De-radicalisation plan under study

[Abu Zolfiqar]

the other best de-radicalization strategy would be to use funds for what they are intended for......

and allotting barely 2% on education and concurrently doing nothing about population growth -- is this not a disaster in the making? It's time that the govt gets rids of its elitist mentality and deals and serves the poor first. The rich will always be rich, regardless of whether they pay taxes or not. Less than 2% of budget on education is absolutely absurd; it has been criminal negligence.

 

[TARIQ BN ZIYAAD]

Assalam alaikum

Start ker lo jitnay marzi programm, so u can say to ur masters in west let's form the next govt. so we finish our programms.

corruption karo, khulli choot, foriegn bank accounts bharo khulli choot, make life like hell khulli choot and start a programme which u will never finish like u.s war on drug lol

TARIQ

 

[muse]

Tariq

Why would you oppose such programs? And since when are you against foreign accounts? Don't you have accounts in arabia?

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

the war on drugs is failed because no matter how much money put into it, there will always be a demand for drugs

ideally, there shouldnt be a steady demand for terrorists; there should be a demand for good schools and infrastructure only.

 

[TARIQ BN ZIYAAD]

Assalam alaikum

I might have in arabia and some other countries bcoz i was born outside pakistan studied and worked and visited many countries with my own earnings not by loot.

Where did i oppose any plan? and u wanna tell me these guy r serious in any sort of activity accept bank bharo plans?

TARIQ

 

[NeutralCitizen]

De Radicalistion of Pakistan first Remove the blasphemy law and most of the laws Zia implanted, Pakistan can be a Muslim democracy without the Blasphemy laws, Next Invest more in Education, get Imams from Turkey or Bangladesh who are much more peaceful then the Saudi funded Imams, three ask China for more Help in Counter terrorism, Seal the Afghan-Pakistan Border, clamp down on Radical mullahs and finally get rid of the Kalashnikov culture in pakistan.

 

[NeutralCitizen]

Or you could just let China take over Pakistan and De Radicalize the Society like how they did the Uighur's.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

contrary to popular belief, we have Imams in Pakistan who are qualified and fit to preach true Islam as it is in pure form; may they have the courage to step up and assume the role.....

our image took a major beating when our own religious affairs ministry was caught up in corruption (Hajj scandal). As if things couldnt be worse than for pious people to be caught red-handed in shady dealing and funds mis-allocation.


as for the rest of your post -- couldnt agree with you more...

your subsequent post is just immature trolling.. Refrain from that, or you will be dismissed.

 

[muse]

Assalam alaikum

I might have in arabia and some other countries bcoz i was born outside pakistan studied and worked and visited many countries with my own earnings not by loot.

Where did i oppose any plan? and u wanna tell me these guy r serious in any sort of activity accept bank bharo plans?

TARIQ

So foreign accounts are Ok, then? right?

And you know this plan is a continuation of the army plan for de-radicalization - are you suggesting that this program is designed to fill the pockets of army officers and politicians?

 

[Mughal1]

I think any program is flawed unless we have real sense of real problems and a real program that at least is workable in theory in solving the facing problems.

Our real problems are religion for theocracy and secularism for justifying capitalism or market economy ie both very harmful for mankind because both are oppression, suppression and injustice based.

The real solution lies in islam as was pointed out by creators of pakistan. The ideology of pakistan is not just for pakistanis alone but for the whole wide world as an example to follow. The world is polarized between abusers of mankind and their victims. This is what two nation theory is all about. Victims are saying to their abusers enough is enough let us live in peace but the abusers are keep coming after them.

This is the basic real problem and the solution is in accepting the plea of victims. Victims want better word for themselves and others but abusers want betterment for themselves at the expense of all others. It is a fight for freedom from this abuse that has been taking place through out history of mankind. This struggle cannot be stopped so long as abusers continue creating victims by their abuse by means of misuse of power and wealth.

It is very stupid of people who support religion and secularism against humanist values. If a human is not working for the good of mankind then such a person is enemy of humanity. Democracy is a game between rich and powerful nothing to do with solving problems that face real human beings in the real world.

People can buy votes and that is what they are doing. They have created under class globally by negative competition then declared war on the poor instead of poverty. These are hard facts impossible to deny. They are trying to put blame on this and that rather than where it belongs. This is another trick to mislead masses by making them fight each other in confusion.

The best solution to human problems is close cooperation between all people on a win win game plan. Nothing else can work and nothing else has ever worked against this idea. Cycle keeps repeating we keep making same mistakes each time.

Divide and rule has no solutions but only problems which followers of all such ideologies cause for all the rest of masses locally, nationally and internationally. It is result of negative actions taken by some against others and then reactions by others.

Day by day we are creating more and more victims and losers and winners are ever decreasing in numbers. Our simple solution is animalistic survival of the fittest. In that case we have law of jungle so what are we complaining about? By that standard taliban are doing nothing wrong at all. After all their interest is in doing what they see fit to survive.

A rule or law based on double standard is no law at all that deserves obedience. The quran explains only and only this very fact throughout. This is why the idea of two nation theory. Muslims= people working for real peace in the world and kafirs= people working for wars. All because such people have no respect for divine rule of law which gives all equal rights and responsibilities against each other. That is why that is truly the rule of law for mankind to follow. No chance of peace till quranic terms for peace are accepted by all internationally. All because none can produce any terms for peace even equal to quran never mind better than quran.

 

[araz]

I think we need a whole new rethink on the way Pakistan is going to go. We need to hold a referendum on what the people actually want. Firstly we need to clear the confusion that exists about whether we are an ideological or a secular state. If we are ideological and it needs a referendum to convincingly prove it, then we need to implement a system that suits our national identity. We then need to progress from there. Till such time that we have conformity of views on this there will be no progress and the rut will just be glossed over to re emerge in another form. However , in my view the Government itself is the biggest culprit, as it just wants loop holes in the system to manipulate and consequently loot the country. At the end of the day it is the people that have to wake up and boot the Government out and get some one in who they can rely on.
Araz

 

[muse]

On One hand the Pakistan army is employed against those who use islamist ideology to justify terrorism and on the other peole are asking for a referendum, presumably the islamist terrorists will also participate - Khair

It's a not a rethink, it's a rollback... but no need to fret - the govt as usual, has it's head up it's azz

Govt’s ‘de-radicalisation’ plan sans PPP input



By Muhammad Akram

LAHORE: The proposed de-radicalisation plan to combat rising fundamentalism and extremism in the country, discussed at a recently held meeting of the Defence Committee of the Cabinet, has turned out to be a plan that exists only in official files or in the complete control of the bureaucracy since the PPP-led coalition government has yet to take up the matter with the party for its input on this important matter, informed party sources told Daily Times on Friday.

A number of important party office-bearers expressed their surprise over the existence of any such plan, saying that they have yet to come across any such proposal that was reportedly discussed at the Defence Committee of the Cabinet.

All but Sindh PPP General Secretary Taj Haider sought anonymity after expressing their unawareness on the matter. Senator Taj Haider, however, said the reported matter need to be explained further as it involves very sensitive matters, and that though it is an important matter the party has many other important matters to deal with. He was of the view that the term de-radicalisation of the country required to be taken in the perspective of the growing extremism in society, which is though a matter of prime concern, yet not debated in full with all those who really matters.

Former Punjab PPP general secretary and Policy Planning Committee member Prof Ijazul Hasan told Daily Times that the country needs de-radicalisation on many fronts, including the swaying fundamentalism and extremism allowed to nourish by the successive military regimes, particularly from 1977 to 1987 by Gen Ziaul Haq to prolong its dictatorial rule under the garb of Afghan war.

The society has yet to come out of the psychological shocks it was given by the state apparatus during military regimes and the establishment-controlled democratic rule.

He recalled that only six months ago he and certain other members of the civil society had been part of an exercise to study the de-radicalisation of society in terms of bringing reforms in the madrassas, allowed to mushroom during the last three decades.

To a query, Prof Ijalul Hasan maintained that besides de-radicalisation of other spheres of society the country needs to work hard on over two million madrassa students which holds the key in the success of any such plan meant for de-radicalisation of the country. Madrassas reforms, he stressed, is one such key area that need to be looked specifically to put the country on the path of normalisation and striking balance among various thought processes in society.

Matters such as de-radicalisation of society are seldom discussed at party forums, opined a former PPP central office-bearer, saying the organisation of the party was never structured on these lines except for few early years of its creation in 1967.
He was of the view that despite odds the party still holds the capacity to accelerate the process of de-radicalisation of society if intelligentsia and academics are involved to address the party workers in every nook and corner of the country.

The PPP leader who had been part of the party’s central information cell said it is high time for the leadership to exploit this potential of the party to bring about a real change in the matters such as de-radicalisation of society by engaging all those who had been part of the party for reasons other than grabbing power by hook or by crook within the party and in the government.

The political pundits are of the view that given the federal structure of the party and a force that carries somewhat ideological thinking can play a decisive role in defeating the radical forces in the country, if given a chance. They were of the view that the war on terror, that is being carried out by the party-government despite having a marginal or no say in the formulation of country’s security and foreign policy still a force to reckon with to defeat the ideology of extremists and fundamentalists in society by exploiting the reasons of the very existence of the party, now in its mid-40s.

 

[muse]

Obituary of liberal-secularism — I
By Ayesha Siddiqa
Published: August 20, 2011

ayesha.siddiqa@tribune.com.pk

The government seems inclined to launch a countrywide de-radicalisation campaign. Seemingly, the inspiration was an army-organised seminar in Swat to showcase its de-radicalisation campaign for which Rs6 million were sought from the Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa government. The event brought together military men, politicians, journalists and academics to ponder over ways to de-radicalise the country.

But this may be too little, too late, as liberal-secularism is almost dead. Radicalism is going to be the future of a country where the religious and political right are increasingly gaining strength and followers. It’s the emerging culture in which the battle-lines will be drawn between ‘us’ and ‘them’ on the basis of religion and a specific interpretation of religion. While post-modernist academics have infested national and international universities and are trying to popularise the radical right-wing narrative as representing the people’s popular instinct, the fact is that these academics base their analysis on elite ethnographies. Moreover, they forget that radical views acquire the arrogance of divine sanction and thus are difficult to counter.

Besides the religious parties, radicalism is now nested in all mainstream political parties such as the PPP, all versions of the PML and the MQM as well. The intellectual base of some of the top leaders of all political parties is the Jamaat-e-Islami (JI). They might have shed the affiliation but not the thoughts. Similarly, we have a significant portion of the media which is affiliated or sympathetic with the religious right. To top it all, the fashionable post-modernist narrative is inherently right-wing. The Pakistani post-modernist academics are in the process of creating a narrative that will eventually replace any existing liberal narrative which, in any case, is scant.

The issue here is not of militancy but radicalism. While militancy translates into violence against pockets of people, radicalism destroys a society internally. It forces people to think of those who do not subscribe to their religious interpretation as being the ‘other’, which results in segregation and ‘ghettoisation’ of a society. While we remember Ziaul Haq’s dark era, we forget how radicalism spread in the country during the 1990s as a social movement denoted by organisations such as Tableeghi Jamaat and al Huda. Moreover, while the so-called liberals were happy that the Jamaat-e-Islami and other religious parties did not gain much in the elections, the influence of the religious right sneaked into the society at all levels. Today, even the begums of elite families are connected with al Huda-type movements. For example, the Leghari household reportedly invites al Huda to hold an annual milad ceremony for the wives of their political workers. How much more elite and fashionable could this get?

Nevertheless, it’s only the liberals who are reputed to be elite mainly due to their failure to connect with people across the socio-economic spectrum or offer a pluralistic political, social and religious narrative. The protest of the begums of Islamabad in 2008 against the going-on in Lal Masjid is a case in point. Another problem is that the liberals are ill-equipped to deal with religion in a religious ideological state. As a resultant, they can’t gather people behind them with the same force as the radicals. Sadly, the liberal elements have tried hiding behind the argument that radicalism has no future due to the preponderance of the Sufi culture without understanding that the essence of Sufism is against all forms of injustice and not just religious bigotry. Nor do people realise that the machinery that operates Sufi culture now suffers from major problems and lacks an alternative to counter the post-modernist radical narrative.

But can we even imagine fighting radicalism on the basis of a flawed historical narrative? Reportedly, some senior retired military officers at the Swat seminar were indignant about the idea of recognising that they had a hand in creating the jihadi Frankenstein. The alphabet of terrorism in South Asia starts with Pakistan fighting someone else’s war during the 1980s at its own expense. Dictator Zia opened the doors to Afghan refugees, weapons, drugs, jihadis and all sorts of intelligence agencies. The jihadi proxies were never discarded, not even now. Can de-radicalisation work when jihadi outfits and the support structure remains intact? Who says that hundreds of murders later leaders like Malik Ishaq, Masood Azhar, Hafiz Saeed and others will change?

And can radicalisation be countered without recognising that we can’t ‘have our cake and eat it too?’

 

[TARIQ BN ZIYAAD]

Assalam alaikum

Why not to have a referendum to get out of the mess ? or may be u r afraid of the results
Pak foj is fighting them coz a coward by the name of musharraf got us into this situation and if we have a referendum pak foj will have the moral support of the whole country now we r confused and split in our opinion.

After all since the ww2 in many countries specially in south america and central fighting factions held elections againt each other and they fought each other for many years ( daniel ortega i can remember ) in nicaragua.

TARIQ

 

[muse]

Miltants’ ideology
By Editorial
Published: August 20, 2011



It may be a bit of a stretch to say that the militants who have declared war on Pakistan have anything resembling a coherent ideology but the release of an audio recording gives a glimpse into their savage world view. The conversation is apparently between a militant and a religious scholar who works for the army. In it the militant explains how killing civilians in mosques is acceptable if they are hypocrites who do not buy into the militants’ ideology. Coincidentally, this recording was released around the same time that nearly 50 people were killed while offering Friday prayers at a mosque in Jamrud on August 19. The militant in the recording also explains that he sees no distinction between Pakistani and US soldiers and defends the killing of women and children.

This recording should be an eye-opener for those who maintain that the militants are simply fighting the Pakistani state because of its closeness to the US. Rather, they are seeking to violently impose their version of Islam on the entire country. Anyone who does not buy into their beliefs is considered a legitimate target. What is most telling about the recording is its complete disregard for the sanctity of life. The militant welcomes the 2005 earthquake for killing thousands of military personnel but does not pause to consider that it also took hundreds of thousands of innocent lives. If there is one lesson to be learned from this recording, it is that you cannot negotiate with people so blinded by hate that they are willing to murder at will and without thought.

Even more than the militant’s twisted understanding of religion, what is more worrying is that he had this conversation with an employee of the army. We have frequently heard about the radicalisation of the army and here we seem to have proof. Although the scholar frequently challenges and disagrees with the militant, that is not enough. The army needs to explain why one of its employees was in contact with a militant. We are supposed to be at war with the militants, not discussing the finer points of religion with them on their own terms. And the war, we should always remember, has been declared by the militants, not us.