarized that the United States is going crawl back to Pakistan to at least ensure it's regional interests aren't pushed on the back-burner by China and India corporate ambitions in Afghanistan.By the looks of it,It's already infuriated that the vast mineral reserves that were explored and discovered by American entities are possibly going to go China,India and quite possibly to Russia and the UK.One can be assured that the Yanks aren't going to watch their "assets" are going to be given away to foreign powers.That's where Pakistan can offer it's regional presence for placating the United States.

Hence my contention, like it or not, India is a player in Afghanistan.

 

[cyphercide]

Hence my contention, like it or not, India is a player in Afghanistan.

Might be so but does India wield any significant leverage on either Afghanistan or the United States? It's doubtful to state the least.Unless the United States puts it's considerable weight exclusively behind India and Pakistan for tieups,it's a hairy situation for each party concerned.

Pakistan already has a way out of it,It can offer to exclusively protect Chinese interests in Afghanistan which is not going to go down well with the Americans.Hence,the most likely outcome is a stalemate amongst all.